Official Languages Committee on May 9th, 2023

[Arielle Kayabaga, Liberal, London West, ON]

Okay.

Mr. Desruisseaux, since you intend to strengthen the reception capacities of francophone minority communities, what measures are you putting in place to do so?

[Alain Desruisseaux]

We talked briefly about promotional activities. All of our settlement and integration efforts are aimed at ensuring that there are poles of attraction, that the host communities are well prepared and that the conditions are in place to ensure the success of newcomers.

A great deal of progress has been made since the implementation of the francophone immigration strategy. Funding for francophone communities in Canada for the settlement of francophone immigrants has increased from $39 million in 2019 to $53 million in 2020 and to $72 million in 2022.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Desruisseaux.

I'll just reiterate to the witnesses that if they have any documentation to support their answers, they can send it directly to our clerk.

Before I move on to the next questioner, I would like to inform the committee that I am on the clock for the vote, and that there are 25 minutes and 42 seconds left. When there are about two minutes left, I will let you know, don't worry.

Our next speaker is the second vice-chair of the committee.

Mr. Beaulieu, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Thank you to the witnesses for being here.

I would like to know if there is anything planned regarding francophone immigration to Quebec.

[Alain Desruisseaux]

As far as francophone immigration to Quebec is concerned, for us, the framework remains the Canada-Quebec Accord.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Okay.

Will anything be done? There's a risk of robbing Peter to pay Paul. Since the pool of francophone immigrants isn't unlimited, if you work hard to welcome more francophone immigrants outside Quebec, isn't there a risk of receiving fewer in Quebec?

We know that francophone or francotrope immigration to Quebec is crucial. This is the main reason there has been a slight increase in language transfers to French, which are now tending to level off.

[Alain Desruisseaux]

The accord provides a framework for co-operation between the federal department and its Quebec counterpart. This co-operation is excellent, and there have been discussions about the risk you mentioned. We must remember that we are dealing with the international Francophonie. We are talking about a pool of 350 million people. The Quebec government has been very active and effective for many years in terms of promotion. In short, there is a lot of collaboration with the Quebec government in the field. It's something we're watching closely.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

However, there is nothing concrete yet.

[Alain Desruisseaux]

Mathematically, you're right. We target the same clientele. However, it seems that the planet is sufficient for the different levels of government. It's an ongoing dialogue.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

We'll have to see.

There was an article in La Presse that talked about the fact that Quebec is trying to attract more French-speaking immigrants, and the federal government is trying to attract them to outside Quebec, and that this creates a conflict. At the federal level, express entry is the platform for selecting newcomers. In Quebec, it's Arrima, which we're told isn't very well connected. The article in La Presse seemed to blame Quebec, but lawyers told me that it was rather the opposite.

Without wishing to blame anyone, I don't know if anything is planned in this regard. We're also told that francophones have an advantage in applying outside Quebec because the federal government gives 50 more points to those who speak French. They have a better chance of being accepted, whereas in Quebec, you have to have the Certificat de sélection du Québec, which makes the process a little more complex. So, basically, there's nothing planned in this regard.

[Alain Desruisseaux]

In accordance with the Canada-Quebec Accord, Quebec is in charge of the selection process. In my opinion, just like the federal government, the Quebec government can put forward facilitating measures. I don't have the details of the article we are talking about.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

Some people tell me that many newcomers are tempted to move outside Quebec because they think it's easier and faster to obtain permanent residence or citizenship. We'll see what happens, but it's certain that anything that might harm francophone immigration to Quebec will accelerate the decline of French, not only in Quebec, but across Canada.

Charles Castonguay has conducted several studies on francophone immigration, assimilation and the movement of Quebeckers outside Canada. We know that language transfers to English increase with each census, outside Quebec and even in Quebec now. If newcomers settle outside Quebec and become rapidly anglicized, it is like pouring water into a leaky bucket.

Is there any data on the situation and on language transfers? Have you evaluated these factors or do you plan to do so?

[Alain Desruisseaux]

Yes, such data exists, but I don't have it. I know that data on interprovincial mobility is more difficult to obtain, but we do have data that provides good indications on retention. We could provide that to you.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I'd like you to send them to us, yes.

The Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada tells us that a target of 4.4% of francophone immigration isn't enough. Do you plan to increase the immigration thresholds?

[Alain Desruisseaux]

In the policy being developed, we're doing the groundwork to ensure that the department will comply with the new requirements set out in Bill C-13, which commits the department to developing the necessary measures to ensure that the demographic weight of francophones is restored and that the way is paved for growth.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Desruisseaux. We can come back to this.

There are 19 minutes left before the vote.

Ms. Ashton, you have six minutes.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Thank you, and thank you to the witnesses.

Mr. Desruisseaux and Mr. Jacques, I'd like to talk about targets as well. We know that, according to the FCFA's studies, a 12% annual rate of francophone immigration outside Quebec is needed to reverse the decline of French and revive the francophone economy. What means are you giving yourself to succeed in exceeding the target of 4.4% of francophone immigration outside Quebec in Canada?

[Alain Desruisseaux]

I beg your pardon. I misunderstood the last sentence of your question.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

What means are you giving yourself to succeed in exceeding the 4.4% target for francophone immigration to Canada from outside Quebec, since we know that it is essential to exceed it in order to reverse the decline of French?

[Alain Desruisseaux]

Essentially, we're in the process of developing a policy that will provide a framework for all measures and give teeth to the 2019 francophone immigration strategy that I referred to. It's about making sure that it's consistent with the commitments in Bill C-13 and that we can develop measures.

You've seen the announcements in the Official Languages Action Plan 2023-28. That gives a good idea of some of the measures that will follow. However, the policy will essentially put forward measures that will cover the entire continent in immigration, measures to promote Canada internationally. I mentioned the settlement program and the francophone integration pathway. So we want to make sure that—

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

I know you've already touched on this, but let's talk a little bit about recruitment and the work that needs to be done on the ground.

In its report on francophone immigration, the Senate recently recommended increasing resources for visa offices in sub-Saharan Africa. We also know that Cameroon represents a pool of many more potential francophone immigrants, yet the Canadian embassy that provides visa and immigration services is in Senegal.

Do you intend to add these services in Yaoundé, Cameroon? What's your plan to increase the number of offices and open new ones in sub-Saharan Africa?

[Alain Desruisseaux]

Mr. Jacques, do you want to answer that question?

[Olivier Jacques]

In terms of processing applications, we can rely on the entire network of 60 offices that the department has set up abroad, as well as the offices established in Canada, so we don't have to rely on offices in sub-Saharan Africa or Africa generally to ensure we meet the targets set by the department.

Adding resources does help facilitate the process. As I mentioned earlier, we've added resources in sub-Saharan Africa, and we've also created offices, but I'd like to emphasize an even more important element, which is the need to act as an integrated network. It allows us to spread out the workload and make sure that we meet the targets set by the government.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

It's nice to say that you're going to work in an integrated way, but the targets we have in front of us are very ambitious.

Specifically, are you going to add points of service to process visas and immigration applications at the Cameroon embassy, for example? Is that part of your plan?

[Olivier Jacques]

There are no plans at the moment to add resources in Yaoundé, Cameroon. We plan to use the office in Cameroon for printing visas and promoting immigration outside Quebec, and we'll rely on all IRCC offices to process applications.