Evidence of meeting #46 for Transport, Infrastructure and Communities in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was employees.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:30 p.m.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
--of things as your operations dictate they be conducted in order to be profitable and safe.
4:30 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
Exactly. And we do not control the release of the audit, so that's not something that we have any--
4:30 p.m.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
But you're aware that phase one, that draft report, the one you first saw before the audit was conducted, said that over half of a large sampling of CN locomotives had safety defects--over half of them--and that they all had the potential for causing a derailment, injury to a person, or property and environmental damage.
4:30 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
That's one of the reasons we went back and forth on with Transport for the final audit, which we still have some concerns about. But it's their report.
4:30 p.m.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
In that final audit, Mr. Marshall, there is something that's disturbing. In addition to what Mr. Fast said, it also indicated that over 45% of the mechanical employees who were aware of the process didn't believe it to be effective, as safety concerns were not always dealt with on a timely basis. So the question of time and the seriousness with which you dealt with all of those concerns would be very important, I would think.
But as I say, what is really disconcerting is that as of November 2005, the audit team had discovered 99 notice and order items listed that you had not complied with, and 24 of them dated back to 2000. Transport Canada gave you N and Os, and five years later there was no action on them.
4:35 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
I'm sure you're familiar with the notice and order process. There is a process to be followed there. You mentioned time, and safety issues are addressed. The notice and order process might allow that enough time to go.
There are many aspects that I think need to be recognized.
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
Mr. Marshall, people around this table--and I guess anybody else who is interested--would say five years is a long time.
One of the orders that CN received was not to have more than 80 cars on a train going through those sections of British Columbia that the three members from British Columbia just pointed out. And yet following the incident of the derailment at Lillooet, witnesses said there were many more than the 80 cars that you had been ordered to limit yourself to.
4:35 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
That was at Lillooet?
4:35 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
There was one car.
4:35 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
I was at Lillooet. There was one car.
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
4:35 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
No, I understand. It's incorrect, and that's probably why we're here: to make sure we have facts on the table. I appreciate that.
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
Thanks.
The audit says that it recognizes that you're trying to make an effort.
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
I want to be balanced. I note, though, that it says in your annual report that your safety, environment, and security committee met only four times during the year.
But the audit says there is a disconnect between senior management, who claim to be committed to safety and who feel that CN has a positive philosophy, and the front-line employees and supervisors who feel safety is often compromised.
Is there a communication problem between your stated intentions and your employees' ability to deliver on that?
4:35 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
I don't believe so. Again, I would--
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
Do you think the Transport Canada audit team doesn't know what it's doing? I mean, they're your regulators.
4:35 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
I understand that.
I think we work very hard. I know we work very hard to continue to drive that safety message--
4:35 p.m.
Liberal
Joe Volpe Liberal Eglinton—Lawrence, ON
If we're being tough on you, it's because we want you to project a good image to the public. We'll give you an opportunity to answer.
4:35 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
The committee serves a purpose, and we're here to help you in your pursuit of that purpose.
4:35 p.m.
Senior Vice-President, Western Region, Canadian National
Do you mean about the communication?