Veterans Affairs Committee on Feb. 23rd, 2009

[Rob Clarke, Conservative, Desnethé—Missinippi—Churchill River, SK]

I have no further questions.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Sweet]

Mr. McColeman.

[Phil McColeman, Conservative, Brant, ON]

If I might, I want to pick up on the question, I believe from Mr. Stoffer, about the dependants and the survivor benefits. Can you say what the average survivor benefit would be for a family, or dependants or survivors?

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

These are benefits provided to the families. Surviving spouses, orphans or direct descendants are entitled to these pensions at the time of the soldier's death. This pension is also provided to the partners of a civil solidarity pact; this is not a marriage, but a union between two people that we refer to as a civil solidarity pact.

There are two survivor spouse pension rates. There is what we refer to as the reduced reversion rate. If the disabled soldier was receiving a pension at a rate of between 60% and 85%, this would be the disability rate. There is also a regular rate, if the soldier were pensioned at a rate in excess of 85%. The disability rate is taken into consideration in calculating the pension to be reverted to the spouse. Anything beyond 85% is considered a normal rate and is fully reversible.

Surviving spouses aged 50 and under who have few resources can also have the pension increased. We refer to this as an exceptional supplement, and every year the resource level of this individual is subject to a review. It is only the trésorier-payeur général, the paymaster general, who can decide whether or not to grant this increase.

We also have orphans' pensions, which are paid only if no survivor spouse pension is paid, namely, in the case where the spouse has deceased, remarried or divorced from the soldier and where there is a survivor or orphan resulting from a different relationship. This payment expires on the 21^st birthday of the orphan, unless the latter is disabled or unable to look after him or herself, in which case the pension will be paid for the remainder of this individual's life.

In a nutshell, this is a brief description of the pensions and the payment of pensions to the spouse or children. If you would like, I can provide you with this document, which gives an itemized description of the provisions that I have just described to you.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Sweet]

Merci beaucoup, Colonel.

Mr. Andrews, five minutes.

[Scott Andrews, Liberal, Avalon, NL]

Thank you.

Earlier you mentioned that your National Office of Veterans and Victims of War administers retirement homes for elderly veterans. I wonder if you could explain a little more about the retirement homes themselves. Is there a waiting list to get into these homes? What level of care do the veterans get in these retirement homes?--I assume it's different from a hospital setting. I believe you also cooperate with other public and private retirement homes across France. What levels of funding do you provide to private or other public institutions for beds and residences for veterans?

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

The document was referring to eight retirement residences administered by the Office National des Anciens Combattants et des Victimes de Guerre, the ONAC. These retirement residences are run entirely by the state, and as such, they provide benefits equivalent to those provided by other retirement residences in France. Of course, the retirement residences are obliged, to some extent, to provide services.

There are 660 beds. Clearly, this number is not adequate to meet the needs of veterans. Some of the veterans must therefore go to the private sector. The medical services, reception and standards are not any better in the private sector, but sometimes this is the only way to find a bed.

An agreement between the retirement residences that are fully subsidized by the ONAC and private retirement residences enable us to find beds, but do not afford any significant cost benefits. This agreement simply makes it easier for us to get access to beds. I am not convinced that all of the retirement residences in France are able to accommodate the needs of all French citizens.

So the number of beds is limited both for veterans and society in general. The benefit of this agreement with the private retirement residences lies primarily in the fact that an individual can go to the top of the list and not have to go through the normal procedure. But there again, it is the veterans who have to pay for the cost of these private retirement residences. To my knowledge, no subsidy is offered if an individual is not able to obtain a bed out of the 660 reserved for pensioners.

[Scott Andrews, Liberal, Avalon, NL]

Thank you.

Also, the National Office of Veterans and Victims of War is very active in advocating to young people about the sacrifices made by veterans. Could you explain some of that office's activities and how it encourages young people to remember those who have fought in war?

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

These are media activities organized by the Office National des Anciens Combattants, in particular the Oeuvre Nationale du Bleuet de France, which is quite special. There is a tradition of supporting victims of conflict, and the opportunity is taken to speak not only to young people, but also to the French public in general, about veterans' needs. Using television ads and poster campaigns, the initiative raises awareness about the problems faced by veterans and receives spontaneous donations from the public. It helps young people understand veterans, whom it serves as a charity.

As for remembrance and young people's understanding of veterans, I described in my introduction the objectives of at least the programs of the Department of Veterans Affairs. I first spoke about recognition and compensation, and we have talked about this assistance. However, there is also the arms and nation program, which has a specific budget to create awareness among French youth of the needs of our veterans and the assistance available to them.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Sweet]

Thank you, Colonel.

Thank you, Mr. Andrews.

Now for five minutes, Mr. Lobb.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Thank you very much, Colonel, for attending today.

In regards to training, I had a few questions about that. I wonder if you can give us a little more detail about the training and the different types of programs, in trades and so forth, that you provide to your veterans.

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

These are veterans, wounded soldiers and those who cannot continue to provide service. The training is aimed first and foremost at helping them look for work in another department. So the skills could be used within the public service but also in the private sector. These retraining centres are for people who cannot work in their occupation because of some disability. It covers almost all public service positions, by department. Some positions are reserved for veterans. There is no limit in terms of access, as long as the skills are applicable. But when someone is retrained for work in the public sector, it is mainly in much more traditional occupations that require lower skills, without meaning to be pejorative. These areas include building construction, electricity and other work that helps communities.

Retraining focuses on helping people find work again either in their own department or in another department in areas reserved for those whose disability does not prevent them from carrying out their duties. So the retraining centre make this transition easier; these people upgrade their skills to be assigned to positions and generally do not have to compete for them.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Thank you.

For those who are disabled due to their service, for whom those jobs would not be appropriate due to, say, a paralysis or some other form of disability, would there be a time limit imposed on their training, or would they be trained to the full requirement to be able to perform, say, computer science or computer programming—those who would be disabled, unable to walk or perform physical duty?

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

There is no timeframe for the retraining. From what I have read, the transition takes place within a set period. It is not as if someone had to learn completely new skills that had nothing to do with his or her training. I do not think that people can just pick any skill set they want, regardless of the cost and time involved. We unfortunately have to take into account cost effectiveness, and the retraining needs to happen within a reasonable time. We have to look at the cost and the time involved.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Sweet]

Thank you, Mr. Lobb. Your time is up.

Monsieur Gaudet.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Colonel, I want to come back to my question. Do people have to have been wounded physically in order to receive the disability pension?

For example, someone who goes to Afghanistan comes back with mental problems. In Canada, we call that post-traumatic stress syndrome. Do you have those kinds of cases in France?

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

Yes. The wounds do not have to be physical in nature.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

No.

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

We include psychological and pathological problems that are related to the operation that the person has come back from. That is clear.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Do they have the same rights as those who come back disabled, for example, having lost an arm or a leg?

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

Yes. In terms of pension rights, a distinction is made between physical wounds and mental or psychological illness following traumatic events in the theatre of operation. There are indeed two categories covered by these pension rights.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

I want to come back to a question you were asked earlier. For example, if a 20-year-old man joins the army and retires after 25 years, is he entitled to a pension?

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

An immediate pension? No.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Immediately...

[Col Jean-Michel Verney]

No, if he has not been injured.