Bill C-293 (Historical)

Official Development Assistance Accountability Act

An Act respecting the provision of official development assistance abroad

This enactment sets out criteria respecting resource allocation to international development agencies and enhances transparency and monitoring of Canada’s international development efforts.

DEVELOPMENT ASSISTANCE ACCOUNTABILITY ACT

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

moved that Bill C-293, An Act respecting the provision of development assistance abroad, be read the second time and referred to a committee.

Mr. Speaker, this is an important bill which I hope we will have the opportunity to debate thoroughly over the next hour and that members will see fit at the end of the hour's debate to support the bill. It is a bill about accountability and transparency, favourite buzzwords of members opposite. The bill is a challenge to the government to come good on its rhetoric.

In the last Parliament the foreign affairs committee moved the following report:

We are writing to urge you to introduce legislation which establishes poverty reduction as the aim for Canada's Official Development Assistance (ODA). A legislated mandate for Canada's ODA would ensure that aid is provided in a manner both consistent with Canada's human rights obligations and respectful of the perspectives of those living in poverty.

I submit that Bill C-293 does exactly that.

We are not, however, simply urging more dollars be spent. Those dollars must also be spent effectively and in ways ensuring more accountability. In our view, this legislation should include an unequivocal statement of purpose that poverty reduction is the central lens through which Canada's aid program should be delivered. Key elements of a legislated mandate must include mechanisms for monitoring; accountability and reporting to Parliament; and enhanced public transparency. Such legislation would increase the effectiveness for Canada's aid contribution of aid spending, a more focused accountable approach to more and better aid.

That was the 12th report of the committee. When it submitted the report, it referenced a letter that was signed by the then leader of the opposition, now the Prime Minister, the then and current leader of the Bloc Québécois, and the then and current leader of the NDP.

Subsequently, the House adopted the 12th report of the committee, and referred to a letter signed by the then leader of the opposition, the leader of the Bloc Québécois and the leader of the NDP.

I am quoting directly from the letter:

To accepting and to act upon the near-unanimous recommendations of Committee witnesses--

It is not just the committee's report. It is based upon the near unanimous recommendations from the witnesses who appeared before the committee from 2003 to date. It goes on:

--to honour the Millennium Development Goals and to commit immediately, through a plan, to increase Canada’s aid budget by 12 to 15% annually to achieve an aid level of 0.5% of Canada’s Gross National Product by 2010 and 0.7% of Canada’s GNP by 2015;

The letter also says:

To improve our aid effectiveness by strengthening the partnership with civil society, both in Canada and overseas;

To introduce legislation prior to the next federal budget which establishes poverty reduction as Canada's Official Development Assistance (ODA) goal, as outlined in the historic February 17, 2005 letter from all Opposition Leaders to the Prime Minister, to ensure that aid is provided in a manner consistent with Canada's human rights obligations and respectful of the perspectives of those living in poverty.

This bill cannot be about more aid as that would require a royal recommendation, but it can be about better aid, more focused aid. I respectfully submit that is exactly what this bill is about.

This bill cannot deal with an increase in development aid as this requires a royal recommendation. However, this bill does deal with improving development aid.

The scheme of the bill is to set up an advisory committee which shall advise the minister of his or her development assistance. The committee will hold a candle, so to speak, to the ODA proposals and ask the minister three questions. The first and most important question is, does the ODA contribute to poverty reduction? The second question is, does it take into account the perspectives of the poor? The third question is, is it consistent with Canada's international rights obligations?

The idea of this bill is to bring focus to poverty reduction consistent with Canadian values, foreign policy and international human rights standards.

The purpose of this bill is to concentrate on reducing poverty and promoting compatibility with Canadian values, foreign policy and international human rights standards.

At one level it may be argued that this bill is so vague that one could drive a Mack truck through it. On the other hand, one could expect that the government, or more accurately the department, would probably say that it hamstrings the minister.

It could be argued that the bill is too vague to carry out the changes required to improve development aid. For its part, the government, specifically the department, will attempt to show that the bill will handcuff the minister needlessly.

My argument is that it does neither. It does not hamstring the minister and it is not so vague as to be useless. I am trying to ensure that our ODA is not merely flavour of the month. It seems to me that if the committee were to force the minister to justify his or her proposed aid in light of the three questions I read, it would actually help the minister avoid the flavour of the month pressures.

Any minister, whether a Liberal minister or a Conservative minister, has all kinds of requests for ODA. Every request seems to be more compelling than the last request. In my view, the minister now has the perfect response and the perfect response is this legislation. Effectively, ministers would be able to say that they are legislated by this bill to answer three questions before this advisory committee. They, therefore, cannot divert their ODA money to things such as security interests, anti-terrorism initiatives or other foreign policy initiatives no matter how worthy.

Canada cannot be all things to all people at all times. From time to time others have made the observation that from time to time we are frequently nothing to everybody. From time to time we have depleted our budgets on peripheral issues and not been as effective as we could have been or should have been.

We know that civil society is crucial to the delivery of aid. If it were not for organizations such as World Vision Canada raising matching funds and developing donors, our effectiveness would diminish substantially. That is why Bill C-294 has received such wide support.

The Canadian Council for International Co-operation and my friend Gerry Barr have been of tremendous help. Literally dozens of letters and dozens of e-mails testify to the importance of the bill. In fact, quite a number of my colleagues over the course of this day and previous days have come up to me and said that they support this initiative in part because of the letters, e-mails and telephone calls that they have received.

Bill C-293 is at the top of mind for many Canadians and many Canadian organizations. There are 178 MPs in this House who signed the reduction of poverty initiative, making poverty history. They signed a much more comprehensive document. One element of that comprehensive document had to do with accountability for aid. The are 178 MPs that appear on the face of it to be behind this initiative. Behind those 178 MPs are literally thousands of Canadians.

Bill C-293 also enjoys the support of the NDP. The hon. member for Halifax has a similar bill and I assume she will be speaking in favour of this bill. The member for Prince Edward—Hastings of the Conservative Party has a bill of similar nature and principle which tries to achieve the same purpose. I am given to understand that the Bloc may also have a similar bill for consideration shortly.

We also have the report of the foreign affairs committee and the concurrence of the House in the last Parliament. Finally, we have a letter sent to the former Prime Minister signed by all three opposition party leaders including the current Prime Minister.

Where is the resistance? I think we would find some bureaucratic resistance to this private member's bill calling for transparency and accountability. Clearly, it limits bureaucratic ability to direct aid, aside from an accountability to this committee.

There will be arguments that it requires a royal recommendation to give a per diem to committee members. God forbid that we should offer to pick up the expenses of these self-sacrificing Canadians.

Then we will hear bureaucratic-speak such as “We need to get this right and we need to do this carefully”. That is bureaucratic code language for “Let us bury this private member's bill in la la land in the hope that Parliament will dissolve prior to royal assent”.

Then we will hear arguments like “We do not like petitions from non-citizens telling us that aid is being given in a fashion inconsistent with the purposes of this act”. Heaven forbid that the recipients of the aid should actually have some say about how it is being used.

Then we will hear arguments about the definition of aid, whether we should use the OECD definition or a made in Canada definition. I can just see Stephen Lewis rolling his eyes as we speak saying something like, “Oh my goodness, people are dying and you are arguing about definitions”.

There will be other arguments, some even sincere and frankly would lead to an improved bill, but mostly the arguments from the government's side will be designed to sideline the bill. It seems to me that a government that prides itself on transparency and accountability is being supremely hypocritical by not supporting this bill.

I would like to end by quoting from a report called “Establishing a legal basis for Canada's official development assistance”, written by Vicky Edgecombe in January 2005. She ends her report, which I would recommend for members to read, in this fashion:

If legislation regarding Canada's ODA were to incorporate the above-mentioned recommendations, it would help to set Canada apart as a leader among OECD nations. In effect, it would demonstrate that Canada is serious about addressing global poverty as the overriding development objective in the 21st century.

I therefore leave members with this question. Does Canada want to be a leader on this issue or does Canada want to be a follower?

[Tom Lukiwski, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Minister for Democratic Reform]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. On Wednesday you invited comments on whether Bill C-293 requires a royal recommendation.

This is a separate matter from the stated purpose of the bill, which all members would agreed, that foreign aid should support international development and the values of freedom, democracy, the rule of law and human rights abroad. However, the bill as drafted raises important procedural issues.

Clause 6 would oblige the Minister of International Cooperation to establish an advisory committee for international development cooperation. Subclause 6.(3) states that the committee shall consist of up to 20 members. Subclause 6.(7) provides that the members will be paid remuneration and expenses for their services in amounts that the minister may set. These provisions have financial implications.

On February 8, 2005 the Speaker ruled on a similar case in which additional commissioners were added to an existing commission. In particular, Bill C-280, in the 38th Parliament, which provided for additional appointments to the Canada Employment Insurance Commission, was found by the Speaker to require a royal recommendation.

Bill C-293 would create an entirely new committee and the appointment of its members would similarly require a recommendation. I note that in the February 8, 2005 ruling the Speaker stated:

Where it is clear that the legislative objective of a bill cannot be accomplished without the dedication of public funds to that objective, the bill must be seen as the equivalent of a bill effecting an appropriation.

I note that clause 7 of Bill C-293 would provide for any resident of a developing country to petition the committee outlining the deficiencies in Canada's development, seeking corrective action, and require the committee to process that petition. It would also require the minister to respond to that petition stating:

--any corrective action required by the competent minister and the period within which the action shall be taken as well as the facts and reasons on which the competent minister’s decision was based.

This means that in addition to the remuneration of the advisory committee members, Bill C-293 would cause new expenditures in two ways.

First, a new advisory committee, and the support of that committee, would be an entirely new function not authorized under existing legislation.

The committee would clearly require funding in order to fulfill its statutory responsibilities, which would include: receiving, recording and forwarding petitions, in subclause 7.(2); making any examinations and enquiries necessary to monitor ministers' replies to petitions, in subclause 7.(6); and preparing and submitting annual reports to the minister, in clause 8.

Second, the bill would impose new statutory responsibilities on ministers, which would require new expenditures, including: sending an acknowledgement and reply to the petitioner and the committee, in subclauses 7.(3) and 7.(4); and creating and submitting reports which are newly required by this legislation, in clauses 9 and 10.

The Speaker has, in past rulings, emphasized that a royal recommendation is required for a new and distinct expenditure which falls outside existing departmental responsibilities.

I submit that Bill C-293 would create a new statutory requirement for monitoring ministerial decisions on development assistance through petitions and for legislatively required responses.

I would note that Canada currently provides development assistance to over 150 countries. Creating an advisory committee allowing any resident of those countries to petition the government and requiring the Minister of International Cooperation to provide a detailed response to such residents would mean significant changes which would have important financial implications for the government.

In addition, the statutory requirement for the Minister of International Cooperation and the Minister of Finance to prepare reports on their activities and operations under this bill would be an entirely new function as some of those reports would be on activities newly required by Bill C-293.

The government supports the use of international development assistance in reducing poverty abroad and improving international human rights.

However, as I have indicated, the bill as drafted has financial implications which require a royal recommendation and, therefore, the bill is not procedurally in order.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Mr. Speaker, as predicted in my speech, the government will try to derail this bill, and of course, this is the first salvo in its exercise.

It is a premature point of order, I respectfully submit, since the Speaker is not obliged to make a ruling until this bill arrives back in the House. So all of the comments, some of which might even have a scintilla of merit, are entirely premature and can be dealt with at another time in another place. I would respectfully ask you, Mr. Speaker, to rule this point of order out of order.

[Paul Szabo, Liberal, Mississauga South, ON]

Mr. Speaker, it is interesting to have the member's opinion but the fact is that the bill can be repaired either at committee or at report stage. Right up until the end of third reading the minister can walk into the House and provide a royal recommendation, in which case the Speaker will not be not be making a final determination until the end of third reading.

Notwithstanding that the member would like to rule it out of order, it is not in his purview and therefore it is not a point of order.

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, it is profoundly disappointing to think that some of the most important collaborative work that I have seen happen in this Parliament and at the Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Development could be reduced to procedural points of order so totally designed to derail this important debate.

As has already been pointed out, this matter of a royal recommendation does not have to be ruled on until the bill comes back to the House for third reading. More important, this is a very destructive attempt to ignore the fact that government members have already been told in committee that the sponsors of the two identical bills that are before us have indicated that they would be extremely open to amendments that would deal with the problem that has now arisen. This is a pure obstructionist tactic.

[Dan McTeague, Liberal, Pickering—Scarborough East, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I want to make it abundantly clear that I support the comments made by the member for Mississauga South and the advice you gave at the outset of this session that royal recommendations would be stayed until at least third reading. I understand the position taken by the government. I sat in that position not too long ago. We did not have a problem with this issue.

I think the House should be guided by the wisdom of your initial decision, Mr. Speaker.

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

I thank all members for their submissions. I understand that the Speaker has taken many of these arguments into account. He has already indicated that a definitive ruling on the procedural admissibility of this bill will be made before the question is put at third reading.

Given that today's debate is about the second reading of the bill, the matter may proceed.

The honourable Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of International Cooperation.

[Ted Menzies, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of International Cooperation]

Mr. Speaker, the member for Scarborough--Guildwood and I have had some deep discussions about this issue and he knows full well that most members, if not all members in the House, feel very strongly about the need for Canada to make a commitment to helping people less fortunate than us. We would like to see this go forward.

However, in an honest response to this private member's bill, it raises some very serious questions. I respect the fact that some of the NGOs and very respected NGOs have played a part in drafting this private member's bill. My great concern is that it does not address the participation and involvement of those NGOs that this government would like to see. In my view this was completely left out.

Could the member comment on why that very critical part of the delivery of aid was left out of this private member's bill?

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Mr. Speaker, with respect to the appointment of the committee, there is no restriction on who the minister may appoint. The minister may or may not appoint representatives of NGOs. It is entirely up to the minister at the time. I am not quite sure whether that addresses the specific question.

If the member is asking whether there are any restrictions on NGOs to deliver aid, if the ODA goes through the committee and meets the three-fold test that I talked about on the reduction of poverty, there is no restriction on any NGO being able to participate in that. I cannot see how the bill would be restrictive in any fashion to any NGO, either operating or contemplating the operation, as long as the ODA meets the three-fold test.

The member has acknowledged the huge support in the House for this bill and I would encourage the hon. member to consider letting the debate collapse so we can get it to committee and discuss these points on a more intimate basis, shall we say.

[Betty Hinton, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Veterans Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, I would like some of the member's thoughts on accountability. The bill refers to the “competent minister”, an “advisory committee” which will advise the minister in the exercise of his or her powers, and “development assistance”, meaning official development assistance as defined by the OECD.

With all these layers of responsibility and direction, who does the hon. member see as being accountable under the bill?

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Mr. Speaker, any minister who is responsible for delivering ODA would be an accountable minister. On the face of it, it would be the CIDA minister because the CIDA minister delivers most of the aid for the government.

However, the Minister of Finance also delivers aid in a certain manner as well. His ODA deliverables have to flow through them. Frankly, there are other ministers who do deliver small envelopes of ODA and they would be the accountable ministers. We phrased it that way because we did not want it limited to the CIDA minister.

The second issue has to do with the OECD and it has a longstanding definition of what constitutes poverty, which is the definition we adopted. I am a little open on that idea, although I am a little worried that if we change definitions to in house definitions that those in house definitions will be stretched and the gut purpose of the bill will be circumvented. If the gut purpose of the bill is poverty alleviation, then I do not want to use definitions to effectively circumvent that issue as well.

[Ted Menzies, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of International Cooperation]

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the opportunity to respond to the proposals in Bill C-293, an act respecting the provision of development assistance abroad.

Development assistance is an integral part of our international policy and the government places a very high priority on ensuring its effectiveness and efficiency and increasing accountability for results.

As an early demonstration of our commitment to international development assistance, the government has already increased Canada's international assistance budget by $320 million in the budget of 2006.

Development is a unique challenge and success requires vision, long term programming and the careful management of programs for country-wide improvements. It also requires support for change, strengthening governance, respect for the law and human rights.

Canada is recognized as a leader in the development community. To continue to lead, we must ensure that real results from our assistance flow to poor people in developing countries.

We need clear and precise objectives for Canada's development assistance program. In addition, we must provide clear direction for all government departments and agencies involved in disbursing Canadian development assistance and ensure coherence across government so that we speak with one voice and deliver one coordinated development assistance program.

I congratulate the hon. member for tabling a bill that focuses on the reduction of poverty and sustainable development. However, while Bill C-293 is well intentioned, it does not adequately address the issues to which I have referred. In fact, Bill C-293 would undermine Canada's ability to set its own agenda for its development assistance program.

It does that in several ways. First, under clauses 3 and 4 of the bill, it clearly states that development assistance is defined by the development assistance committee of the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development. While Canada is a proud member of the OECD and respects internationally agreed upon definitions for development assistance, any definitions to be legislated must be wholly Canadian.

Second, Bill C-293 would require the government to establish an advisory committee that would provide advice to the Minister of International Cooperation, as well as review and report on Canada's development assistance program. However, the advisory committee is flawed.

The mandate of the committee would place it in an unavoidable conflict of interest. For example, the committee is to advise the Minister of International Cooperation on the exercise of his or her power and then subsequently review and report on its own advice. This is a conflict of interest.

Furthermore, the government is committed to increasing accountability for all of its programs and it is essential that any organization, body or individual with authority or influence over government programs be held accountable, especially to Parliament as the final custodian of accountability for the Canadian people. The proposed committee demonstrates no such accountability.

Third, the bill establishes a formal process for individuals in developing countries to petition the Government of Canada directly should they believe that the development assistance being provided to their country is inconsistent with the purposes of the act. To formalize in legislation such a petition process would be costly, complex and cumbersome.

We currently have systems in place to address concerns that foreign citizens may have, either directly to our ministers or through our missions abroad.

The legislation would not only undermine Canada's sovereignty, but it would escalate administrative and financial costs and lengthen the time between consideration and approval of projects and programs and their actual implementation.

There are likely to be hidden costs, both in time and in money, associated with the establishment of the advisory committee, the petition system and the reporting requirements. The impact of these arrangements on programming within developing countries is real. The impact on aid effectiveness could only be detrimental.

This government is committed to working with developing countries to give them and their citizens the tools they require to address their development needs. To this end, we are embarking on a process to renew partnership programming. Through their linkages with the citizens of developing countries, Canadian non-state actors from civil society and the private sector have provided a bridge to the ultimate beneficiaries of Canadian aid.

This initiative aims to: first, clarify the role and contribution of Canadian partners to international development; second, examine aid effectiveness principles; third, strengthen accountability and results in partnership programming; and fourth, reflect Canadian values in international development cooperation.

This government recognizes the value and the expertise that Canadians have and can provide in our efforts to help the world's poor. This minister is working to ensure that they play a significant role in Canada's development assistance policy. In addition, we are looking at mechanisms to strengthen accountability and transparency and will ensure that they are consistent with the federal accountability act that is currently before the House.

We welcome the spirit and the intent of Bill C-293, but the bill will fail to deliver what is required: a clear focused mandate for Canada's development program, a well-defined accountability for those charged with delivering that mandate, and the ability of Canada to work directly with our developing country partners to set an agenda that meets their needs and respects the wishes, desires and trust of the Canadian people. This is a flawed bill put forward for good reason and we recommend to the House that it not be adopted.

[Caroline St-Hilaire, Bloc, Longueuil—Pierre-Boucher, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to take part in today's debate on Bill C-293, an act respecting the provision of development assistance abroad.

The basic purpose of this bill is to ensure that international assistance is used to eliminate poverty, which the Bloc Québécois fully subscribes to. We feel it is essential that the principle of eliminating poverty be enshrined in law.

Furthermore, I want to remind hon. members that last November we introduced Motion M-308, calling on the previous government:

[to] increase Canada's international assistance through a commitment firstly to increasing in a stable and predictable manner amounts for government development assistance ... and secondly by enshrining in law that the mandate and purpose of government development assistance is poverty reduction.

International assistance is a major issue and a daunting challenge. The Bloc Québécois has always been in favour of a greater and more effective increase in development assistance. What is more, with what is currently happening in various corners of the globe, where millions of people have been rocked by natural disasters, unending political conflicts, famine and the spread of deadly disease, we must act and Canada has the means to do so.

It is obvious that in a context of increasingly serious and persistent needs, international assistance must be allocated fairly, but must also be allocated in a way that is maximized, effective and sustainable.

There must also be greater transparency in how assistance is managed. Indeed, in her February 2005 report, the Auditor General of Canada raised some shortcomings in CIDA's management, namely in the verification and transparency of the assistance allocated.

The more effective the assistance, the greater the chances of reducing poverty and achieving the UN Millennium Development Goals, to which Canada is a signatory.

We have often pointed out in the House of Commons that one of the ways to fight terrorism is to intensify cooperation and more specifically international assistance. Poverty is the most significant weapon of mass destruction on the planet. It is also fertile ground for terrorists, which is why it is so important to increase international assistance and to promote solid and effective cooperation.

However, this assistance has to be used for humanitarian purposes and not for national security purposes. Since the events of September 11, 2001, there seems to be some pressure on countries to allocate some of the assistance they receive to security measures and to fighting terrorism. These objectives are highly commendable, but international assistance is not the right vehicle.

For example, the Canadian Press reported recently that if Afghans want to receive Canadian aid, they have to cooperate with national and military forces to protect their village. Imagine, we are in effect asking the civilian population to take up arms, and we are blackmailing them to boot.

The CIDA projects were not created for these purposes. The funds must be used to rebuild Afghanistan and provide the people with a livelihood.

There are other examples of aid projects that are not meeting their intended objectives. Take Palestine, for example. Much of the money intended for the Palestinians is being withheld by Israeli banks, which deprives the population directly.

When the ministers of Foreign Affairs and International Cooperation withdrew Canadian aid from the newly elected government of the Palestinian territories, the agreement was that the Canadian government would keep on providing humanitarian aid to the Palestinian people through UN agencies and non-governmental organizations. Only direct aid to the new government was to be suspended. But the reality is quite different. Aid to NGOs is being maintained, but evidence suggests that it is not reaching its destination.

An entire population is being held hostage. Not only do the Palestinians live in a very difficult political situation, but they also have serious problems making a living. Many young people cannot even go to school anymore. Canada is helping to mortgage future generations.

The Bloc Québécois denounced the Canadian government's position, deeming its decision premature.

We all agree that we need to take a cautious and strict attitude toward Hamas, but we have to honour our commitments of humanitarian aid to the Palestinian people.

We stigmatize everyone working directly or indirectly for the Palestinian government, but that does not make them terrorists. We must distinguish between those who live in Palestine and those who live for terrorism.

The Bloc Québécois believes it is vital to be certain that aid is really being used efficiently and for the purposes for which it is given.

Bill C-293 attempts to correct these problems by giving any resident of a developing country who believes that the development assistance being provided to that country is inconsistent with the purposes of this act the opportunity to make a petition in writing to an advisory committee specifying the deficiencies to be corrected. These two parts of the bill should be subject to in-depth analysis by the parliamentary committee.

I am concerned about the mandate, the composition and the cost of setting up and running this advisory committee. I am also concerned about the role of parliamentarians.

With respect to petitions, I am somewhat puzzled as to how useful this provision would be and exactly how it would be used. As worded, the provisions in the bill require the advisory committee and the minister to follow up on such petitions. That is fine.

However, returning to my two previous examples, this means that several millions of people could technically complain, all at once, about the misuse of Canadian aid, since it clearly indicates “a resident”. That also means that, between the time when the petition was sent, when the minister replied and indicated the corrective action he intends to take, and the time when any action will actually take place, several months will have gone by and several thousands of people will likely die in the meantime. Malnutrition shows no patience with young children, nor does an epidemic, not to mention other the other problems they face.

I am not at all convinced that the use of petitions is appropriate. Would it not be preferable for CIDA to respect its commitments and to take the necessary measures to ensure close follow-up of the projects and their effectiveness? That agency already has the structure in place to fulfill that role. Someone will have to convince me that this is the best possible way to help these people and to ensure the effectiveness of aid.

Furthermore, I would like to underscore the importance of subjecting all forms of aid to international standards in terms of human rights, another fundamental aspect of international cooperation. We must also apply the principle of sustainable development. If we want to eliminate poverty, we must do so with a sustainable, long-term vision.

I would now like to turn to the crux of the matter, namely the budget for humanitarian aid. In the past, we asked the previous government several times what it really intended to do to bring the amount of aid to the level required to meet the millennium development goals.

One might agree with the principle of a bill to enshrine poverty reduction as the ultimate purpose of international aid, but that is not enough. We must ensure that all millennium development goals are addressed and met. The word “poverty” therefore has to be interpreted in the broadest sense, which also implies being able to obtain health care, get an education and live in a healthy and sustainable environment.

However, for all the millennium development goals to be met, in addition to legislation, we need to substantially increase the budget for development assistance. Unfortunately, the first Conservative budget did not fill the bill and failed to show any real intention to meet the international aid target of 0.7% of GDP by 2015.

I will remind the hon. members of this House, and the Prime Minister in particular, that, in February 2005, a letter signed by the three opposition leaders was sent to the Prime Minister of the Liberal government, asking him to pass legislation making poverty reduction the ultimate purpose of government development assistance and urging him to implement a strategy promoting a steady and foreseeable increase in development assistance. They were also calling for a substantial and immediate increase of the aid budget.

It is apparent that the Prime Minister has difficulty putting his words into action.

In conclusion, this bill's goal is fundamental. However, some aspects of the bill will need to be considered in greater detail at committee.

[Alexa McDonough, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased to have the opportunity to speak briefly to this private member's bill, Bill C-293, introduced by my colleague from Scarborough—Guildwood. I congratulate him for having introduced this bill entitled “an act respecting the provision of development assistance abroad”.

I will be supporting the bill. This will not surprise anybody because it is a replication of a bill that I had already introduced six weeks ago in the House.

I am profoundly disappointed, actually very dismayed, by the way in which the government has chosen to deal with the bill before us. It is a huge violation of the spirit of cooperation and collaboration that was shown both in the foreign affairs committee over a period of more than two years of work around overseas development assistance issues and in the House. On June 28 last year, members voted unanimously to support a recommendation from the foreign affairs committee. I want to read part of that it into the record. It stated that Parliament:

--introduce legislation...which establishes poverty reduction as the priority for Canada’s Official Development Assistance (ODA), as outlined in the historic February 17, 2005, letter from all Opposition Leaders to the Prime Minister, to ensure that aid is provided in a manner consistent with Canada’s human rights obligations and respectful of the perspectives of those living in poverty...

That was a genuine expression of a point of view brought forward again and again by witnesses before the foreign affairs committee, literally over a period of two and a half years. The first of those witnesses to appear was on April 1, 2003. It was the special envoy for HIV-AIDS in Africa, Stephen Lewis, who serves under the UN Secretary-General. We had a continual flow of recommendations around this essential topic.

What is very disappointing is that we have not seen tonight in this debate a reflection or a continuation of that spirit of cooperation. It is absolutely in order. In fact, it is the responsibility of each and every one of us as private members to bring forward the different points of view that one will reflect upon and express on any bill that comes before us. It is heart-breaking, if we look at all the work done by NGOs, particularly the umbrella organization for the 100 or more NGOs, the Canadian Council for International Co-operation. Also many witnesses came before the committee in the belief that Canada wanted to re-establish itself as a leader with credibility around overseas development assistance.

The CIDA minister appeared before the foreign affairs committee yesterday. I received a letter from the her yesterday, after a four month delay since I wrote to her urging urgent action on this matter. All indications from the government on this are very disappointing, in fact I would say alarming. It is its intention to take us backwards instead of moving forward on something around which there was an astounding consensus at the foreign affairs committee and in the House.

A constructive action that could have been taken tonight would have been to indicate that this matter is worthy of examination by the foreign affairs committee, with a sense of urgency that is appropriate given that a whole year has passed since Parliament spoke with one voice to say that we should move forward on this.

Instead, what we have heard is a bunch of procedural argument, all of which could have been addressed in a meaningful debate at the committee level. Frankly, it was even more disappointing to have heard from the minister that she would begin to look at some of the ways that we could improve our aid delivery and our accountability. At some future date, heavens knows when, we might actually begin to see some progress from the government. It is very disappointing.

I meant what I said on this floor on May 1 when I introduced the companion bill to one now before us. I pleaded with the government to make it its own and scrap the private member's bill if it were so inclined. However, for heaven's sake, move on this issue. Millions of people are dying unnecessarily of hunger and disease because of the grinding poverty in which they are living.

Canada is a contributor to those killer conditions. Instead of the Liberal government moving us forward with a level of overseas development assistance that would allow Canadians to hold their heads up high, it took us from 0.5% of ODA assistance, which was in place under the previous Conservative government, back to where it was at .23%.

We have no indication whatsoever from the government that it intends to move on any of the recommendations that were brought forward unanimously by the foreign affairs committee and unanimously endorsed in the House on June 28, 2005.

I still plead with the government to realize that the appropriate sense of urgency with which this matter should be addressed would be for the bill to go to committee at the earliest possible time, where it could be debated and amendments proposed. I know the member for Scarborough—Guildwood has indicated, as have I, that each of the points raised are legitimate points that can be addressed and around which some flexibility is appropriate.

Although I think it is clear that an advisory council is an important part of this, the bill does not require a royal recommendation. It says the advisory council “may” receive remuneration. It is up to the minister to decide on that. Therefore, that could be addressed.

There has been another issue raised, but I am will not go into the obstructionistic procedural posturing that we have heard from the government side tonight. It is extremely disappointing. I think Canadians applauded spirit of cooperation, which is desperately needed by people around the world who are suffering from the most degrading poverty on earth. We owe it to Canadians and to those suffering from global poverty, in the spirit of the make poverty history campaign and in the spirit of the work done over a two and a half year period, to move ahead and deal with the bill at committee at the earliest possible date.

If the government cannot bring itself to do that, because it wants to be the sole author of an appropriate bill, then in the name of heaven let us agree and commit ourselves to fast track a bill that the government would introduce so we could then get on with taking action.

I do not know how else to do this but to plead with the government not to make all Canadians and parliamentarians look ridiculous by obstructing and blocking progress on something so urgent to the most desperately poor people of the world.

[Dan McTeague, Liberal, Pickering—Scarborough East, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I want to echo the comments made by colleagues in the House in support of what is a very important initiative, an initiative that I believe unites Canada in a common purpose and focuses in an accountable and transparent way its aid development around the world.

I thank the hon. member and my colleague, who once shared part of my riding or I shared part of his, the member for Scarborough—Guildwood. He has taken a very important step toward focusing Parliament toward commitments that have been made, not only by colleagues in my party, but very clearly, as suggested by the hon. member for Halifax and earlier by the member himself, by Parliament. Parliament should proceed at the earliest opportunity.

Based on the letter from February 17, 2005, all three then opposition leaders, now one Prime Minister and two opposition leaders, made it abundantly clear where they stood on ensuring that CIDA moneys were focused on poverty elimination. It is not lost on Canadians, on civil society and on the efforts made in the past that on this day alone one-third of the people who will die in this world will die as a result of poverty, the result of neglect and starvation.

It is extremely important that Canadians understand what this debate is about. It is not at this stage increasing the funding. It is targeting the funding.

I also want to compliment not only my colleague, the member for Scarborough—Guildwood, but also the hon. member for Halifax who quite rightly, in what was a tornado of events in June 2005, brought Parliament together to ensure that the government and Parliament would agree to the target of .07% in terms of our obligations of international development. We know where this Parliament stands.

I want to point out that the letter was signed by the leader of the Bloc Québécois, who is still here, the leader of the New Democratic Party, who is still here and the leader of the opposition of the Conservative Party, who is now Prime Minister. There are two points that the now Prime Minister, then opposition leader, made. I will read this into the record.

We are writing to urge you to introduce legislation which establishes poverty reduction as the aim for Canada's Official Development Assistance (ODA). A legislated mandate for Canada's ODA would ensure that aid is provided in a manner both consistent with Canada's human rights obligations and respectful of the perspectives of those living in poverty.

To reiterate that, the Prime Minister also said:

We are not however simply urging more dollars be spent. Those dollars must also be spent effectively and in ways ensuring more accountability. In our view, this legislation should include an unequivocal statement of purpose that poverty reduction is the central lens through which Canada's aid program should be delivered.

That does not just bind us in the House of Commons. I respectfully submit that it binds the Prime Minister. Regardless of the procedural tactics not to deal with this and concerns about who is going to handle this or that, I can tell the hon. parliamentary secretary this. He sat on the same foreign affairs committee that recommended this a little earlier and he is now the parliamentary secretary responsible for CIDA. He will remember the RADARSAT issue in which we could not figure out who would be responsible for making decisions.

Those are decisions that could be made with the expertise that we have in committee and the engagement of civil society and of witnesses. it seems to me to be abundantly clear and plain to everybody who is listening today that all parties have agreed in one form or another to the need to pass the bill. It is my view that the initiative by the member, supported by so many members of the House of Commons and now supported by the right hon. Prime Minister, make it incumbent on the Prime Minister to accept this.

However, let me go one step further. The Conservative Party in a number of initiatives agreed, not only obviously with their leader, but if I am not mistaken with their own policy platform, their resolution of March 2005, a mere month after. I know many hon. colleagues in the Conservative Party, who are here today, will remember that they voted for the following:

A Conservative Government will introduce legislation that will...define a legal framework for Canada’s Official Development Assistance (ODA) envelope of spending. This legislation will include a clear mandate for development assistance; mechanisms for policy coherence, monitoring, accountability and reporting to Parliament; and enhanced public transparency.

We are not debating that. We agree with that, but we find now that the Conservative parliamentary secretary has argued against himself, not only against the wisdom of his leader, who is now Prime Minister, but apparently against the convention of his own party.

I would suggest that as opposed to simply pointing fingers, we could get a whole lot more done if Parliament were prepared here and now--I am not going to do it, but I want acknowledgement from hon. members--to refer this to the committee immediately. We are allowing this to go an hour in a month and another hour in another month, and we may not even get to this until November. Who do we betray? Who do we hurt? We are hurting people who know that one of the strongest elements of how Canada presents itself in the world is with respect to how it treats the most vulnerable people, regardless of their credo, their nation and their circumstances.

We cannot do everything. It has become abundantly clear, certainly in my time in foreign affairs, that our greatest talents, our greatest efforts, and ones which we are greatly acknowledged for, lie in our ability to help the people in the world who are vulnerable, regardless of their circumstances, and who, through no fault of their own, may very well die today or in the next few days, poverty being the basis on which other diseases and problems occur.

It seems to me that Parliament must debate but it must also act. The wisdom provided by my hon. colleague, the member for Scarborough—Guildwood, cannot be gainsaid. I think we all have an obligation to remind Canadians of the things we want to accomplish. Considering the spirit of the bill, not only is it about focusing, but it is also about transparency, accountability and input from the NGOs and organizations that do so much.

We can obviously take time to amend this bill in committee, as that is of course the purpose of committee, but I would launch a challenge to all members of Parliament to find it within themselves to see this bill for what it is. It is a true testament to an issue whose time has come, not in terms of engagement of hostilities but in fact to offer to the rest of the world, as some other leading nations are today, the issue of putting a priority on the reduction of poverty first.

Not nine months ago, Parliament did indeed do that. Regardless of the political circumstances that existed at the time, we made it abundantly clear on all sides of the House that it was important, thanks in many measures to the member for Halifax, to support a resolution to ensure that we look at global poverty reduction but that Canada also respect its commitment.

As for working in the department, I understand that there may be concerns about protecting certain interests within the department and having the flexibility of saying that we use CIDA to obtain different policies which might have the effect of furthering Canada's interests. One person talked to me a little earlier about the questions of security. Some talked to us about questions of Canada's priorities, which have nothing to do with poverty reduction or security, necessarily, but which might somehow encumber the government in terms of its flexibility.

I realize that this is an important imperative, but it is not an imperative that stands in the face of dying children and people who, through no fault of their own today, by the misfortune of living in another part of the world as a result of war or strife, or as a result of nations that fail to protect people's human rights and dignity, are left in the position where they have no alternative but to hope that the Parliament in Ottawa, Canada, today will get it act together collectively and make sure that its best efforts in terms of resources are placed on the people who need it most.

I do not know what credos we share, and I do not know what backgrounds we have, and I am not exactly sure of differences in terms of our policies and philosophies, but helping the most vulnerable and ensuring that Canada puts its best foot forward is, I believe, something that we all share in common and that we as a Parliament have a duty to do and to enact.

I want to say this and I encourage members on this side of the House to do the same. I agree with what the Prime Minister said on February 17, 2005. I agree with the leader of the Bloc Québécois. I agree with the leader of the New Democratic Party. It is good to talk about these things, but I think we have come to a point where we must act now, we must act purposefully and we must act in the most important crisis facing the world today, which is clearly the reduction of poverty.

The House resumed from June 7 consideration of the motion that Bill C-293, An Act respecting the provision of development assistance abroad, be read the second time and referred to a committee.

Development Assistance Accountability Act

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

On June 7, 2006, during debate on Bill C-293, an act respecting the provision of development assistance abroad, which is standing in the name of the hon. member for Scarborough—Guildwood, the Parliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Minister for Democratic Reform raised a point of order to argue that this bill requires a royal recommendation.

The parliamentary secretary began his intervention by pointing out that clause 6 of the bill would oblige the Minister of International Cooperation to establish an advisory committee for international development cooperation with remuneration and expenses for members of the committee to be set by the minister. In arguing that this provision has financial implications, the parliamentary secretary referred to the Speaker's February 8, 2005 ruling where it was stated that a similar provision in a bill was judged to require a royal recommendation.

The parliamentary secretary continued to explain that clauses 7 to 10 of the bill also described functions of this committee and obligations of the minister that entailed new expenditures. He described these functions as receiving, recording and replying to petitions, as well as preparing and submitting reports.

The Chair has reviewed this matter carefully and agrees that the establishment of the advisory committee for international development cooperation provided for in clause 6 clearly would require the expenditure of public funds in a manner and for a purpose not currently authorized. Similarly, the provisions in clauses 7 to 10, which describe the functions of the advisory committee with regard to the process of petitioning and reporting, are also functions which would require the authorization of spending for a new and distinct purpose.

As such, clause 6 and clauses 7 to 10 cause the bill as a whole in its current form to require a royal recommendation. Accordingly, I will decline to put the question on third reading of this bill unless a royal recommendation is received. Today, however, the debate is on the motion for second reading which will proceed as scheduled.

[Paul Szabo, Liberal, Mississauga South, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. You had indicated that unless a royal recommendation was forthcoming by the end of third reading the question would not be put. Is it also the case, maybe for the clarification of the House, that should the bill be remedied either at committee stage or at report stage with regard to the items raised that in fact it would go forward at third reading for a vote?

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

If the bill is remedied in committee to deal with the problems that were raised in the points of order and subsequently in the ruling in such a fashion that it did not require a royal recommendation, that of course would impact this ruling. As it is right now, it will not be put at third reading. These changes could happen in committee, but right now we will deal with second reading. As the bill stands now, the question will not be put at third reading.

[Kevin Sorenson, Conservative, Crowfoot, AB]

Mr. Speaker, that was certainly one of the concerns that our parliamentary secretary brought out at first reading. We appreciate the ruling on that.

I do appreciate the opportunity to speak to Bill C-293. I also want to thank the member for Scarborough—Guildwood for introducing a bill, flawed as it may be, to create legislation for Canadian development assistance. Indeed, the bill introduces proposals that are very close to some of the issues that have been raised by the government.

Development is a moving target. Today, more than ever before, we have a better grasp of what works. As an individual country and with the international community, we have embarked on a complex journey that is leading to more effective aid, aid that can better harness the energies and talents of developing countries, and that can truly make a difference in the lives of the poor. There is a vision in Canada for aid programs.

We have a vision of donors and partners working together to achieve the reduction of poverty, of mutual accountability, of trust and respect, and of good governance which makes all of these things possible. However, visions must also be practical if they are going to work. Canadians want us to be certain that this bill in fact actually does guide us to the delivery of that vision.

We have already heard in the first hour of debate in the House on the bill that there are many members of Parliament who do not feel that the bill facilitates Canada's vision of our federal government's aid program. I would remind members of the House that the Speech from the Throne stated that the government is committed to “a more effective use of Canadian aid dollars.”

The government wants to ensure that we do the right thing with our aid money in putting this vision into practice. We will ensure that aid dollars are provided to the countries that have created a climate in which progress can be achieved. We will ensure that such progress can be achieved as efficiently as possible and that the people who most need the help will receive the assistance they need to find their way out of poverty.

I have yet to be convinced that Bill C-293 will allow us to build a dynamic and effective development assistance program, but we are keeping an open mind and we are anxious to participate in the committee that perhaps will study the bill in the event that it is passed at second reading. We want to ensure, and I know all members of the committee want to ensure, that it gets a fair hearing in committee.

The bill is very complex and seems to contain a number of mixed messages that may not bring precision to Canada's development assistance. If our assistance is going to be effective, our objectives must be simple and clearly defined. Yet, this does not appear to me to be a simple bill.

As I said, in the first hour of debate we heard comments that some are concerned about the possibility of escalating administrative costs as the result of the bill. Development assistance should reach the people for whom it is intended. We need to be careful that Canada's aid dollars, which ultimately are Canadian taxpayers' dollars, are not being tied up in lengthy process or procedures in Ottawa.

The bill's proposed petition system, reporting requirements and advisory committee would add layers of bureaucracy into an already well-developed system. They could, quite conceivably, turn current consultative processes into cumbersome Canada-focused procedures.

The system, as proposed in the bill as I read it, would risk the focus or could risk taking the focus off of the recipient country and put it back onto Canada. I would argue that the recipient nation's particular circumstances, that of poverty or need, should always be the focus in terms of what is needed.

Our new Conservative government has made the enhancement of accountability within government one of our highest priorities. We are committed to strengthening the rules and institutions that ensure transparency and accountability to Canadians.

I am concerned that the bill may bring considerable confusion to those accountability rules and institutions that we have created in government.

I hope that the foreign affairs and international development committee, the committee that will conduct the hearings on this bill if it is passed by the House, will study carefully the roles and responsibilities of the Minister of International Cooperation. In my view, the minister's extensive roles and responsibilities are worthy of great consideration. I have not seen that reflected in this bill.

The bill adds to the already considerable reporting requirements of the minister and may not help clarify in legislation what she does in practice. We do not want to simply add to her administrative responsibilities without demonstrating real value-added to Canada's aid program.

This bill would give considerable oversight to a committee of unelected individuals who would function on the basis of complaints from aggravated individuals in other countries. I am not sure of the extent that this may be really counter to the letter and the spirit of the democratic process and whether or not this comes close to making the minister responsible or accountable to an advisory committee rather than being accountable to Parliament and ultimately to Canadians.

The bill would require the minister to report on how she has implemented the guidance of this advisory committee rather than how she has implemented the guidance of the will of Parliament. I am not sure Canadians support having our cabinet ministers accountable to authorities outside of the parliamentary precinct and in reality outside of our country.

The bill would remove from Canada the authority to define development assistance and would place it within the Organization of Economic Cooperation and Development, the OECD, a high level, multilateral organization not based in Canada, not based in Ottawa, but based in Paris.

While Canada values highly the role of the OECD and is an active supporter of greater collaboration between OECD members, it is clear that the current formulation would result in Canada having reduced control over where it targets development assistance.

The last time I checked, Canadians want control over the taxpayer dollars we send around the world as foreign aid. Under this bill Canada's development assistance program would be subject to the rules of an unelected institution. Such a move could potentially restrict both programming and the countries to which development assistance may be given.

For accountability purposes, it is extremely important that Canada be able to choose where its development assistance can be most effectively utilized. Experience has taught us that countries that promote sound governance, democracy and human rights, are more likely to be able to make good use of Canadian aid dollars and that we can make a true difference in those countries.

Canada's aid program has had results by taking this approach. We should be careful about undermining the effectiveness of the aid program that already is working. Someone said that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. I would suggest that there have to be some changes. Our committee is looking at that and has looked at that. We do not want to diminish the effectiveness of our programs.

CIDA has concentrated on implementing the principles of aid effectiveness in our bilateral operations and has worked effectively with countries that are committed to improving governance and making effective use of resources. With our assistance, countries such as Tanzania and Ghana are beginning to show results. There is more to be done in these countries. There is more to be done in other countries in terms of improving and focusing Canada's aid program.

I welcome the intent and the spirit of this bill. I believe the member, as he puts this forward, will recognize the concerns we have with this bill. If it passes the vote at second reading in the House, the foreign affairs and international development committee will look forward to working on this bill.

[Rob Nicholson, Conservative, Niagara Falls, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. In view of the ruling given a few moments ago by your honour concerning the need for a royal recommendation for the bill now under consideration, I want to inform the House and the hon. member for Scarborough—Guildwood that the government is not prepared to advise Her Excellency to issue a royal recommendation for Bill C-293. I knew the House would want to know this and this is the first opportunity I have had to so inform the House.

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

I thank the government House leader for clarifying that for the benefit of the House.

Resuming debate, the hon. member for Laurentides—Labelle.

[Johanne Deschamps, Bloc, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure for me to take part in the debate on Bill C-293, an Act respecting the provision of development assistance abroad.

I have a deep interest in international development as the Bloc Québécois’ foreign affairs critic for Africa and Latin America.

I can assure the House that the Bloc Québécois takes very much to heart the effects of poverty and misery in the developing countries, especially the sub-Saharan countries.

We are lucky in the West to have been born in rich countries that have the resources to meet our basic needs, such as food, clothing and housing.

Quebec is often cited as a model on the international scene for its health, education and daycare systems, as well as its social safety net in general.

As we speak, a number of human tragedies are playing out in various parts of the world: armed conflicts, natural catastrophes, famines.

The Bloc Québécois has always supported increased international assistance that is fair and effective. Canada has the wherewithal to act and should do so. The Bloc supports Bill C-293 in principle. However, some aspects of it should be studied more extensively in parliamentary committee.

The bill proposes the establishment of a committee of experts in international assistance to be appointed by the minister responsible for this file.

I really wonder. Is it appropriate for members of the House of Commons to be on this committee?

Parliamentarians already have an opportunity to express their views and make their recommendations known in the House as well as in various committees.

Would it not be better for the members of this committee to be experts who are active in the field and can be found by the hundreds in different non-governmental organizations, religious organizations and the private sector that does business in these countries?

I have another question. Should the appointment of these specialists not be subsequent to a study of their candidacy by the members of Parliament and a vote in the House to approve the suggestions of the minister in charge?

If the minister has the ability to appoint the members of the committee, determine their remuneration, and dismiss them any time he likes, who in this House would really believe that these future committee members are impartial?

This is all the more true in view of the fact that some NGOs are very dependent on federal government funding for their work in the field and will feel obliged to keep quiet in order not to displease their funder.

Another question arises as well. Will the moneys allocated to the establishment of this committee be taken from the funds, already too paltry, that we have invested in international assistance?

Let us hope not, since Canada currently is not even able to meet its Millennium Goals commitment to invest 0.7% of its GDP in international assistance by 2015.

That is why this morning, my colleague from Longueuil—Pierre-Boucher, the Bloc Québécois critic on international assistance, tabled a motion to force the Government of Canada to respect its commitments on this matter.

The motion states:

That, in the opinion of the House, the government should improve Canada's contribution to international assistance through a commitment firstly to achieving the target of 0.7% of GDP by 2015 by increasing in a stable and predictable manner amounts for government development assistance, and, secondly by enshrining in law that the mandate and purpose of government development assistance is poverty reduction based on the principles of the United Nations Millennium Goals.

Last spring, the Auditor General of Canada criticized the way Canada spends its money on international assistance.

The purpose of Bill C-293 is to enhance transparency in the department, but nothing is proposed for improving the internal management of funding at CIDA.

Perhaps the panel of experts proposed here would not be necessary if CIDA resolved its internal management problems once and for all and if the Government of Canada finally adopted a concrete and effective plan of action for the distribution of its international assistance.

In my opinion, Bill C-293 raises another problem and that is the way it defines development assistance, limiting it to poverty reduction and sustainable development.

None of the other six targets put forward by the UN in its Millennium Goals has been emphasized in terms of Canada's action for eliminating poverty in world.

It is important to recall these goals, which are all necessary to put an end to poverty in developing countries.

First is the eradication of extreme poverty and hunger. We know that more than a billion human beings live on less than one dollar a day and that 800 million of these people do not have enough to eat and cannot function day to day. One quarter of all children under the age of five in developing countries are malnourished. This starvation has long-term consequences, making these children frail and vulnerable to sickness and disease.

Next is the achievement of universal primary education, because 115 million children of school age do not have the opportunity to attend primary school.

In addition, the promotion of gender equality in developing countries is more than necessary. Here are some examples: family violence; crimes of passion; trafficking of women; female circumcision; early and forced marriage; elimination of young girls through infanticide; violence related to dowry; acid throwing; and violence related to sexual exploitation. Such is the daily lot of millions of women in the world.

In terms of the infant mortality rate, the United Nations calculates that more than 11 million children die every year in the world. Those 11 million victims equal the entire population of Ontario.

Thirty thousand children die every day from causes directly related to poverty. The loss of those 30,000 children is the equivalent of the city of Alma disappearing on a Monday, and the city of Mirabel vanishing on Tuesday, and the population of Val-d'Or wiped out on Wednesday. In other words, there are far too many victims.

There is an enormous amount of work to be done in order to improve the health of mothers in poor countries. Mothers are generally the last line of protection for children of these countries in the face of poverty. The death of mothers during pregnancy, delivery or soon after the birth of a child leaves infants in a very fragile state in the face of extreme poverty or exploitation.

HIV-AIDS is also a fierce adversary to the advancement of women in Africa. More than 60% of the people infected are women and that has countless repercussions, in particular, reduced education of children, a decrease in per capita GDP, and more food crises, because women are at the heart of the agriculture industry in those countries.

I must also mention the struggle to eradicate such diseases as malaria, tuberculosis and HIV-AIDS, which is the main cause of early death in sub-Saharan Africa, and the fourth leading cause in the world.

As for promoting environmental sustainability, Canada is truly pathetic right now thanks to Conservative inaction. Canada's withdrawal from Kyoto reveals the Minister of the Environment's lack of awareness and vision. Two weeks ago, she decided not to act on Canada's commitment to poorer countries to help them reduce their greenhouse gases. This proves that this government does not care about our planet's and our children's future.

The last goal is to establish a global development partnership that includes all countries struggling against poverty. That way, all human beings, whether they are born in Quebec or in Rwanda, would be guaranteed the basics of life.

In conclusion, I would like to reiterate my support and my party's support for bill C-293. I hope that my colleague's motion will resonate with this government that, since it came to power, has been boasting about its transparency, accountability and integrity.

This is the same government that, as soon as it came to power, tore up the Kyoto protocol, turned its back on poor countries seeking to help stop global warming despite their many social problems, spent billions of dollars on arms, but failed to keep its word on the millennium development goals, turned its back on its commitment to correcting the fiscal imbalance with Quebec and reneged on its promise to establish a new program for older worker adjustment.

[Dawn Black, NDP, New Westminster—Coquitlam, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I am proud to stand in the House today and support this bill from the member for Scarborough—Guildwood. The bill is a central part of the four goals of the Make Poverty History campaign which asks us to enact legislation to make ending poverty the exclusive goal of Canadian foreign aid in a way that is consistent with our human rights obligations.

I have received correspondence and visits from hundreds of people in my riding who support this campaign. I want to make it clear that I strongly support the international campaign to make poverty history.

One of my constituents, 14-year-old Sally, has written to me several times on this campaign. She has also written to the Prime Minister and has urged the Prime Minister to show true national and international leadership on the issue of making poverty history. In her most recent e-mail to the Prime Minister, she says that all the eyes of the world are on us and that she wants Canada to show real international leadership by increasing support for HIV-AIDS prevention and treatment programs in developing countries, investing in public health care in developing countries, promoting access to affordable medicines and cancelling the debt of the poorest countries. We should heed the words of Sally and show the world that we are determined to act to end world poverty.

Members in this House should be supporting the bill, which is very similar to Bill C-293 put forward by my colleague, the member for Halifax, who is our party's international development critic.

In 1969, Prime Minister Pearson authored the report “Partners in Development”, in which he put forward the idea of the government providing 0.7% of gross national product to official development assistance, as well as 0.3% of ODA coming from the private sector. Since then, several countries have met this goal, including Sweden, Norway and Denmark. Most recently, several members of the G-8 agreed to reach that goal, the U.K., Germany, France and Italy, but sadly Canada did not make that commitment.

The history of ODA in Canada is quite sad. We have never reached our goal of 0.7%. The highest was in 1974-75 at 0.53% and peaked again in the late eighties and early nineties. During the Liberal government's term in office from 1993 to 2005 it cut official development assistance in half from 0.44% to 0.23%, which is quite shocking. Incredibly, Canada rated 14th out of the 22 OECD members in terms of official development assistance as a percentage of our gross national income.

Something else disturbing that began under the Liberals was the first move toward redefining ODA so that it would include not just humanitarian and development spending but also military assistance as well. We now see, through what is happening in Kandahar, Afghanistan, how that is pertinent today.

We must guard against changing the definition of official development assistance. Changing the definition could allow the government to artificially inflate its ODA figures by including some money spent on national defence or foreign affairs, which has nothing to do with reducing poverty, and then deem that to be part of the spending on ODA.

The government should not be able to change the goals of development assistance at a whim. The commitment to reducing poverty must be put down in legal form to bind the actions of government. The bill would guarantee that official development assistance would be focused on poverty reduction, which is a good thing. This would ensure that Canadian money was used to fight not just the effects but also the causes of extreme poverty. The bill, therefore, would give real hope to those in poverty.

It is interesting that the Conservative government is opposed to this legislation, because in February 2005 the Prime Minister endorsed the idea of this legislation in a joint letter to the former prime minister which was also signed by the leaders of the Bloc Québécois and the NDP. I will quote from this letter:

We are writing to urge you to introduce legislation which establishes poverty reduction as the aim for Canada's Official Development Assistance (ODA). A legislated mandate for Canada's ODA would ensure that aid is provided in a manner both consistent with Canada's human rights obligations and respectful of the perspectives of those living in poverty.

That letter was signed by the current Prime Minister of Canada. The Conservatives should honour the promise of their leader and they should support this legislation.

[Bernard Patry, Liberal, Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC]

Mr. Speaker, it is an honour for me to express my full and unconditional support for Bill C-293 introduced by my colleague, the member for Scarborough—Guildwood. This bill fully addresses Canadians' concerns about the international aid Canada provides. That is why we should not only salute the initiative by the member for Scarborough—Guildwood, but also support its implementation.

Because of my various parliamentary duties, especially on the Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Development, I have long had the opportunity to talk with Canadians about this important issue, which concerns our country's commitments and responsibilities in the world.

Whether from members of the public who take the time to express their views individually or from associations involved in international aid and businesspeople, we always hear the same message, stated loud and clear. Our resources must be allocated with greater concern for effectiveness, transparency and good democratic governance.

In practical terms, this means that the vast majority of Canadians not only feel concerned by this major issue, but also demand that our international aid really promote the values that characterize our country. We must work to ensure that Canadian aid initiatives abroad are better targeted so that our country really attacks the poverty that afflicts so many peoples that are part of the human race.

Incidentally, young people strongly support this objective, as evidenced by the large number of international solidarity organizations that are found across the country, even in schools, and that youth intuitively gravitate towards, often very early in their education.

Our youth are therefore sending a very strong message that we as parliamentarians must listen to, because they represent the future of our nation and its role in the world.

In today's world, where so much economic, technological, scientific, cultural and democratic progress has been made, it is scandalous that peoples in whole areas of our planet still suffer such extreme poverty that they do not even have the bare necessities of life.

A long time ago, our government and others, as well as multilateral organizations such as the UN and many more, declared that they would work towards reducing poverty. However, as we have seen, it is not enough to make a declaration. Concrete action is required to achieve real results. In this regard Bill C-293represents a true step forward because it unequivocally states that “all Canadian development assistance abroad is provided with a central focus on poverty reduction”. This is crystal clear.

If passed in its present form, as I dearly hope, this bill will give us a legislative tool enabling parliamentarians to better oversee Canada's efforts to reduce poverty. This bill also seeks to provide better means of assessing the true impact of our international aid, in a context where accountability for management of public resources is increasingly important in the conscience of our citizens, and will lead to greater transparency.

Transparency is required for the Canadian government to provide its citizens with a clearer account of its management of international aid. I mentioned the goal of poverty reduction. However, there are other crucial aspects of this bill which make our support all the more important. These include the requirement to respect international human rights standards. Canadians are very clear on this issue: they do not want international aid to support oppressive political regimes that do not respect human rights, the rights of workers or the duty and obligations of any democratic country with respect to its citizens.

The state must seek to improve the well-being of its citizens. It must have no other purpose. Thus, international aid must never be used to line the pockets of tyrants who are incapable or unwilling to take on such a responsibility and one that we cannot shirk. This bill also requires the government to ensure that the criteria for Canadian foreign aid include respect for the principles of sustainable development.

Concerns regarding responsible management of natural resources and environmental conservation are also an important focus of our fellow world citizens, for today and the future, as well as the responsibilities they demand of their governments in those areas.

This is actually a matter of clarity or common sense. We see it all too often these days: the planet's ecological balance is seriously threatened by the destruction of resources and pollution has crossed our borders, only to now affect us.

In that sense, we Canadians are connected to everyone else on the planet, whether we like it or not. In terms of environmental degradation, the future of our entire species is at risk.

We must therefore take action in this area, as well, or we would be reneging on our responsibilities to future generations, who are just as entitled as we are to live in a healthy ecological environment.

This is why it is so important to include this element in Bill C-293, since we can no longer avoid this aspect of international aid. The issues inherent to human development are becoming increasingly interconnected, and resolving one depends more and more on resolving the other.

In conclusion, this bill contains an essential element of our international aid that not only must become an integral part of the responsibilities of any government in the world today, but that also addresses the concerns and desires expressed by so many of our fellow citizens. Accordingly, it is the duty of this Parliament to pass this bill and we should be privileged to do so.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I begin by congratulating my colleague, the hon. member forScarborough—Guildwood for his interest in bringing forward private member's Bill C-293, An Act respecting the provision of development assistance abroad.

The hon. member has a reputation that has put him at odds with other members of his party when it comes to children and family issues. I congratulate him for having the courage to stand up on certain issues when it has not always been popular to do with within his party.

It is a pleasure for me to participate in this evening's debate. I am on record both here and outside the House as supporting measures that assist families and children. One example is my public opposition to the clawback by the Liberal Party of Ontario of the national child benefit from some of our neediest children in Ontario.

The Renfrew County Child Poverty Action Network, CPAN, is asking for the public's help in its backpack campaign that supplies backpacks and shoes for children who may otherwise have to do without. Due to the overwhelming demand, there are so many children who are in need. In my riding of Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, children suffer from the clawback of that benefit. As a result CPAN is asking for the public's help to assist us in filling every request. Sixteen dollars buys backpack supplies for one child, and $20 to $40 will purchase shoes. I encourage those who are able to help to do so.

I am proud to support the plan of the new Conservative government to provide parents with a $1,200 annual allowance for each child under the age of six.

The aim of the choice for child care allowance is to support the choices of all parents of young children, whether they choose to work, study or stay at home with their children, live in a small community like Eganville, a rural community like Brudenell, a small city like Pembroke, or do shift work.

I point this out in the context of the private member's bill before us today for what is being argued by other groups that deal with child poverty.

The most effective way to help parents is not through another government program that eats up more cash by administering a bureaucracy rather than what is actually provided to the recipient. The most effective way to help is to provide the cash directly to whom we want to assist.

It was never the intent of our new Conservative government to fully subsidize the cost of institution based child care. Not all parents use or choose to use such care.

Like this bill before us today, if I understand--

[Paul Szabo, Liberal, Mississauga South, ON]

Mr. Speaker, on a point of order. Respectfully, it appears that the member is speaking to possibly another bill. The private member's bill before us has to do with CIDA, with international development assistance. If the member is in fact here to speak to that bill, I think the matter of relevance should be brought to her attention.

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

I thank the member for Mississauga South for that point of order. I would urge the member for Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke to try to bridge her comments as much as possible, as quickly as possible to the main thrust of the bill before us.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Speaker, it is ironic that the Liberal Party takes the official position that it does not trust Canadian parents to make the right decisions for their children. The phrase “beer and popcorn” I believe was used to criticize parental choice in this country.

Clause 7 of the bill gives to aid recipients in other countries the right to petition or challenge the type of aid being delivered. Yet when our new Conservative government proposed to give the same right to Canadian parents to make child poverty history in Canada by providing a $1,200 annual allowance for children under the age of six directly to their parents to use as they deem necessary, members opposite opposed this child poverty initiative.

As a member of Parliament with many of the same concerns when it comes to family as the the hon. member for Scarborough—Guildwood, I welcome the interest in international development that the bill demonstrates. However, as my colleague on this side of the House has already stated, while the intent of C-293 is good, it falls short in terms of practicality.

The bill as it is drafted could hamper Canada's ability to make a positive and effective contribution to international development. I will not go into the detailed reasons why the bill is unworkable since the hon. member for Crowfoot has laid them before the House so clearly.

Canada has a long tradition of international engagement and of meaningful contribution in international development and to poverty eradication. We were at the forefront of the very first formal international development initiative in the 1950s called the Colombo plan. Hundreds of Canadian people travelled around the globe in the early 1960s to serve as volunteers to help people in developing countries. Many of those volunteers went on to become leaders in private and public sectors. In fact, they set an example that has been followed by thousands of their compatriots every since.

Right at this moment, as we debate this bill in the House, a number of our fellow citizens, some from my own riding of Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, are working around the world in Africa, Latin America, and yes, Afghanistan, lending a helping hand and making a difference.

The Government of Canada and Canadian citizens are committed to making lives better for people around the world. We do it because we are compassionate and caring, and because it is the right thing to do. Our fellow citizens have indicated they are supportive of Canada's efforts to eradicate poverty around the world. Consistent with their compassion for the less fortunate, the new Conservative Government of Canada is committed to providing much needed assistance to the world's poor. To achieve this objective, we are committed to poverty reduction as seen most clearly in our commitment to the millennium development goals.

The millennium development goals are the global yardstick against which the world can measure progress in key areas. These goals were agreed to by every country, including Canada, in September 2000 at the United Nations millennium summit. They continue to provide a framework for the global community to work together toward a common end.

The goals, which include reducing poverty and hunger, achieving basic education for all, reducing child mortality, improving maternal health and forming global partnerships for development, represent a minimum agenda for action.

I want to assure members of the House that our new Conservative government understands the importance of international development work. The Speech from the Throne clearly stated that the Prime Minister and our government are committed to making Canadian development assistance more effective. We are reviewing our aid to strengthen its focus and to put resources where the impact will be the greatest and to show tangible results.

If the Canadian International Development Agency, CIDA, has not concentrated on implementing the principles of aid effectiveness in our bilateral operations, and this is the opinion of the member as an MP in the old regime in bringing forward this private member's bill, our new Conservative government is certainly prepared to examine this position.

Canada is working with countries that are committed to improving governance and making effective use of resources, countries such as Tanzania and Ghana. I am pleased to say that our efforts at undertaking this innovative work are showing some very positive results. In Tanzania, for example, Canada and other donors have focused on primary education, which has yielded a very impressive outcome.

Since the program began in 2002, the enrolment rate has soared from 60% to more than 90%. More than 32,000 new teachers have been recruited and nearly half of all students in primary schools are girls. In fact, now that donors are aligning and coordinating their approach to basic education, we are seeing amazing results throughout Africa. Between 2000 and 2003 the number of children out of school dropped from 44 million to 40 million. When we consider that the population rate has continued to grow, this is a substantial achievement.

Even more important, the number of girls in school continues to grow. This is a very positive thing, not only for girls but for their communities as well. When girls are able to access education, it means improved family income, better agricultural productivity, better health awareness, delayed marriage and healthier children.

I could cite many other examples, but I understand that tonight my time is limited. Nevertheless, before I conclude I think it is important to put on the record the fact that the new Conservative government is committed to international development.

Our first budget allowed us to show how serious we are about advancing Canadian values and Canadian interests on the international stage. By 2010-11 we will have doubled international assistance from 2001-02 levels. In other words, it will grow to about $3.8 billion in 2006-07 and then to approximately $4.1 billion in 2007-08.

In conclusion, I welcome and appreciate the spirit in which the hon. member for Scarborough—Guildwood has proposed the bill. I look forward to continuing the debate about the provision of development assistance abroad and the debate here at home on how we can make poverty history here in Canada.

[Keith Martin, Liberal, Esquimalt—Juan de Fuca, BC]

Mr. Speaker, I want to say what a pleasure it is to speak on Bill C-293. I congratulate my colleague from Scarborough—Guildwood for having the foresight to put forward this bill, a bill that over time has been supported by members from every single political party in this House, including that of the government.

Why the need? Over the last 50 years the international community has spent more than $2.3 trillion on aid. I am going to focus my comments on sub-Saharan Africa because that dark corner of the world is the only place in the world where lifespans are decreasing and poverty is increasing. In fact, 30 years ago, the average income in sub-Saharan Africa was twice that of Southeast Asia, but today it is half that. Indeed, as I said before, for many reasons it is the only place in the world where lifespans are decreasing and poverty is growing.

That is ironic given that sub-Saharan Africa possesses 40% of the world's natural resources. Why in the midst of the resource-rich countries is there this grinding poverty that is inhumane for any person? The reasons are actually quite complex, but there is much we can do. My colleague's bill would go a long way to focusing CIDA, to make it an organization focused to task and to do that which is required to alleviate this grinding poverty.

Corruption, conflict and a lack of capacitance: these three are major problems in sub-Saharan Africa. Unfortunately for too long our aid has been unfocused and scattered and too much of it has been spent here in Canada. That is why this bill put forward by my colleague from Scarborough—Guildwood, contrary to the comments made by members of the government, would actually aid the Minister of International Cooperation. It would enable her to have an accountable, focused, effective agenda so that Canadian taxpayers' money would be spent most effectively to actually make poverty history.

What can we do? As a previous speaker said, let us focus on the millennium development goals. When we Liberals were in government we focused those efforts on 24 countries. How about if we also do the following? We can focus on primary health, primary education and water and food security, along with corruption and governance issues. Those are niches where we can make a big difference and those are things that we can do on the ground.

In my experience in 23 visits to Africa and working there as a physician, it has been profoundly tragic to see what takes place. Many of these countries are actually set up to fail. In fact, the aid nexus can be seen as a big funnel, with the big circle on the top where the money goes in and the little circle down at the bottom where the people are. Money comes in that way and frameworks are built, but the frameworks are given to countries that do not have any chance whatsoever of implementing them because they do not have the capacity to do so.

What we can do is take up the Canada corps, the plan that our previous prime minister put forward, use that as a vector to be able to pool the best and brightest we have in our country and use those human resources here in Canada for work abroad. We can do it because we have an interesting demographic issue in our own country. As our population ages, we have a collection of individuals who are young retirees.

If 60 is the new 40, then we have a population of people with the resources, the capabilities, the talents and the desire to work abroad. By working abroad they will be able to fill that capacity in these developing countries through working with the local populations, not only to provide the care and the expertise but also to train the people on the ground. We can do this in our own country.

With respect to administration, I would encourage the government to look at what UNAIDS has done in terms of developing an effective administrative structure. CIDA would be wise to look at the three ones: one oversight mechanism, one framework, and one administrative body. If it does that with respect to aid and development, we will be able to have a focused, effective and administratively functional aid department and we will have aid initiatives that will make a difference on the ground.

All of us have travelled abroad, I think, and for those who have had the privilege of being in developing countries, they will have seen and they will know of the incredible courage and talent that exists in these countries. In sub-Saharan Africa, the people just want to have an opportunity. They just want to be free of somebody trying to kill them. They just want to be free of somebody trying to shoot them. They just want to be free of people who are putting the people's money into their own pockets and thereby depriving them of the basic social structures that all of us enjoy in this country. In short, they just want to have a chance. They just want an opportunity.

On the last point, the AIDS pandemic, where the government did not put forth an opportunity at the AIDS conference in Toronto, here is something we could do. What if the Prime Minister were to stand up at the United Nations this week and state that Canada was going to plant its flag on the care of the pregnant women and the care of orphans?

Through focusing on the care of pregnant women, we can use it to build the health care human resources structures, the prevention, the education and the testing. We could deal with our partners and with the ARVs, the antiretroviral medications.

If we give these medications to a pregnant woman after her first trimester, the incidence of the transference of the virus to the fetus is reduced from 40% to 1%. It is a simple, lifesaving and effective plan that will save millions of lives and reduce the sea of orphans that is happening now and will only worsen as time passes.

There are 14 million orphans in sub-Saharan Africa right now. That number will balloon to 18 million in the next five years. In the next 10 years that number will be up to 25 million, with no end in sight.

We as a country can decide this week that we are going to stand up and make the care of pregnant women and orphans our contribution to the fight against AIDS. It is simple, effective, easy to do, easy to understand and focused. We could do this in the 12 to 18 countries in sub-Saharan Africa that we have chosen to focus on. In doing so, we will start the process of enabling the international community to have an effective plan on the ground that is going to save lives and turn the tide on this pandemic that will claim up to 250 million lives in the next 30 years.

Nothing in the history of our planet has threatened our species as much as this one virus. I would implore the government, and indeed I would beg and beseech the government, to take this opportunity to do this. We have wonderful people in CIDA with extraordinary capabilities. Eighty per cent of them, tragically, sit across the river in Hull. We need to get some of them out into the trenches. We need to get them into our embassies and high commissions. We need to get them working on the ground with the countries. We need to align our efforts with the principles and ideals that the people on the ground want, consistent with that which will be effective for the poor and the poorest of the poor.

If we were to focus on the five areas that I mentioned, primary health care, primary education, water security, food security, governance, and anti-corruption activity, we would be able to make a difference. We would be able to save lives. We would be able to ensure that Canadian taxpayers' moneys are going to be spent wisely.

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Foreign Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure to speak to this private member's bill on the very important issue of development assistance.

We in this government share a view on the importance of ensuring the government does what it can to help others abroad in alleviating poverty and addressing those issues in developing countries. That is why in our budget last spring we committed to add $320 million to our international assistance funding and that was in addition to already budgeted increases over five years. This puts Canada on track to more than double international assistance from 2001-02 levels by 2010-11 at which point it will amount to over $5 billion per year. It is an important amount, particularly in light of the many competing domestic and international priorities.

However, the bill, unfortunately, although it is very well intentioned, is naive in terms of some of the unintended consequences. I read from the legislation which says, “Development assistance may be provided only if the competent minister is of the opinion that it contributes to poverty reduction”.

Canada's international development assistance has historically, even under the previous government, and I give it credit for this, gone well beyond poverty reduction into other very important areas: democracy promotion; the training of judges on how to run a proper judicial system; good governance support like that; and helping former communist countries translate their statutes into other languages so they can get accession to the European Union. These are all examples of financial support we have given to other countries and they are consistent with Canadian values. They are certainly consistent with the values of this government of promoting freedom, promoting democracy, promoting human rights and the rule of law.

To say that we are going to shut it down so we can no longer promote democracy around the world, to say that we can no longer help countries, which are struggling to develop their institutions, by supporting them in developing good civil service and good governance and by helping train promising new parliamentarians on how a democratic system works and so on, programs we have done in the past to help countries overseas make that advance, all of which we think is very important to make them good, stable parts of the world, none of that would be permitted under this legislation. That is unfortunate.

It is important for Canada to continue to play that important role. Think of all the projects around the world. In Afghanistan, which is our principal recipient of foreign aid, we are involved in things that go well beyond poverty reduction. We are training civil servants. We are helping people develop the institutions they need to run government. We are helping people with schools. Is a school part of poverty reduction or not? Is creating civil servants part of poverty reduction or not?

An argument could be made that those are not strict poverty reduction. The concern is that we will run into realm where that kind of activity to help people develop those institutions simply will not be permitted. For our government, those priorities of freedom, democracy, human rights and the rule of law have to remain paramount.

To illustrate this, Canada has been providing development assistance in some places to help people in civil society, for example to help women become more involved in their community and to defend their rights. That is nothing to do with poverty alleviation necessarily. It has to do with fairness, equality and justice, but those are issues we should be allowed to encourage and continue to support.

Similarly, in countries which continue to have authoritarian regimes that resist democracy, should we not be able to provide support for elements of civil society whether they wish to promote the environment or other democratic development? Should we be allowed, through our development, assistance to give opportunities for people to learn, to study, to acquire education elsewhere so they become more effective when they return home to their countries?

All these are important priorities and part of the tradition of development assistance for Canada and something that we should continue to do in our tradition of promoting democracy, human rights, rule of law and freedom, great Canadian values that should not be ruled out by this well-intentioned, but poorly written legislation.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank all members who participated in the debate. I appreciate both those who are for and I somewhat less appreciate those who are against. So many people said so many nice things about me that I feel like I have just come from my own funeral. I hope that does not auger poorly for the bill.

This continues to be and will always be an extremely important bill in order to focus our thoughts on what ODA is all about. What is official development assistance all about? Is it about poverty alleviation or is it about a whole bunch of other things? That is what this bill is about.

I appreciate that on the other side we received what I might call spiritual support for the notion of the bill. As in life, spirit does not pay the bills. I hope that we are strong enough and that we will see through this issue, so that we put some teeth in our official development assistance. The teeth are in this bill. The practicality is in this bill. Whatever else this bill is, it is not naive.

I do not dispute with the hon. member that we do other good things. I do not dispute that for a second. Our official development assistance must be focused on poverty alleviation and only on poverty alleviation.

If in fact those are values that we all adhere to and support, fine, then we will continue to do those things, but it will not come out of this particular budget. It will only count if it is in favour of poverty alleviation. Those are the issues and that is where the debate is to be joined.

I do not see this as a naive bill, with the greatest respect to my friend opposite. I see this as a bill that asks for accountability. Presumably accountability is something that this new government thinks is an important thing. Apparently, those members thought it was an important thing when they were in opposition, as Mr. Harper, Mr. Duceppe and Mr. Layton wrote to the then Prime Minister--

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

Order, please. I would remind the hon. member for Scarborough—Guildwood to refer to members by their title or riding.

[John McKay, Liberal, Scarborough—Guildwood, ON]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister, the leader of the Bloc Québécois and the leader of the NDP, and I apologize for using their names, wrote to the former Prime Minister and I quote:

We are writing to urge you to introduce legislation which establishes poverty reduction as the aim for Canada's Official Development Assistance (ODA). A legislated mandate for Canada's ODA would ensure that aid is provided in a manner both consistent with Canada's human rights--

Which is a concern raised by my friend opposite:

--and respectful of the perspectives of those living in poverty.

The bill tries to take into consideration those who are living in poverty.

That concept was supported by the foreign affairs committee in June 2005 and in the House on June 28, 2005, with all party support. By unanimous consent, it was resolved that the 12th Report of the Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Development be concurred in, which said:

To introduce legislation prior to the next federal budget which establishes poverty reduction as the priority for Canada’s Official Development Assistance--

As I have said, that is good in spirit, but spirit does not pay the bills. We now have an opportunity to actually put this legislation in place and we have some disappointing resistance on the part of the members of the Conservative Party. I would ask those members to reconsider their position.

In fact, this is an opportunity for the minister to be able to say, “I can only use my budget for poverty alleviation. That is the only thing. I cannot use it for security. I cannot use it for other noble goals. I can only use it for poverty alleviation”. That in itself will be a huge step of leadership on the part of our nation and, indeed, I would say on the part of this government, to focus its aid on poverty alleviation and only on poverty alleviation.

I thank members on all sides for speaking to the bill. I would urge members from the government party to reconsider their position, to review their previous commitments made to the previous government, and to act on them by supporting this bill.

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

It being 6:34 p.m., the time provided for debate has expired. Accordingly the question is on the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

No.

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

All those in favour of the motion will please say yea.

[Some hon. members]

Yea.

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

All those opposed will please say nay.

[Some hon. members]

Nay.

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

In my opinion the yeas have it.

And more than five members having risen:

Pursuant to Standing Order 93 the division stands deferred until Wednesday, September 20, immediately before the time provided for private members' business.

The House resumed from September 19 consideration of the motion that Bill C-293, An Act respecting the provision of development assistance abroad, be read the second time and referred to a committee.

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

It being 5:30 p.m., the House will now proceed to the taking of the deferred recorded division on the motion at second reading stage of Bill C-293 under private members' business.

Call in the members.

(The House divided on the motion, which was agreed to on the following division:)

Vote #34

[The Speaker, Peter Milliken]

I declare the motion carried. Consequently, this bill is referred to the Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Development.

(Bill read the second time and referred to a committee)