Bill C-15 (Historical)

Donkin Coal Block Development Opportunity Act

An Act respecting the exploitation of the Donkin coal block and employment in or in connection with the operation of a mine that is wholly or partly at the Donkin coal block, and to make a consequential amendment to the Canada--Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act

This enactment provides a legal regime to facilitate the exploitation of the Donkin coal block and to regulate employment in or in connection with the operation of any mine that is wholly or partly at the Donkin coal block. It gives the Governor in Council the authority to incorporate Nova Scotia laws into federal law by regulation, and gives Nova Scotia the power to enforce those laws. It further governs the royalties from the exploitation of the portion of the Donkin coal block in frontier lands, including providing for payment of the amount of the royalties to Nova Scotia after the royalties have been paid to the Receiver General. It also makes a consequential amendment to the Canada-Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act.

Donkin Coal Block Development Opportunity Act

[Jay Hill, Conservative, Prince George—Peace River, BC]

moved that Bill C-15, An Act respecting the exploitation of the Donkin coal block and employment in or in connection with the operation of a mine that is wholly or partly at the Donkin coal block, and to make a consequential amendment to the Canada--Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act, be read the second time and referred to a committee.

[Michael Chong, Conservative, Wellington—Halton Hills, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to have this opportunity to speak in support of Bill C-15.

As the minister mentioned, the bill would facilitate provincial management of the Donkin mine and provide a clear regulatory regime to government its development.

Bill C-15 presents real opportunities, not only for the people of Cape Breton but also for Canada. The passage of the bill has the real potential to usher in a new era for mining in Cape Breton and to continue the region's long history with this traditional industry.

Our government is standing up for workers and communities that rely on traditional industries. We recognize the vital role that the mining sector plays to ensure Canadian prosperity.

There is a strong mining presence in Canada from coast to coast and as far north as one can see. Canada is one of the largest mining nations in the world, producing over 60 minerals and metals. We are a world leader in the production of mining products, such as potash, uranium, aluminum and nickel. Canada ranks third in global production of diamonds in terms of value. Mining and mineral processing contributed some $40 billion to Canada's gross domestic product in 2006.

Twenty-five coal mines were in operation in Canada at the end of 2006. Most large scale coal mines are located in western Canada, in New Brunswick and in Nova Scotia.

Of all our fossil fuels, we know that coal produces the greatest amount of carbon dioxide, a greenhouse gas that contributes heavily to global warming. As a result, we are more conscious than ever that we need to develop clean alternatives and clean up fossil fuels.

In the area of renewable energy, we are investing $1.5 billion in wind, small hydro, tidal power, solar, biomass and geothermal energy.

As for coal, the energy source that Bill C-15 is related to, clean coal technologies are being developed in order to significantly lower the emissions from coal burning power plants and to reduce the environmental side effects of the coal industry as a whole.

The rapid growth of clean coal technologies is of the greatest interest to the Government of Canada. To that end, we have launched the ecoenergy technology initiative, a $230 million investment in the research, development and demonstration of clean energy technologies. A major component of this initiative is the development of the science and technology that will make our conventional energy sources cleaner.

The very first investment this government made under this initiative was in clean technology. Earlier this month, my colleague, the Minister of Natural Resources, announced an $11 million investment in federal funding for a project that will make Canada a world leader in clean coal technology. This project will be a joint undertaking by the Government of Canada and industry. It will support research in developing a coal gasification power plant that will turn sub-bituminous coal into synthetic gas and hydrogen.

It is a significant process with important implications. By converting coal into synthetic gas and by capturing and sequestering the resulting carbon dioxide, we can create electricity that is cleaner than that produced by the best natural gas facility operating today.

Through Natural Resources Canada's CANMET Energy Technology Centre, the government has been investing in the development of viable technology for near zero emission clean fossil fuel such as oxyfuel combustion. This centre has also developed a clean coal technology road map which outlines a vision for the development and implementation of clean coal technologies.

This technology will thus not only help us to reduce emissions of greenhouse gases, but also reduce air pollution. It will reduce greenhouse emissions to almost zero. Consequently, this clean coal technology will help Canada and countries around the globe educe greenhouse gases and pollution.

We must recognize that coal will continue to play an important role in our future and in the world's future. At the world level, coal accounts for about 25% of energy consumption and is used to produce 40% of the world's electricity supply. It will continue to be an important component of the energy mix in the foreseeable future. Therefore, we must do everything we can to clean up this resource and ensure it is used in a way that minimizes greenhouse gas emissions and pollution.

The history of coal mining in Cape Breton is well-known to members of this House and to all Canadians. Most of this mining was done under the sea, with the greatest subsea extension out from shore being almost four miles. It is very similar to some of the mining that I know took place in Nanaimo and on Vancouver Island which was also underneath the seabed.

The Donkin block is part of what is known as the Sydney coalfield, a resource that has made an enormous contribution to the Canadian economy. Total coal production for Nova Scotia between 1863 and the year 2000 was some 455 million tonnes, of which 72% was produced from the Sydney coalfield. This coalfield contains the largest coal resource in eastern Canada with 12 major seams. Donkin represents the most eastern extension of the Sydney coalfield that is accessible from the north coast of Cape Breton. It is the last primary block of unmined coal that can be mined from the coast.

The developer of the Donkin mine, as selected by the Nova Scotia government, is the Xstrata Donkin Mine Development Alliance. It expects to complete a feasibility study next year and production could start shortly thereafter. The coal that will be produced by the Donkin coal block development is a most valuable resource and one that will contribute to the economic well-being of Cape Bretoners and Canadians as a whole.

For the Cape Breton region, the Donkin mine will mean an additional 275 jobs directly, and indirectly, the project could generate another 700 jobs. Nationally, about 370,000 Canadians are employed in the mining and mineral processing industry. Canada's 1,200-plus exploration and mining companies operate in over 100 countries globally and hold over 8,700 mineral projects around the world, of which almost 50% are located outside of Canada.

A major challenge the mining sector faces in Canada is that our current regulatory regime is not keeping pace. Companies have expressed, time and time again, a complete frustration with our regulatory system, how it is too slow, too unpredictable and designed without efficiency.

Our government has recognized that we need to improve our system to adequately respond to our environmental priorities, which is why we have invested $150 million in increasing capacity in federal departments and in establishing a major projects management office. This new office will ensure that regulatory reviews are carried out with greater efficiency, transparency and coordination across departments.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to split my time with the member for Cypress Hills—Grasslands, if that is so amenable to you.

The benefits of mining in Canada are clear: $40 billion to our gross domestic product and 370,000 Canadian employed. Clear, too, is the benefit of facilitating a return of the mining industry to Cape Breton, a community that wants this development and a province that wants to move ahead.

Therefore, I call upon all my colleagues, both on this side of the House and on the opposite side, to support Bill C-15 and to move this project forward.

[The Deputy Speaker, NDP, Bill Blaikie]

I should bring to the attention of the hon. member that because this is the first round there is a requirement for unanimous consent if the hon. member wants to split his time. I will consider that the hon. member has sought the unanimous consent of the House to split his time with the hon. member for Cypress Hills—Grasslands. Is there unanimous consent?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Deputy Speaker, NDP, Bill Blaikie]

Everybody is in an agreeable mood today. We hope that lasts.

Questions and comments.

The hon. member for Cypress Hills--Grasslands.

[David Anderson, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Natural Resources and for the Canadian Wheat Board]

Mr. Speaker, we appreciate the spirit of cooperation that exists in the House. I am sure that is due to you being in the chair.

I am pleased today to introduce Bill C-15, An Act respecting the exploitation of the Donkin coal block. This bill demonstrates once again that our government is committed to building a stronger, safer and better Canada.

We are committed to encouraging economic development in all regions of this country and to create job opportunities for all Canadians, regardless of where they live. For the people of Cape Breton, Bill C-15 would help to create that opportunity for economic development.

I will begin by explaining the resource, the Donkin coal block, that the legislation deals with. The Donkin coal block is a large, economically promising coal vein located off Cape Breton Island. In fact, it is the last major undeveloped subsea coal resource in the Cape Breton region.

It has been described as the largest undeveloped coal resource in all of eastern Canada. Both the province and the federal government have obligations regulating the development of the Donkin coal resource block, including labour, health and safety matters.

The immediate objectives of the bill are to facilitate the provincial management of the mine by Nova Scotia and to provide a clear regulatory regime to govern its development. This legislation would also allow both levels of government to retain their current positions with respect to regulatory jurisdiction.

Beyond these immediate objectives, however, a larger purpose is being served. The legislation would provide Cape Breton with an opportunity to advance its own economic development. It does so by facilitating a return to Cape Breton's time honoured industrial tradition of mining coal.

Some very clear benefits will follow the development of the Donkin mine. To begin with, mining will once again bring good jobs to this traditional mining region of Canada. The development of the Donkin mine is forecast to create 275 direct and up to 700 indirect jobs.

Development of the mine could also mean hundreds of millions of dollars to the provincial economy in salaries, equipment and goods and services. Three hundred million dollars is expected to be spent in start-up investments alone and coal royalties will be in the range of up to $5 million annually.

Finally, the development of the Donkin will help stabilize the tax base of this community for many years. If it gets to the development stage, we expect to see at least 10 years of operations.

Coal was first mined in Cape Breton 322 years ago. The island was settled because of coal and coal mining was its livelihood for hundreds of years. Most of this mining was done under the bottom of the sea with the greatest subsea extension out from shore being almost four miles.

In the mid-1980s, the Cape Breton Development Corporation, DEVCO, spent $80 million to dig two exploratory tunnels from the shore out to the face of the Donkin block. However, the mine was never brought into production. The tunnels were sealed and flooded to avoid pumping costs. DEVCO closed its last Cape Breton mine in 2001.

Since the closure of the last mine on Cape Breton, energy prices, including coal prices, have dramatically increased. This and newer technology, such as clean coal technology and carbon capture and storage, have renewed interest in coal as an energy source and renewed interest in the Donkin project.

There are numerous advantages to the Donkin site. For example, the Donkin block is located in a proven mining district with a long history of safe and successful extraction. The block appears to have sufficient size, potential and access to domestic and international markets for industry to stand on its own financially. The passage of Bill C-15 will help to determine whether this is so. Nearby there is a local workforce with extensive underground coal mining experience, a workforce that welcomes the return of coal mining jobs.

The block is near a railway connection and two deepwater ports equipped to export coal to an international market.

Finally, the Donkin site has a valuable asset in the two exploratory tunnels which are already driven to the face.

Nova Scotia announced a call for proposals to develop the Donkin coal block in 2004. A year later, a company by the name of Xstrata was announced as the winning bidder. The Xstrata Donkin Coal Mine Development Alliance began to evaluate the potential of bringing the Donkin mine back into production. It was at this point at which a considerable challenge arose. It was clear that if Xstrata or any company decided to proceed with development there would be confusion and uncertainty over regulatory jurisdiction because both the Governments of Canada and Nova Scotia have ownership claims to the offshore.

It was also clear that Xstrata Donkin Coal Development Alliance would soon face major decisions on whether to proceed with development or not. Because regulatory matters affect cost and planning, Xstrata was in need of certainty over the applicable regulatory regime before its decision could be properly made.

Both the governments of Canada and Nova Scotia shared an interest, as they do today, in seeing further economic opportunity in Cape Breton. Therefore, both governments sat down together to find a solution that would provide Xstrata with a clear regulatory regime that would permit development to proceed, if that decision was made, and to do all this without jeopardizing either government's claim to jurisdiction.

The bill before us today is that solution. Essentially the bill permits existing provincial laws regarding matters such as labour standards, labour relations, resource development and occupational health and safety to be incorporated into federal law. The administration of these laws is then delegated to the province of Nova Scotia. This will permit a clear and single regulatory system to be established for Donkin Coal Development. It will also permit both levels of government to retain their current positions with respect to regulatory jurisdiction while facilitating the economic development of Cape Breton Island. This is a solution that works for everyone.

The bill also provides that all Donkin coal and coal bed methane royalties will be collected by Nova Scotia and remitted to the Receiver General for Canada. A remittance in that same amount will then be turned back over to the province. In other words, the province will receive the benefit of all royalties if the mine goes ahead.

The components of this bill may appear complex, but their intent is quite simple. The bill provides Cape Breton, and Nova Scotia, with greater opportunity for economic development. It permits the development of the Donkin mine to proceed under an appropriately designed regulatory regime and it facilitates provincial management of the endeavour.

It is important to emphasize that Bill C-15 does not guarantee the development of the Donkin mine. It guarantees that the decision to proceed or not to proceed will be free from any uncertainty regarding regulatory matters.

I would emphasize that Bill C-15 is an outstanding example of cooperation. It is an example of cooperation between governments to fulfill a common interest in seeing the development of the Donkin mine.

By introducing this legislation, the government is demonstrating its commitment to the economic development of the Cape Breton community and to Nova Scotia as a whole.

Bill C-15 applies directly to the development of the Donkin mine, but our government has also taken national initiatives to support the mining sector. Since coming to office 21 months ago, our government has taken consistent action to reduce the tax burden on Canadian businesses, including those in the mining sector.

Our mining sector presents extraordinary opportunities across Canada and our government will help seize those opportunities by providing a single window for major projects approval. The major projects management office provides a single point of entry into the federal government for the approval of proposed projects. This is going to improve our ability to apply our world class environmental standards while increasing regulatory efficiency.

Before I finish, I would like to acknowledge the hard work of my colleagues, the hon. member for Central Nova and the hon. member for South Shore—St. Margaret's and the support they have given in moving this file forward.

I would now ask all hon. members to support the opportunity that the legislation represents.

[Alan Tonks, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Speaker, under the terms of this bill, the federal government is transferring responsibility with respect to the administration of occupational health and safety to the province of Nova Scotia.

We are all reminded of the terrible tragedy and the events that occurred around the Westray mine disaster. Is the member and the government totally satisfied that under the terms and conditions and the process by which this transfer has taken place to the province of Nova Scotia, those provisions of the occupational health and safety act will be entrenched in the province? Is the federal government satisfied that the province will carry out the intent and spirit of the occupational health and safety legislation in order that that kind of tragedy would never occur again?

[David Anderson, Conservative, Cypress Hills—Grasslands, SK]

Mr. Speaker, there has been a lot of work done between the government of Nova Scotia and the federal government on exactly these issues.

There were a number of provincial acts and federal acts that were brought into agreement so that the provincial government could administer them. HRSD and labour program officials undertook a comparison of provincial and federal regulations with regard to coal mining regulations. The changes have been made to bring Nova Scotia's regulations into line with federal law so that they can be incorporated into federal law and then they will be applying that law.

We think that the due diligence has been done on these issues and that the regulatory system that is going to be in place is going to be a good one for the mine, for Nova Scotia and for the country of Canada as well.

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleagues across the way from Cypress Hills--Grasslands and Wellington--Halton Hills for their comments on this legislation.

It is good to see this legislation finally come forward. Negotiations between the province and the federal government have been ongoing for a number of years. I think back to the last election and my Conservative opponent at the time said that the foot dragging on the part of the then Liberal government was going to negate a great opportunity to develop the Donkin mine site. He also said that when his party was elected as government, this issue would immediately come forward. Two years later, it is finally coming forward.

It is necessary that this take place. It is certainly what we were working toward back then. There were long, arduous and protracted negotiations between the two levels of government, but the legislation is here today, and it is a positive thing for the people of Cape Breton, for the people of Nova Scotia, and for the people of Canada as a whole.

As my colleagues have indicated through their comments, the history of coal mining in Cape Breton dates back over 300 years. Coal was discovered in Cow Bay, which is now Port Morien. That coal was shipped to Louisbourg and provided heat for the Fortress of Louisbourg during the years of development.

Coal has been mined in Cape Breton for numerous years. It fired up the engines of our navy's boats in both world wars. It has contributed to industry in central and western Canada. Cape Breton coal has powered much of what Canada is as a country. We have a proud and rich tradition of coal mining in Cape Breton.

What we support in Cape Breton is submarine mining and underground mining. There is a great deal of opposition and concern around surface mining. We cannot confuse the two. We want to make that clear. The legislation before us today is about underground mining.

Work started on the Donkin project back in 1970. I will share quickly a story with my colleagues across the way. As a young university student during a summer in the late 1970s, I and three friends took up a contract to help clear the land on the Donkin site. We were paid a certain amount for every acre that we cleared and the pulp that we felled and the brush that we burned. It was during that summer that I realized I was not going to make my living as a woodsman in the woods of Cape Breton. However, it was a great opportunity.

Shortly thereafter, because of the situation with OPEC, Devco pursued the Donkin opportunity. It drilled two tunnels three and a half miles out in the ocean and about 200 metres down. Things changed and the price of coal altered quite a bit on the world market, and the project was shelved and the mines were flooded. Currently, the world price for coal is at an all-time high. It is now about $95 a tonne.

We on this side of the House are very committed to long term, sustainable energy opportunities. Cape Breton is seeing an increase in sustainable energy initiatives, such as Cape Breton Power's incorporating windmills in many places where coal mines used to exist. They are making a contribution to the overall energy package for the people of Nova Scotia, but there still remains a high demand for energy. As has been indicated, 40% of the world's energy still comes from fossil fuels. We cannot be intimidated by that and dismiss coal as a source of energy.

In some of the investments that have been made, it is important that we as the nation of Canada get out in front on some of this clean coal technology. We have certainly done that to date and continue to do it. I had the great opportunity to see the NRCan facility in Bells Corners and some of the work it has undertaken with clean coal technology. It is truly impressive.

We have seen the demand outside our borders, such as in China, and that is only going to increase.

It should be Canadian technology that leads the way in solving the CO₂ problems. We have seen the investment that has been made at the CANMET site in CO₂ sequestration by capturing and sequestering the CO₂ in the ground. The technology has come so far so fast. As a nation we have to continue to invest in that type of technology so that we can continue to decrease our carbon footprint.

In essence, the province of Nova Scotia through this legislation will be the regulator. There will be federal regulations for the site, but they will be applied by the province of Nova Scotia. That will look at resource development, labour standards, occupational health and labour issues. All of those things will be administered by the province of Nova Scotia under this legislation.

As had been mentioned by the previous speaker, Xstrata is currently developing the Donkin site. Xstrata is an international player in the minerals exploitation community. It has the fiscal and technical capabilities of taking on a project of this size. It is a very large, complex mining project under sea considering the dangers of undersea mining. It is the world's largest producer and exporter of thermal coal. It is one of the top five producers of coking and metallurgical coal.

Xstrata has 43,000 employees worldwide. It has operations in Australia, Germany, Norway and South Africa. It is a tremendous player in the coal market. It has an excellent record on health and safety and environmental issues. It is very excited about this Donkin project.

I had the opportunity to speak with Darren Nicholls, the project manager. He shared with me the fact that he could not see this project going any better. The company is very pleased with the way it has gone to date. The company is very supportive of this piece of legislation. It may want to tweak things a bit, which can be done within the regulations, but the company is supportive of this legislation.

It has done a good job since it has come to Cape Breton in getting involved in the community. I was very impressed with that. This past year I had the opportunity to go to Donkin. The Donkin development association just finished a project. It opened a passive park area adjacent to a school, Veterans Memorial Park. Xstrata played a fairly significant role. It worked with the councillor, Kevin Saccary, and a community group of volunteers and developed a park, very much supported by the community. Xstrata stood shoulder to shoulder with community members and helped deliver on this. That is an indication the company cares about the community and is willing to invest in it.

As I had said, the federal position was that federal laws were applicable in this situation and there was an obligation to enforce them. However, it is very pleased that the province of Nova Scotia, wanting to exploit this resource, is entering into a agreement that would address labour relations, labour standards and occupational health concerns.

As well, it has been indicated before that pieces of infrastructure are there now. Rail spurs are there now as well as a deepwater port. However, that comes to another part of what will be necessary with the opening of Donkin mine.

We have a very active port in Sydney, with a coal mixing area. Provincial Energy currently mixes coal at the Sydney harbour site. However, there is a dredging problem. We hope the government will see the merit and the importance, through the Atlantic gateway initiative it is putting forward, of dredging the Sydney harbour.

Currently there is about 45 feet of clearance. Right now it is shipping partial loads with some of its coal transfer. In order to take full boats, we hope the government will be able to invest in Sydney harbour, look at the dredging project put forward by the community and the harbour authority and assist with that. It is more of a bump in the midst of Sydney harbour, but it would go a great way in unlocking the full potential of that harbour.

This initiative would have tremendous benefits for the people of Cape Breton, in Glace Bay and broader areas. We have a rich coal mining tradition. A good friend of mine, Billy Delaney, said that Glace Bay was a child of industry and without it we would be an orphan.

We have come a long way, too. In the late 1990s our unemployment rate was on either side of 25%. Now we are currently down around 12% or 13%. There is still a fair amount of seasonal employment. A lot of guys working out west who are coming home and the money is coming back home. That is not the ideal situation. We still need that anchor industry. Our community understands fully that this is a tremendous opportunity, and we look forward to it. There will be 275 jobs. We know that jobs within the mining sector usually pay 3:1 or 4:1 in other job developments. Therefore, we think that will be a shot in the arm.

I know that some of those guys who are working out west now are looking forward to coming back and resuming mining careers. We have young people who are very interested in getting started in the mining industry. I know the industry will get 275 guys who will make that mine hum and it will be nothing but successful.

We anticipate in the order of $300 million in startup costs for an initiative of this size. As well, the coal royalties will be paid to the federal government and then they will be fully remitted back to the province. We anticipate approximately $5 million annually in coal royalties that will stem from the Donkin project.

Darren Nicholls and the Xstrata people are extremely excited about the legislation coming forward and this opportunity.

I had the opportunity to speak with District 26 United Mine Workers president, Bobby Burchell, just recently. The union is pleased with this as well. It was consulted earlier on this project, back in April and May. No major concerns have been expressed, but the union believes it can address whatever the concerns might be, through the regulations.

Again, it is an important day for the people of Cape Breton—Canso. It is an important day for this broader community. We have been through a lot as a community. We are seeing our economy transition. Things are okay.

During the briefing, the comment was made that it would bring much needed jobs to an economically depressed area of the country, which was kind of interesting. We are past that now. I think the members of the House, who have been to Cape Breton, can see that. I have a colleague from Nova Scotia who can see that. We are not Mississauga or Kelowna yet, but things are going okay. However, this will be a tremendous shot in the arm as we continue. While this is a retooling of the economy, it is the old game coming back that will make a contribution.

Some of the estimates put forward today in the speeches have probably been somewhat conservative, that the mine might operate for 10 years. There is probably potential for even greater operation past 10 years, and some of them have been up to 25 years. They may be ambitious, but nonetheless, with the legislation there is very little we can find that would prove to be any problem whatsoever.

My colleague was asked a question about the Westray incident. I believe the province of Nova Scotia has learned a great deal through the Westray experience. Through consultations, the federal government has clearly outlined its expectations. The province of Nova Scotia will be required to and will administer those regulations to the best of its ability.

It is without reservation that I will work with my party to support the legislation to ensure it goes forward. We hope it will provide a tremendous opportunity for the people of Cape Breton.

[David Anderson, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Natural Resources and for the Canadian Wheat Board]

Mr. Speaker, as I mentioned before, the hon. member for Central Nova and the member for South Shore—St. Margaret's have worked hard on the bill. I know this has been important as well to the member for Cape Breton—Canso. I thank him and I appreciate the efforts he has put into informing his colleagues of the importance of the bill and getting them on side. We look forward to working with the other parties as well to pass the bill as quickly as possible.

Could the hon. member address the issue of the urgency to pass the legislation and maybe talk a bit about the importance of some of the coming deadlines for Xstrata, so people can understand it is important that the bill be passed as quickly as possible?

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I know Xstrata has been patient as have the people who have worked on this file. It is always a concern. It was brought up that the project may fall apart if this were not in place. They are saying now that we should get this done and off the table so we know with what we are dealing. They say that the parameters should be set so as we go into this everybody will be on the same page.

The province of Nova Scotia is in the process of putting forward its legislation. It may be done on a parallel track.

I will do everything on this side of the House. I will work with my colleagues and hopefully we can fast track this. If so, everybody wins.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for his speech and his passion. It is clear that this issue is close to his heart, and his arguments were masterful. He seems pleased that Nova Scotia and the federal government have come to an agreement, made some compromises and harmonized their laws and regulations so that the mine can finally be operated.

I have a question for my colleague. The federal government has demonstrated its openness. Is my colleague prepared to support the Bloc Québécois when it asks the federal government to respect the Charter of the French Language, which means adapting the Official Languages Act and the Canada Labour Code in order to apply Quebec's Bill 101 so that all federal institutions and workers can work in Quebec's official language?

Given that Nova Scotia has benefited from the federal government's openness and flexibility, I would like to know whether the member thinks that the government will be open to respecting Quebec's Charter of the French Language within the Official Languages Act and the Canada Labour Code.

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I agree that having the provincial and the federal governments come together for some kind of an agreement is somewhat monumental. In the period of time that it has taken we have to exhibit patience. I wish the Bloc all the best in seeing this through to fruition.

What I have commented on today is the fact that our opposition party will support the government on this legislation. We are very pleased that the federal government has worked with the province of Nova Scotia to see this through. We think it will provide a great opportunity for the people of our area. We think it will provide a safe and productive workplace for at least 250 people from my community. On this one, it is an example that there are those opportunities where the federal and provincial governments can work together.

In this case, we will support the government, and we applaud it.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to speak to Bill C-15, An Act respecting the exploitation of the Donkin coal block and employment in or in connection with the operation of a mine that is wholly or partly at the Donkin coal block, and to make a consequential amendment to the Canada--Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act.

I would like to begin by telling the House that the Bloc Québécois supports Bill C-15 in principle. My colleague from Nova Scotia can count on the Bloc's support. Members of the Standing Committee on Natural Resources will study this bill seriously and thoroughly.

The Bloc Québécois believes that the federal government should do more for regional economic development. It should stop undermining the efforts that provincial governments—particularly the Government of Quebec, since I am a member from Quebec—want to make by respecting the priorities set by the provinces.

For members of the Bloc Québécois, creating and maintaining jobs in the regions, as well as providing assistance to workers in difficulty, such as those in the forestry or fishing sectors, is just as important in Quebec as it is elsewhere. In our view, this Conservative government is washing its hands of the whole issue, by refusing to propose any support programs for older workers—we mean real income support for older workers—or change the employment insurance criteria, and by renouncing its earlier ideas concerning the creation of an independent employment insurance fund.

In short, all too often, the federal government listens to reason and develops legislation and policies to promote this regional development. Fortunately for Nova Scotia, that is what it is doing with the Donkin coal mine project.

Furthermore, the efforts of the elected representatives of that riding cannot be overlooked. According to my colleague, they fought to convince the government that enough time had been wasted and it was time to act. Thus, it has been a happy ending for Nova Scotia and it appears that everyone is finally happy with the agreement.

The Bloc Québécois' position is that, since Bill C-15 is the result of an agreement between the federal government and the Government of Nova Scotia and has to do with a specific case, that is, the Donkin coal mine, and since there are no direct repercussions for Quebec, the Bloc Québécois does not intend to oppose it. We will work hard in committee, as I was saying, to push the bill through as quickly as possible.

A word of caution, however: being in favour of the principle of the bill does not mean that we have absolutely no problem with the spirit of the bill. I alluded to this a little earlier when I asked my question. We deplore the fact that the federal government is prepared to incorporate provincial legislation by reference when it comes to creating 275 jobs, but that it is not willing to do so, far from it, when it is a question of the language of work, for instance. I will come back to this.

Lastly, with its trademark rigour and hard work, the Bloc Québécois will examine the provisions of Bill C-15 that raise questions. This is the case, for instance, when it comes to the sharing of royalties and the exclusion of royalties on coal-bed methane from the Canada-Nova Scotia offshore petroleum resources accord.

In the matter of offshore revenues, this Conservative government is acting against the interests of Quebec because the equalization formula does not take into account all revenue from natural resources and therefore penalizes Quebeckers.

For the time being, I would prefer to focus on the main objective of Bill C-15. I would like to point out, and it is truly important to say so, that this bill is the result of an agreement between the federal government and the Government of Nova Scotia, which seeks primarily to settle a jurisdictional matter. These two governments both claim to have jurisdiction over the Donkin coal block. Many discussions have taken place to establish who has jurisdiction over the management and exploitation of the Donkin coal block.

To settle this issue, Nova Scotia and the federal government arrived at an agreement: establish a single set of regulations governing resource development and labour issues, including industrial relations, occupational health and safety and labour standards

The regime proposed by this bill may be divided into three parts.

It provides a legal regime to facilitate the exploitation of the Donkin coal block. It gives the Governor in Council the authority to incorporate Nova Scotia laws into federal law by regulation, and gives Nova Scotia the power to enforce those laws.

Bill C-15 further governs the royalties from the exploitation of the Donkin coal block, through a system similar to the existing one for petroleum royalties.

It also amends the Canada—Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act to exclude coal bed methane associated with a coal mine.

I would like to point out to this House that coal bed methane is the natural gas found in most coal seams. It is considered to be the cleanest burning fossil fuel and one of the purest forms of natural gas, often so pure that it only requires slight processing and can be delivered directly by pipelines.

The first of these three items, the legal reference regime, is dealt with in clauses 13 and 15, which are the core of Bill C-15.

Clause 13 states that the Governor in Council may make regulations excluding from the application of the Canada Labour Code any employment in connection with the operation of the Donkin coal block.

Furthermore, it allows the Governor in Council to make regulations to incorporate by reference any act of the Province of Nova Scotia to make it applicable to the Donkin mine workers.

Clause 15 states that an authority designated by the province, and not federal institutions, is responsible for applying the regulations incorporated by reference.

Bill C-15 allows the federal government to exempt workers of the Donkin mine from its own legislation in favour of Nova Scotia's legislation.

For the second point, clauses 9 to 12 of Bill C-15 address the issue of royalties specifically. They establish a system similar to the one that already exists for oil royalties, namely that the royalties on coal and coal bed methane are to be collected by the Receiver General of Canada and a portion will be remitted to the province in accordance with the terms of an agreement to be reached between them.

Third, the purpose of clause 16 is to amend the Canada-Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act in order to exclude coal bed methane associated with the development or operation of a coal mine from the definition of natural gas and therefore exclude it from the accord.

Let us now come back to the offshore revenues I was talking about earlier. Budget 2007 announced an equalization reform that unduly favoured the provinces receiving revenues from natural resources and blatantly ignored some of Quebec's basic requests.

What is more, on October 10, 2007, the Prime Minister of Canada and the Premier of Nova Scotia announced an agreement between that province and the federal government on equalization reform.

The federal government announced it would relax the application standards of the equalization formula. Budget 2007 allowed Nova Scotia to choose between two equalization formulas. It could either use the old formula and continue to receive 100% compensation for offshore development, or it could choose the new equalization formula whereby basic equalization payments increase but compensation for offshore development decreases. Nova Scotia could choose to stick with the old calculation method, but once it used the new equalization calculation it could no longer go back to the old formula.

The announcement on October 10 changed all that. Nova Scotia can now choose the formula that is most advantageous to it at the beginning of each fiscal year, until the expiry of the Atlantic accords in 2020.

In order to enjoy the benefits of future offshore projects, Nova Scotia had chosen to retain the old equalization formula. If it had adopted the new formula, it would have received additional equalization payments estimated by the provincial government at $289 million for 2008-09. The new formula will therefore let Nova Scotia keep additional amounts calculated under the new formula and it can return to the old formula if the development of new offshore platforms makes the old formula more advantageous.

The reason that this is to Nova Scotia’s benefit is that, in our opinion, it is still being done at Quebec’s expense: the equalization formula still does not take all natural resource revenues into account.

So that formula does not reflect what Quebec is calling for. It contains loopholes that favour the fossil fuel producing provinces by allowing them to exempt natural resource revenues from the equalization formula.

Quebec is calling for the equalization formula to be reformed to reflect a 10-province standard, 100% of natural resource revenues and the real value of property taxes. That is the only formula that will result in equalization achieving its objective, which is to provide the receiving provinces with a per capita fiscal capacity equivalent to the Canadian average. It seems that the Conservative government is not worried about that, though.

Let us come back to the language of work. It must be noted that when it comes to creating 275 jobs, something we applaud, the federal government is prepared to incorporate the laws of Nova Scotia by reference. But the government does not want to consider incorporating compliance with the language of work provisions of Quebec’s Bill 101 by reference.

And yet this is the government that boasts about recognizing that Quebeckers form a nation. To date, that recognition has not been supported by any actions or consequences, although what it means is that the House of Commons recognizes the attributes of the Quebec nation, and in particular its language and culture, by definition.

In fact, when the House of Commons recognized the Quebec nation last fall, the Bloc Québécois emphatically pointed out that that recognition had to have consequences, that there could not simply be purely symbolic recognition.

The official language of Quebec is French, everywhere in Quebec, except in matters relating to the federal government, for which there are two official languages.

That is the first concrete action that must be taken: to recognize that in fact Quebeckers form a francophone nation in America. If the Canadian parties are consistent in that recognition, they will have to understand that the Quebec nation and the French language are inseparably connected. Recognizing one means recognizing the other.

The Quebec nation has developed a tool for ensuring that French is the common public language: the Charter of the French Language or Bill 101. We often forget, though, that insofar as Ottawa is concerned, Bill 101 does not exist. As a result, areas under federal jurisdiction are exempted, including within Quebec. For example, banks, telecommunication firms, interprovincial transportation companies such as CN and CP, ports and airports are exempt from Bill 101.

The Bloc Québécois wants the federal government, therefore, to recognize and abide by the Charter of the French Language in Quebec in the Official Languages Act and comply with the spirit of the Charter in regard to the language of signage and of work in related legislation.

Contrary to what the Conservatives have suggested, the Bloc Québécois is obviously not asking the federal government to interfere in linguistic issues in Quebec. All we want is for the federal government to comply with the Charter of the French Language. The Official Languages Act and the Canada Labour Code are both federal.

The Canada Labour Code already requires the federal government to adjust to provincial legislation when setting minimum wages. In Bill C-15, the Conservative government agrees to exempt workers from its legislation in deference to the laws of Nova Scotia. If it is possible to adjust the federal legislation in both these cases, how can they justify refusing to adjust the federal legislation on language?

Federal or federally regulated companies are not affected by the Charter of the French Language, particularly insofar as the language of work is concerned. Some of these companies choose to abide by it, but it is all entirely voluntary.

The Bloc Québécois wants the Canada Labour Code to contain a provision, therefore, that “any federal work, undertaking or business carrying on activities in Quebec is subject to the requirements of the Charter of the French Language”. This would comply with the request voiced in 2001 in the Larose report.

This amendment would eliminate the legal void that enables federal companies to flout the Charter of the French Language when it comes to the language of work. It is important, though, to note that many federal companies decide on their own to abide by the francization programs of the Office de la langue française.

Nevertheless, some federal companies fail to comply with Bill 101 and do so with impunity. Since 2000, some 147 files have been closed at the Office de la langue française because it could not do anything in view of the fact that the companies were under federal jurisdiction. These figures refer only to files that were opened in response to complaints. If no one complains, no file is opened. We can conclude, therefore, that the number of delinquent firms was probably higher.

This was a long aside to explain why we are happy that Nova Scotia and the federal government have managed to reach an agreement by negotiating an accord to abide by the provincial legislation and that the federal government demonstrated a real openness in this case. We are asking for much the same thing.

In conclusion, I would like to reiterate the position of the Bloc Québécois: since Bill C-15 is the result of an agreement between the federal government and Nova Scotia, and it deals with a particular situation, the Bloc will not oppose it and will agree in principle.

However, I will not forget this precedent. And I will make sure that I remind the Canadian government about this type of legislative adjustment it offers to some provinces but not others. I pledge to remind the government of this precedent when we debate this issue in the House of Commons.

[Alan Tonks, Liberal, York South—Weston, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I have the pleasure to sit on the natural resources committee with the member for Beauharnois—Salaberry. Her speech is in keeping with the hard work that she does on that committee.

I was drawn particularly to the part of her speech that deals with coal fed methane. She had indicated that as a result of the CO₂ capture and sequestration approaches through the gasification process of clean coal that there was a tremendous opportunity, at a scale I would think, that clean coal could be part of a national energy framework or strategy.

Is the member satisfied that the committee in its deliberations is taking into account the opportunities with respect to clean coal, especially with the research work that is being done at CANMET at Bells Corners? Is she satisfied that the committee has taken the opportunities of clean coal and coal fed methane as part of a national strategy? Would she have any suggestions if she is not satisfied as to how we could have the committee focus in on the opportunities that she has outlined in her comments?

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague from the Standing Committee on Natural Resources for his question. Many committee members are concerned about the issue of natural gas and coal bed methane. And it is a subject we would like to debate in committee in the coming weeks, looking first at the International Energy Agency's assessment of natural gas energy projections.

Last week, this agency issued a report, which assessed projections of Canada's energy needs. In this report, natural gas is examined as an attractive fuel. However, we must still take a hard look at how fossil fuels are being used because it must be said, and I think my colleague will agree with me, that they are the main emitter of greenhouse gases. We must find solutions, either by capturing them or storing them.

I think—and my colleague will agree—that research and development for these technologies currently lacks support to produce results in the near future that could be used more quickly, for example, by those operating coal mines.

[Nicole Demers, Bloc, Laval, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for her presentation, which has given us an understanding of what is involved in this bill, which some of us initially found a bit unclear.

Having listened to what she had to say, I would like to know one thing. Clause 13 provides that the Governor in Council may make regulations excluding any employment in connection with the operation of the Donkin coal block from the application of the Canada Labour Code.

Does that mean that employees working at the Donkin coal mine will not be subject to the Canada Labour Code and will therefore have the same working conditions as all workers in Nova Scotia? Consequently, if anti-scab legislation were in effect in Nova Scotia, could these employees also benefit from it, unlike other employees governed by the Canada Labour Code, who cannot benefit from such legislation?

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for her question. I believe she has a good understanding of the legislative arrangements negotiated between Nova Scotia and the federal government. What this clause means is that workers in the Donkin mine will be covered by the laws of Nova Scotia and not by the Canada Labour Code.

In fact, this is a successful outcome. This agreement was many years in the making, and local elected representatives took great pains to make the federal government understand how important the agreement is to their community, to economic development, to job creation in these sectors and to their image.

I want to say—and I am sure my colleague understands why I am stressing this—that we in the Bloc Québécois hope that the Conservative government will be just as open to amending the Canada Labour Code and the Official Languages Act in order to recognize the Charter of the French Language and our Bill 101.

To that end, the Bloc Québécois hopes to receive the support of the opposition members and the Conservative government, of course.

[Yves Lessard, Bloc, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we can learn a number of things from this bill. First of all, it shows that sometimes, jurisdiction over natural resources can overlap.

For example, there is a mine in northwestern Quebec, the Siscoe mine, that had to shut down a few years ago because of plans to dig under Lac Siscoe. Apparently, there was water getting in and so on. A practical difficulty arose, and the mine operators had to deal with it alone. We have some important lessons to learn from that.

I would like to congratulate my colleague on her excellent speech. Now I would like her to comment further on similarities between the exceptions that could apply to this mine, and the French language situation she mentioned.

Earlier, it was made clear that the purpose of the bill the Bloc introduced this morning was to make the federal government comply with Bill 101. To illustrate the proposal, our colleague mentioned the Larose commission, which issued very clear recommendations for Quebec in that respect.

Can my colleague expand on the recommendations that the Government of Quebec is hesitating to act on, but that deserve to be acted on?

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank the hon. member for his question. As an answer to my colleague's question I will cite the Larose report of the major commission in Quebec that studied the issue of language in 2001:

The francization of the workplace in Quebec also concerns the workplace of the federal government and workplaces under federal jurisdiction. That is why the Government of Canada should take the necessary measures to ensure that these workplaces respect language legislation when they are in Quebec.

I believe this quote from the Larose commission report in Quebec is quite simple.

We are glad that Nova Scotia was able to reach an agreement with the federal government and that it could apply its own legislation to operate the Donkin mine and enjoy all the positive economic effects.

Once again, I call on the government and all the parties here in the House of Commons to take concrete action. To recognize the nation of Quebec is to recognize its official language and federal legislation can be adapted accordingly. In this case I am referring to the Official Languages Act and the Canada Labour Code.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

We have enough time for one, last, very short question. The hon. member for Jeanne-Le Ber.

[Thierry St-Cyr, Bloc, Jeanne-Le Ber, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I will ask my question as quickly as possible. We have talked a little bit about equalization and the Atlantic accord in this bill. It strikes me as odd that the federal government has decided to exclude certain types of revenues from the equalization calculation.

The basic purpose of this calculation is to ensure that all the provinces have the same fiscal capacity. The capacity of the provinces is calculated and money is given to the provinces that do not have enough. At the end of the day, we are in a rather absurd situation where only the Bloc Québécois is currently defending the very essence of equalization, which is to ensure equal revenues for all the provinces. Is that not ironic?

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

The hon. member for Beauharnois—Salaberry has 30 seconds to reply.

[Claude DeBellefeuille, Bloc, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to remind the members that Quebec has been demanding an overhaul of the equalization formula to take into account a 10-province standard, which means 100% of natural resource revenue based on the true value of property taxes. The Bloc Québécois is bringing that demand to the debate here in the House of Commons.

[Gerald Keddy, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency]

Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure to rise and speak on Bill C-15, the Donkin Coal Block Development Opportunity Act. This is an act that is extremely important to the province of Nova Scotia and certainly to the island of Cape Breton.

Before I begin my remarks, I have a brief comment on the comments by my Bloc colleague. I think this act is an example of how the federal government and provincial governments, in this case the province of Nova Scotia, can work cooperatively for the better good of both. This act is not trying to drive divisions between areas.

The member for the Bloc is a member of the natural resources committee. She would be well aware that Nova Scotia's mining regulations, in particular the underground regulatory regime for coal mines and underground mines, are some of the best in the world because of the disaster that occurred at the Westray mine during the explosion there and the loss of those miners, which is still certainly in the minds of all Nova Scotians today. The laws have been improved because of that disaster and the regulatory regime that exists there has some of the best regulations in Canada.

To be clear, what is going to happen here is a single regulator in terms of resource development and labour matters. That regulator will be the Province of Nova Scotia. It will be facilitated by incorporating the provincial legislation into federal law and delegating to the province responsibility to administer these new federal laws. I want to be clear on how that will happen.

As I have mentioned, this legislation is about cooperation. It is not about driving wedges. It is not about causing a schematic shift across the country to pit one province against another province or one part of the country or one region of the country against another. This is a good, practical solution to an ongoing jurisdictional discussion between the Province of Nova Scotia and the Government of Canada.

Bill C-15 is an excellent example of what can be accomplished when we sit down and are committed to finding solutions. We are not committed to trying to find a way to pick a fight and cause an ongoing schism in the federation. We are committed to actually finding a solution.

The Government of Canada and the Government of Nova Scotia have worked cooperatively to ensure that Cape Breton benefits from this economic opportunity. As the Minister of Natural Resources has mentioned, Donkin is the last major undeveloped or underdeveloped coal resource off Cape Breton Island. This resource is not underground on Cape Breton Island. This resource is underground offshore Cape Breton Island. We need to be very clear about where this resource lies.

This legislation presents an excellent opportunity not only for the people of Cape Breton and Nova Scotians, but we expect that when the Donkin mine is open and in full operation it could create up to 275 jobs. This is extremely important to the province of Nova Scotia and the island of Cape Breton in particular. Indirectly, the project could generate 700 jobs. This is very good news for an area which in the past few decades has seen the decline of its coal and steel industries. The salaries, the equipment purchases and the sales of goods and services associated with Donkin could provide hundreds of millions of dollars to the economies of Cape Breton and Nova Scotia.

I will give members a bit of history on the development of the Donkin mine and coal in Cape Breton. Certainly, the region was settled because of coal, and coal mining has been the main livelihood for more than the past 100 years. On an historical note, it is interesting that when Nicholas Denys settled on Cape Breton Island in the late 1600s and had his trading post set up somewhere in the Sydney River area, it is thought now, he wrote in his diary of open seams of coal in the Sydney area on Cape Breton Island.

Certainly when Louisbourg was settled by the French, one of the reasons was the proximity of coal in the Cape Breton area. That was surface coal. The Donkin mine, of course, is under the ocean and offshore of the coal producing area.

The significance of coal is still evident today in the communities and the culture of Cape Breton. Miners who worked in the subsea mines have a long history. Many Cape Bretoners today can trace miners in their families going back more than 100 years. Cape Bretoners are proud of this mining heritage and they have never forgotten it.

In the early years, the work sustained many families, but it certainly was not an easy life. It was extremely dangerous and extremely hard work. Today, mining is still dangerous and hard work, but it is a very different profession compared to what existed 100 years ago. Mining provides good jobs and builds strong communities.

In the case of Donkin, it is important to note that this development is not starting from square one. A lot of the work at Donkin has already been done.

Exploration of Donkin began in 1977 with the original wells being drilled by ship. Eleven holes were drilled during a three year period and several seams of coal were detected. The Cape Breton Development Corporation of those days spent $80 million on two exploratory tunnels in the mid-1980s. At the time, the coal was deemed too expensive to extract, the tunnels were sealed and flooded, and the development did not proceed, but the coal is still there and the tunnels still exist.

As we can see, Cape Bretoners have lived both with the anticipation and with the disappointment of not seeing Donkin developed. Today I am happy to say that the pendulum has swung back to that feeling of optimism on Cape Breton Island.

As we all know, today's energy situation is very different from the recent past. Energy prices, including coal prices, have risen dramatically and new clean technologies are being developed, resulting in a new interest in coal as an energy source. Another factor favouring Donkin today is that the coal deposit may be of sufficient size and potential to be a source for international markets. We know that there is a very hot market for coal.

Nearby on Cape Breton Island, and certainly in Nova Scotia, there is a local workforce with extensive underground coal mining experience. These are some of the best workers in the world when it comes to mining and extracting coal. It is a workforce that welcomes the return of coal mining jobs. Local businesses certainly would welcome this development too.

Cape Breton also has two local coal-fired power stations capable of using Donkin coal. The rail infrastructure is in place to ship coal by train to two more power plants elsewhere in Nova Scotia.

Let us not forget the potential of Sydney Harbour, which sits ready to ship coal to international markets. The member for Cape Breton—Canso mentioned that in his speech. Some preliminary work may need to be done to assist the Sydney Harbour authority to move some of the larger ships in and out of the harbour, but that is all part of the infrastructure requirements that would be needed to fully develop the Donkin coal mine.

These are just some of the positive factors supporting this initiative. As we have heard, this is the last major coal deposit off Cape Breton Island. If it gets to the development stage, and I certainly believe it will, we expect to see at least 10 years of operations in the Donkin mine. In addition to providing much needed jobs, the development of Donkin would help stabilize the tax base of this community for many years.

This agreement signals a small revival of coal in Nova Scotia. It is not a return to the old days when coal was king in Cape Breton, but Donkin has the potential to provide a viable industry to Nova Scotia and help the province meet its energy needs.

The people of Cape Breton are anxious to see this development proceed. Certainly the Province of Nova Scotia is anxious to see it proceed and the Government of Canada is anxious to see it proceed. Coal mining will once again bring good jobs to this important region.

It should be clear from my comments that there the benefits of the initiatives I have outlined are manyfold. There are jobs and opportunities available. There are infrastructure jobs and there are dollars that will be helpful to the local community.

Clearly, there is broad support out there for this piece of legislation and for the Donkin mine and the Donkin coal seams to be developed. In fact, the federal government went so far as to carry out consultations with all interested stakeholders last spring, and I can report that there is very strong support indeed.

The community of Cape Breton is excited about this opportunity. The labour unions and groups representing the rights of workers, including the Nova Scotia Federation of Labour, have expressed support, and the employer and the offshore board have expressed support.

The Governments of Canada and the Province of Nova Scotia have a shared interest in seeing this further economic opportunity for Cape Breton. That is why they have worked closely together on this issue. I believe both levels of government deserve credit for their efforts to reach an agreement that will allow development of the Donkin coal seams. This bill provides a clear regulatory regime to permit the Donkin development if Xstrata decides to proceed with production.

There has been a fair amount of discussion here about existing provincial and federal laws, but existing provincial laws regarding matters such as labour standards, labour relationships, resource development and occupational health and safety will be incorporated into federal law as part of the agreement between the Government of Canada and the Government of Nova Scotia.

Again, this can happen when organizations work in a cooperative manner for the better good of both the Province of Nova Scotia and the Government of Canada. Nova Scotia will administer these laws so that a single and clear regulatory system can be established for the Donkin project.

In conclusion, let me say that this legislation allows both levels of government to retain their current positions, with nothing changing, with respect to ownership and regulatory jurisdiction, while facilitating the economic development of Cape Breton and certainly Nova Scotia.

By introducing this legislation, the Government of Canada is demonstrating its commitment to the economic development of the Cape Breton community and to Nova Scotia as a whole. This bill, I believe, is an outstanding example of cooperation between governments to facilitate a common interest in seeing the Donkin mine project proceed.

I would like to recognize the work of the Minister of Natural Resources, his parliamentary secretary and my colleagues on this side of the House, as well as the work done by my colleagues on the other side of the House.

I think there is pretty well unanimous support for this piece of legislation. There is some discussion and that is why we are in this place. We are here to look at the various areas of bills that we feel are projecting the common good and also to recognize what we see as flaws. I am happy to say, from what I have heard from members on the other side, that they recognize this as a cooperative and very positive piece of legislation for the province of Nova Scotia that will certainly benefit the regional economy of Cape Breton Island.

Before closing, I would like to say that coal was king in Cape Breton Island for many years, but it was also important to the entire province of Nova Scotia, certainly in the New Glasgow area. Earlier I mentioned the Westray explosion and the unfortunate circumstances that surrounded it. Coal was mined throughout Nova Scotia, in Springhill as well, and not just in Cape Breton. As well, there is still a very skilled workforce capable of underground mining, one that any employer would be lucky to hire.

I wish Xstrata, the company that will be primarily involved in Donkin, the best of luck. If the Province of Nova Scotia and the federal government can continue to work in a cooperative manner, I think this can be an example for other provinces.

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague from South Shore—St. Margaret's for his comments on this important topic today.

I missed the first couple of minutes of his intervention, but I believe he did speak somewhat about land based coal deposits in Nova Scotia. Being a member from Nova Scotia, I know he is very much aware of the sensitivity around the land based coal deposits. In fact, there is opposition to any type of surface mining, strip mining operation, in the Cape Breton area particularly, Point Aconi, Boularderie and the Port Morien area.

If the hon. member had identified this early in his presentation and if he could clarify with the people who are paying attention to the legislation, that this legislation in no way impacts on land based deposits. It is specifically for those resources under the ocean, from the high water mark out, and that it will in no way encourage strip mining.

The federal jurisdiction does not even apply to the land based deposits. I would like him to comment that in no way would the legislation have any impact on those land based deposits.

[Gerald Keddy, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margaret's, NS]

Mr. Speaker, my colleague from Cape Breton—Canso is absolutely correct.

The project we are talking about, the Donkin coal seams, is under the ocean. It is not land based. Even though it is underground, it is certainly not within the jurisdiction of Nova Scotia and Cape Breton Island.

We have always considered the coal seams an offshore jurisdiction. That is why this unique piece of legislation has been put in place because quite frankly, Nova Scotia was claiming jurisdiction for the Donkin coal seams along with the federal government. This was a cooperative way of getting beyond that.

I would like to make this point, and in no way am I trying to step on provincial jurisdiction here in Point Aconi or the Prince Colliery or any of the other mines that still have some potential in Cape Breton Island. Let us be clear, these are for undersea resources. They are not for land based resources.

The other debate is a Nova Scotia provincial debate. The other debate about open pit mining is strictly in the purview of provincial jurisdiction.

However, I would ask people who are listening to this discussion to take a look at some of the examples in Nova Scotia where there has been a cleanup of a lot of these old mine sites, and they have been open pit.

The Trenton-New Glasgow area is a prime example of that where a local company came in, Chisholm's, I believe was the company name, and it did have an open pit mine. It certainly was dusty and caused a problem for a few years. However, it did an extremely good job and reclaimed a bunch of old mine sites that were frankly a personal hazard for all the local children in the area who were playing in some of these mines. Some of these mines went back 150 years. It is not as simple as one versus the other.

To the member's first and original question, there are two totally different jurisdictions and two totally different subjects.

[André Bellavance, Bloc, Richmond—Arthabaska, QC]

Mr. Speaker, earlier, my colleague from Beauharnois—Salaberry—our party's natural resources critic—said that the Bloc Québécois supports the bill in principle, but that naturally, we will have to study the contentious provisions in Bill C-15, just as we do for all bills. As she said, that is the case with respect to revenue sharing and the exclusion of revenue from coal bed methane in the Canada-Nova Scotia accord on offshore oil. I would like the member to comment on offshore revenue since he is, if I am not mistaken, a member from the Maritimes.

It appears that the Conservative government is acting against Quebec's interests because the equalization formula does not take into account all non-renewable natural resource revenue, and therefore penalizes Quebeckers.

I would like to know if he thinks that the equalization formula should include offshore resources. We know that the Conservative government had some problems with this issue after the former Liberal prime minister's government made some promises and signed an agreement with provinces that have natural resources. We know that Mr. Williams, Premier of Newfoundland, was very angry when the Conservatives failed to keep their election promise. The former premier of Saskatchewan decided to sue the federal government because of that. This is a very serious problem. One Conservative member even became an independent because of it.

I would like to know what the member thinks of this, and whether he thinks that the equalization formula should include offshore revenue.

[Gerald Keddy, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margaret's, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I mentioned earlier and I appreciate the fact that the Bloc members are supporting the principle of this piece of legislation, but we always see that constant and reoccurring habit of trying to drive those wedges. We are much better off when we all work cooperatively. I certainly appreciate his comparing this agreement to the offshore agreement.

Part of the argument that Nova Scotia put forward on the Donkin coal mine, and certainly on the methane, is that it is offshore, so it should be covered under the same agreement with offshore oil and gas. Methane gas and coal bed methane being drilled from jackups on the ocean, or from drill ships, or semi-submersibles, whatever it is drilled with, I concur, should be treated the same as other offshore resources.

Of course, the member should know the original agreement signed on the offshore has been available to Nova Scotia under our government since the beginning. It is part of what is on the table. He mentioned Premier Williams of Newfoundland and Labrador. It has been on the table for Newfoundland and Labrador as well.

It is up to the provinces to decide if they would choose to take that agreement or if they would choose to take the new equalization formula which offers 50% of their natural resources. Certainly, members should also be aware that the way the offshore accords were written the moment a province becomes a have province, it would lose the benefits of the offshore accords which would have given it 100% of its natural resources.

In the case of Newfoundland and Labrador in particular, that will probably be sooner rather than later. We are expecting it will become a have province and especially with the escalating value of its energy resources, Newfoundland and Labrador will probably become a have province in 2009. Therefore, it would lose the benefit of the original accord it signed anyway.

The new agreement is much better for the province of Newfoundland and Labrador in particular than the old equalization formula because under the new formula it would continue to receive 50% of its natural resources like any other province.

Again in closing, part of this and the reason why I took the time to explain that to my colleague from the Bloc is the fact that the Government of Canada, on this piece of legislation, Bill C-15, has worked in a cooperative manner in a positive way for a positive outcome both for the province of Nova Scotia and the federal government. It shows what we can do when we work together.

[James Bezan, Conservative, Selkirk—Interlake, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I think that the bill we are debating today on the Donkin coal block is really a good example of what this government can get done. Where the previous Liberal government always failed, we are able to get things done.

I want the member for South Shore—St. Margaret's and Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency, who has worked so hard on this project, to talk about how our government is working so well with the province of Nova Scotia and other provinces in getting the job done.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

The hon. parliamentary secretary has about 20 seconds left.

[Gerald Keddy, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margaret's, NS]

Mr. Speaker, 20 seconds to say that the province of Nova Scotia and the federal government have a very good, lasting and strong relationship. We have that relationship because we have looked at some difficult issues and instead of simply saying we are going to throw down the gauntlet and fight over those difficult issues, we worked hard.

We worked through the negotiations and we succeeded where everyone else thought that we could not for the benefit of both the province of Nova Scotia and the federal government.

[Gerry Byrne, Liberal, Humber—St. Barbe—Baie Verte, NL]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to be sharing my time this afternoon with the hon. member for Charlottetown to speak to Bill C-15, the Donkin coal block development opportunity act.

I note that my colleagues across the way have decided to introduce a new element to this particular debate, that of the Atlantic accord and the offshore developments. It is their choice. It would not be mine if I were them because of course that is not a stellar success story on behalf of the Conservative government right now at this point in time and that they would be wanting to talk about that.

I will say this. There is an incredible success story to be told and that is through the persistence of colleagues of mine, the member for Cape Breton—Canso as well as his colleague, the member for Sydney—Victoria, both from Cape Breton representing the needs and the aspirations of the people of Cape Breton and Nova Scotia for quite some time.

I want to congratulate him and the members for Cape Breton--Canso and Sydney--Victoria for keeping the pressure on this, and for bringing the views of the people of Cape Breton forward.

This is going to result in over 275 jobs for the people and miners of Cape Breton. It will mean that men and women who are currently working in other parts of the country and other parts of the world will be working at home now. It also means incredible new economic opportunities.

Cape Breton Island is really the Celtic tiger in so many ways. It has diversified its economy. It has gotten into the high tech sector. It has become involved in communications, manufacturing, software development, and has made huge strides in the development of its tourism sector. It deserves our congratulations and our support.

It is members like the Liberal member for Cape Breton—Canso as well as his colleague, the member forSydney—Victoria, that really I salute here today because they took the voice of the people who they represent and they translated it here on the floor of the House of Commons.

Bill C-15, to develop the Donkin resources, is simply a matter that the member for Cape Breton--Canso really kept the pressure up. He kept an eye on making sure that the legislation was drafted to meet the needs of the people whom he represented and brought those jobs home.

However, the members opposite on the Conservative side are actually wanting to raise the whole spectrum of the Atlantic accord. Just this morning, for the fourth consecutive time, there was to be a briefing by the Department of Finance for those interested in the amendments that were forced upon the people of Nova Scotia in their Atlantic accord agreement.

That is not what they asked for in these amendments. It is not what they were promised. Everyone in the House and everyone in the province of Nova Scotia, in Atlantic Canada and throughout this entire country knows that the promise that was given to the people of Atlantic Canada was 100% exclusion of all non-renewable natural resources for the equalization formula with no caps.

That however was not what was translated and provided by the Conservative government once it took office. That commitment was given on January 3 in an open letter to the Premier of Newfoundland and Labrador, followed by an open letter to the Council of the Federation under then Premier Ralph Klein, as chairman of all 10 provinces and 3 territories, that there would be 100% exclusion of all non-renewable natural resources for the equalization formula with no caps. The statement was also given, “no excuses”.

We seem to be surrounded now by excuses, by fine print and by a cap. That quite frankly I think causes the people of Nova Scotia still some great concern, especially when there was to be a briefing just this morning.

For the fourth consecutive time a briefing was scheduled for all interested parliamentarians from both sides of the House. That briefing was offered by the federal Department of Finance back in October of this year, so that we could actually learn firsthand the nature of the side, side, side deal between the Prime Minister and the Premier of Nova Scotia.

It was cancelled once, it was cancelled twice, it was cancelled a third time, and this morning, 14 minutes before the meeting was scheduled to occur, it was cancelled for the fourth time, even to the point where a member of the Department of Finance was actually showing up for the meeting. Because there was no BlackBerry in the--

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

The hon. member for Selkirk--Interlake on a point of order.

[James Bezan, Conservative, Selkirk—Interlake, MB]

Mr. Speaker, we are discussing Bill C-15, the Donkin coal mine and it seems that the hon. member has gone completely off on a tangent talking about something unrelated. Let us get down to the topic. Let us have a debate on Bill C-15 and talk about things that are relevant.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

I would ask all hon. members to remember when they are speaking to a particular bill that they stick to pertinent facts and details about the bill itself.

[Gerry Byrne, Liberal, Humber—St. Barbe—Baie Verte, NL]

Mr. Speaker, I would encourage all hon. members to get to understand and know the bill that they are discussing. Bill C-15 specifically provides an exclusion to the Canada--Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act. If I am speaking about the Canada-Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act, it is because it is included in this particular bill. When I do that, I am speaking about the substance of the bill. So I thank you, Mr. Speaker, for reminding members of the government that when they introduce a bill, they should get to understand the bill that they are introducing before raising points of order or objections.

That is very important. There is a matter of trust that has to be brought forward to the people of Nova Scotia. Exactly what will the bill result in for them? How will this translate, because a side deal of which nobody understands the content, as in the original Atlantic accord and the changes to the equalization act, does not do anything to instill confidence in the people of Nova Scotia. But what does is when members stand up and represent their constituents, like the member from Cape Breton and the member for Sydney—Victoria. They are keeping their eyes on this sort of stuff. They are making sure that their constituents and the people of Nova Scotia, and indeed all of Atlantic Canada, are fully aware of the consequences of this. This bill is going to be supported by the Liberal Party of Canada and this caucus because of the hard work that came forward by members of our caucus to make sure that the work got done.

There will be 275 new jobs as a result, should the private company, Xstrata, decide to go full force and develop the mine, which we are all extremely confident that it will. There will be significant resource revenues that come into the province of Nova Scotia. I note that one element of this bill requires that all royalty payments should go to the Receive General for Canada first and then flow to the government of Nova Scotia second. That, quite frankly, causes me some concern, because we know the track record of this particular government. It could decide to block that particular flow of royalty revenues if the government happens to have a future disagreement with the province of Nova Scotia.

However, I have confidence that this mine will proceed because of the hard work of all interested members of Parliament, those who actually got to know the bill and the context of it, who supported it and are adding to this. But one thing has to be clear. There is a matter of confidence and trust that if people say that they will do something, they should do it. There was an absolute guarantee given to all 10 premiers and 3 territorial leaders of this country. It was broadcast to the entire country in the middle of the election campaign back in 2006 that there would be 100% exclusion of non-renewable resource revenues from the equalization formula with absolutely no caps involved.

What do we have? We do not know for a fact because we cannot actually get a copy of the briefing materials from the Minister of Finance or the Department of Finance as to exactly how he intends to amend the Canada-Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act because of course they have scheduled four separate briefings and on four separate occasions they have cancelled those briefings. But one day, we will have that particular piece of legislation, I am confident, tabled in the House and we will be able to see with the rest of Canadians what exactly is entailed in this.

What we do know is that a letter was put forward by the current Prime Minister, then the leader of the opposition, stating there would be 100% exclusion of non-renewable natural resources from the equalization formula and no caps. We now know from the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Finance, the former minister of national revenue and others who clearly stated in the House that that is not the intention of the current Conservative government, that it intends to impose a cap and that it is requiring an either take it or leave it position by the provinces that are so affected. They accept certain elements and abandon others because they cannot have both.

Quite frankly, it would have been very helpful to the electorate in Atlantic Canada in the last election campaign if they had known that little detail.

I thank the member from Cape Breton and the member for Sydney—Victoria for keeping their eyes on this file and making sure it happens for the people of Cape Breton and Nova Scotia.

[Robert Thibault, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

Mr. Speaker, the member is a former minister of the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency and understands very well the plight of the people of Cape Breton.

He recognizes, I am sure, that there has been a sea change in Cape Breton. Employment is increasing. Over the last 10 years there have been some great improvements, but there have been some very difficult times with the closing of the mines. Now we have a bill here that makes it possible for a mine to reopen, operated by the private sector. It gives an opportunity to have a good regulatory system that brings the feds and the province together. That is good news.

Would he not, like me, like to see good news like that continue to extend with good cooperation between the federal and provincial governments? He raised the fact, and I raise it again, of honouring past commitments, such as the Canada-Nova Scotia accord and the Newfoundland-Canada accord.

We have seen today where the minister at the very last minute backed out of a briefing, where he was going to explain why the figures that we have been able to see, between what the feds are telling us and what we know to be true, are completely different on the Canada-Nova Scotia side deal.

Does he know from his vast experience in Parliament any other reason than completely trying to hide, why a minister of the Crown would put off these meetings so many times, and again today cancel it at the very last minute?

[Gerry Byrne, Liberal, Humber—St. Barbe—Baie Verte, NL]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for the excellent question, because it does provide a context to this.

The people of Cape Breton, as the hon. member rightfully pointed out, as throughout Nova Scotia, have really adapted to a new economy. They have developed new manufacturing expertise. They have delved into and succeeded in information technology. They have developed a strong and robust tourism sector. They are exporting their products, their goods and their services to the entire world.

The initiative of Nova Scotians is to be admired. It is a role model for the rest of the country. I for one look at the successes of the people of Nova Scotia with some amount of admiration, reflecting on the fact that I have had some involvement with it with my hon. colleague, who is as well a former minister of the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency.

The people of Nova Scotia know that they need a cooperative relationship with their federal government in order to succeed, to be able to harness those resources. Without that cooperative relationship, we have no success.

This particular bill does provide a glimmer of hope that there is that sort of basis of trust and support to be able to do that by streamlining those regulatory regimes. But I can also say that this mine provides 275 jobs to the coal sector. Just imagine if there was complete and full disclosure on exactly what the environment of the offshore oil and gas would be for Nova Scotia if we understood what rules would be imposed by the Conservative government.

The hon. member quite rightfully points out the fact that there is an impasse in one of the strongest growth resource sectors that we have in this country. The people of Nova Scotia are being denied a benefit from that.

He is quite right that as of this morning, for the fourth consecutive time the Minister of Finance and his departmental officials refused to meet, after scheduling an appointment to brief caucus members and those interested parliamentarians on the specifics of those particular changes that they imposed which were contrary to their election promises. For the fourth consecutive time that particular briefing was cancelled.

That is an affront to the people of Nova Scotia. It is an affront to the parliamentarians in this House and in the other place who wanted and needed to attend that briefing in order to be fully informed of a deal that was stated to be signed, sealed and delivered. It does not exist. Perhaps the reason the budget implementation act has not yet been tabled in this House is that the Conservatives do not yet know exactly how they are going to word the budget implementation act, because they do not know the context of their own deal.

[Shawn Murphy, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Mr. Speaker, like the previous member, I am very pleased to rise in the House to speak to Bill C-15, the Donkin coal block development opportunity act.

This basically involves a jurisdictional issue involving a provincial mine. It is good legislation. I certainly will be supporting it when it comes to a vote.

I would classify the mine as a provincial mine. It is a mine that is not being developed fresh. A lot of the infrastructure is there, although when the infrastructure was established, it was determined at the time that it was too expensive to take the coal out of the mine, the coal which is a proven resource.

The mine is located six or seven miles subsea. As such, it would be under the jurisdiction of the Government of Canada. However, the entry to the mine and all other aspects of the mine would be provincial issues. We can see the chaos and confusion that would result, because at certain points in time workers would be doing activities in certain locations that would be under the jurisdiction of the Province of Nova Scotia and then if they moved on into the mine pit, they would be under the jurisdiction of the Government of Canada. There would be uncertainty, confusion and chaos. It is incumbent upon the Government of Canada and the Government of Nova Scotia to clarify that so that the private sector developer, along with the Government of Nova Scotia and the people who live in Cape Breton, can move forward on this particular development.

I am pleased with the legislation. I am pleased with the level of cooperation that exists between the Government of Nova Scotia and the Government of Canada on this particular issue. I am not going to get into the other issue that was discussed in the last 15 minutes.

The legislation transfers most of the jurisdictional aspects in connection with the operation of the mine to the Government of Nova Scotia. For example, occupational safety, workers compensation, labour, prosecution of offences, et cetera, will be under the ambit and at the expense of the Government of Nova Scotia. There is a detailed platform for dealing with all jurisdictional issues that has been agreed to by the Government of Canada and the Government of Nova Scotia. Basically, it is a delegation of responsibilities.

Like other speakers in this House, I want to congratulate the member for Cape Breton—Canso and the member for Sydney—Victoria for their hard work, their dedication and their perseverance in bringing this matter forward. They are to be congratulated. Certainly the people in Cape Breton can go to bed tonight knowing full well that they are well served in this institution.

I come from the province of Prince Edward Island. We have actually had a similar experience there which worked well. That was when the fixed link was constructed, the bridge that connects the province of New Brunswick with the province of Prince Edward Island.

Again, that involved legislation and an agreement. In that case, as members can see, a lot of the site works were done either in the province of New Brunswick or in the province of Prince Edward Island and so there were jurisdictional issues involving the Government of Canada. All parties came together in a cooperative agreement and it really did not result in any issues.

Of course sales tax is one of the other issues that has to be worked out in these agreements.

As I alluded to briefly in my opening comments, this is not a new mine. It has been around for quite some time. A lot of the exploratory work has been done. The tunnels actually were done quite some years ago. After the analysis and a lot of the work was done, it was determined at that point in time that it was not economically feasible to mine the coal that was there. It was just too far out.

Again, things have changed over the last number of years. As everyone is aware, the price of coal and energy in all its elements has increased dramatically. Technology has improved substantially, not only technology involving the clean coal issues but also the extraction of the coal. Those issues have all combined together to make this particular initiative now economically feasible, as I understand, and I hope it will be moving ahead. This will be an excellent development for the island of Cape Breton.

We are dealing with legislation that deals with a particular mine. I know the mine is important for the Island of Cape Breton and for the province of Nova Scotia but I suspect that this situation will be repeated over and over.

Many activities are occurring in the Arctic. There are other issues. It is my recommendation that the government ought to consider some type of overarching legislation that would deal with incidents such as this where we deal with a mine or a bridge or some other installation that would have cross-jurisdictional issues involved so that the overarching framework can be dealt with through agreement.

The agreement would need to come to Parliament and a parliamentary committee but I am not sure we would need to deal with it through legislation in each and every instance. We might be dealing with a mine or a project that is not as big as the Donkin coal mine and it would be a shame if the expense and the delay would have to be involved in getting legislation through both the provincial legislature, the Parliament of Canada and, of course, the Senate of Canada. That is just a suggestion I would make as we go forward.

In researching this particular issue, it is clear to me that the major stakeholders on this particular project are very much behind this legislation and this initiative. The Province of Nova Scotia and the people who live in Cape Breton, the municipality of Cape Breton, the trade unions, including the Nova Scotia Federation of Labour, all seem to be very supportive of this particular legislation. That is one of the reasons why I support the legislation 100%.

There has been some discussion about environmental concerns and that needs to be dealt with. I hope and I believe it will be dealt with by the Province of Nova Scotia and that all the legislation that it has on its books will be vigorously enforced as this project goes forward.

Another issue that has been raised in the debate is that this is a wedge issue between different provinces and different regions of the country. I do not see it that way at all. I see it as a positive development where one province or one jurisdiction has made an agreement with another jurisdiction and, in each case, it required legislation. This is the legislation that has to deal with the Government of Canada. I do not see it, in any way at all, as different jurisdictions. It is a cooperative initiative.

I consider this legislation to be positive. I congratulate the people who were involved in bringing it forward to the House. I want to tell the House that I will be supporting the bill when it comes to a vote.

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased with the tone of the debate here today and the fact that we have support in principle from all parties. I would like to see Bill C-15 fast-tracked and ushered on through.

I know that my colleague with his legal background is very aware of the history of coal mining in Nova Scotia and Cape Breton. However, the Province of Nova Scotia would be taking on full responsibility for all matters around labour relations and occupational health and safety. We are very much aware of the Westray tragedy. It was an incredible tragedy for the people of Nova Scotia and the entire coal mining community. I had hoped that we had learned from that experience.

Is the member confident that with the regulations there, that the federal government will be able to keep the Province of Nova Scotia's feet to the fire and ensure that matters of labour relations and occupational health and safety are carried out? Is there enough clout on the part of the federal government to ensure that this operation is played out in a safe and practical manner and that looks after the best interests of those who are working with this operation? Does the member believe those safeguards are within this legislation?

[Shawn Murphy, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Mr. Speaker, the quick answer is yes. The regulations are there. There is no question about that.

Several years ago, I read a lot of the material that arose as a result of the inquiry dealing with the Westray matter. I would point out that the regulations were there then too but they were not enforced at the time. There was a very lax enforcement structure to deal with occupational safety issues. The people who were supposed to be acting on behalf of the people of Nova Scotia and on behalf of the miners who worked in the Westray mines were not, in my opinion, doing their job.

The regulations were there but they were not being enforced and we all know the final consequence, which was a tremendous tragedy in Atlantic Canada. It is etched in the minds of all people living in that region. I would hope and I would think that the people who enforce the legislation bear those scars as they proceed on this particular project.

I am confident that the regulations will be enforced.

[Robert Thibault, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

Mr. Speaker, the member spoke about this as being a one-off bill. He said that he would prefer an overarching bill that would help deal with a situation where a project crosses jurisdictions. He mentioned the Confederation Bridge project, which has been a great asset for Atlantic Canada and certainly a great asset for his home community of Prince Edward Island.

A few years ago, I remember dealing with the Canada offshore development and the concerns that the developers had in that instance about the regulatory time. The time it takes to get approval in Canada, if there are more hurdles in Canada, is two to three times as long as anywhere else internationally without having any additional safeguards.

For those reasons, would it not be good to have discussions on labour regulations and environmental regulations and the arguments about provincial and federal jurisdiction and having to answer to both? I would ask the member if he cares to comment further.

[Shawn Murphy, Liberal, Charlottetown, PE]

Mr. Speaker, yes, that could be. I know where the member is coming from but I just thought this was a consideration. We could be dealing with overarching legislation.

The people who are developing the projects off Nova Scotia and off Newfoundland are extremely annoyed, I think would be the word, about the amount of regulation that they need to go through provincially, sometimes two provinces, and federally. That should be streamlined. However, I find the issues somewhat separate.

[Bradley Trost, Conservative, Saskatoon—Humboldt, SK]

Mr. Speaker, it is a pleasure today to address this bill for a couple of reasons.

First, what a lot of people who may watching or later reading in Hansard do not know is that today is a day with special emphasis on mining issues on the Hill. It is partially coincidental, though not totally, that today we are dealing with the Donkin coal block development opportunity act, a piece of legislation that is specifically meant to assist in the growth of a particular project in Cape Breton, just off the coast of Nova Scotia. It is very important for that specific reason.

While we are talking about the overall general theme of mining today on the Hill, with people from the industry, workers, et cetera, we also have the privilege of dealing specifically with a bill that would help build this industry in a particular location for a specific town.

The second reason I am particularly pleased to speak to this bill is because of my personal professional background. Prior to being elected to the House of Commons in June 2004, I had previously worked as a mining and exploration geophysicist, having obtained my geophysics degree and graduating previously from the University of Saskatchewan.

I had the privilege of working in all three of Canada's northern territories, the wonderful territories of Yukon, Northwest Territories and Nunavut. I also spent some time working in the provinces of Saskatchewan and Manitoba. My final project before I was elected was in a place called Salluit in the most northern town of the province of Quebec where I worked on a nickel sulfide project.

It is a great pleasure for me to speak to a piece of legislation that is in some way related to my previous profession. People need to understand that mining is important for Canada. It is important for Canada historically and in the present.

While the fur trade was probably the first industry that really flourished in Canada from coast to coast and pushed inland the exploration, mining was not far behind. Some who have read their history books may remember that some of the explorers who came to Canada came specifically to look for mineral deposits, gold, diamonds and copper.

In fact, one of the more amusing stories in Canadian history is how some of the early explorers from France became very excited when they thought they had discovered massive diamond deposits in Quebec. They filled up many barrels of these diamonds and returned home. However, after a little investigation, they were not quite sophisticated enough to tell the difference between quartz and diamonds.

Historically, mining has been very important to Canada. We export somewhere in the neighbourhood of 77 different products. We are internationally known for our uranium deposits, potash, nickel and coal. We have seen the rising price of coal impact on our dollar. This is an industry which impacts every region of the country, be it oil and gas, hard rock mining or whatever.

We have particular expertise in this country for the development of our laws, geological infrastructure, the Geological Survey of Canada, the well done mapping programs and the organization and stability of our programs. That is one of the reasons why, not only in Canada but around the world, Canadian mine engineers, geoscientists and all others are recognized as experts in this field. That is just an introduction.

Today we are dealing with a particular piece of legislation that deals with a specific situation off the coast of Nova Scotia, which makes it an important bill for Cape Breton and, indeed, for all of Nova Scotia. This legislation deals directly with the prosperity and jobs in the region of Cape Breton. I am pleased to stand and support this bill.

The development of the Donkin undersea coal resource located off Cape Breton Island has the potential to bring significant economic benefits to the Cape Breton region and to all of Nova Scotia.

Both the province of Nova Scotia and the Government of Canada contend that they have legal obligations regarding matters such as regulating resource development, labour matters, occupation, health, safety, et cetera. In December 2005, Nova Scotia announced Xstrata Donkin Mine Development Alliance was successful in its bid to explore and develop the Donkin coal block resource. After more than one year of exploration, Xstrata will make its final decision on the development, in August 2008.

Neither the federal government nor the provincial government wish to see issues of jurisdiction hamper the prospects of this project. We do not want red tape to kill jobs with people of Cape Breton. However, for the commercial operation of the mine to proceed, an effective regulatory regime is needed. The bill is about that. What we need is a clear understanding among all parties affected, proponents and possible employees and the community at large as to what the rules of operation are going to be on this project.

The federal government sees it as necessary to find a way around this impasse. I believe it is important to understand the process that brought us to this point of view. In my view the legislation is an example of good will and commitment by both levels of government, provincial and federal. Consequently both levels of government have put the question of jurisdiction aside to collaborate on a mechanism permitting the development of a safe and efficient mine.

Representatives of the federal government and the Nova Scotia government worked together for a year to develop the proposed legislation. Starting in March, federal and provincial officials agreed on an approach to develop an appropriate regulatory regime to develop the Donkin coal block. The agreement involves the incorporation of provincial statutes by reference into federal law of laws related to coal and coal bed methane resource management, labour relations, labour standards and occupational health and safety.

Prior to this, Nova Scotia agreed to amend its occupational health and safety laws to ensure that subsea coal miners would have the same level of protection that they have under federal legislation.

Also under the agreement, administration of the new federal laws will be delegated to a provincial government official or authority. This helps us to move forward to clear the path, to move forward for the development of the Donkin site if the private sector decides if the mine is a viable, profitable operation. Again, to be clear for everyone who is listening, the legislation only enables and takes away the red tape so that the private sector can have its own initiative to grow and develop these necessary jobs.

Public meetings were held this past April to discuss the regulatory framework. These sessions resulted in assurances that labour, community and industry groups understood and supported the proposed regulatory regime. The outcome is this bill, the Donkin coal block development opportunity act, introduced in this Parliament by the hon. Minister of Natural Resources.

Dealing with the issues of health and safety, we know there are dangers faced by coal miners and we know safety is paramount for them. Throughout history worldwide, I think of some particularly tragic incidences in Canadian history. We do not want any dangers or loss of life to happen again to our miners. Bill C-15 would clarify the occupational health and safety regulations that would apply to the Donkin resource. By eliminating confusion over who would protect these workers, we hope to protect each and every worker better.

The proposed legislation will permit the incorporation into federal laws of existing provincial laws regarding such matters as labour standards, labour relations, occupational health and safety and coal and coal gas resource management. The administration and enforcement of these laws would then be delegated back to the province of Nova Scotia. This provides a clear and stable regulatory system, the Donkin coal development. It also permits both levels of government to retain their positions with respect to ownership and regulatory jurisdiction.

As well, the bill would ensure that coal and coal bed methane royalties associated with exploitation of the offshore portion of Donkin could be collected by Nova Scotia and then remitted to the Government of Canada. In turn, a remittance of an equal amount would then be made by Canada to the province of Nova Scotia. It is my understanding that is being done to be in compliance with other previous acts and legislation even though to the untrained ear it sounds somewhat cumbersome.

As all members can see, the immediate objectives of the bill are to facilitate provincial management of the Donkin coal block and provide a clear regulatory regime to govern its development

Moving on from health and safety issues, we need to talk about the economic advantage. We know not all areas of the country are equally advantaged with various economic assets and so forth. Cape Breton is one of those areas that, in spite of the ingenuity its people, has had on few more challenges, so these jobs and this growth is very important for this area.

The legislation provides Cape Breton with an opportunity to advance its own economic development to let the people of Cape Breton continue to be masters of their own house. Nowadays, clean coal burning technology exists and we have an opportunity to employ hundreds of experienced people from the coal mining industry.

By facilitating a return to Cape Breton's time honoured tradition of mining coal and by creating up to 275 direct jobs and 700 indirect jobs, the Donkin enterprise will give us another chance to revive the coal mining industry in Cape Breton.

The legislation for the Donkin mine would ensure that local people, who know the resource, would be there to inspect these mines and inspect them in a timely manner. As well, the project could generate hundreds of millions of dollars for the provincial economy in salaries, equipment purchases and so on, all very good things for the economy of Nova Scotia and Cape Breton.

Finally, as far as the specifics of the bill, the Donkin coal block development opportunity act is an outstanding example of federal-provincial cooperation. We are pleased to see that similar legislation already passed in the Nova Scotia legislature. It is now up to us, as federal members of Parliament, to do the same thing.

While that sums up the specifics about the bill, let me also add a few other things.

As I said when I started out talking about the broader issues of mining, mining is a part of Canada's heritage. We see this very clearly in Cape Breton. I am not all together perfectly acquainted with Cape Breton, being a prairie boy who has worked across it. However, the image I have of it has to do with coal mining. When we think of the interior of British Columbia, we think about the mining and the resources. We go to places in Canadian geography, names we know of but many us have not been to, places like Flin Flon, Trail, B.C. and areas farther north. We see the new diamond mines in the north. Mining is a part of who we are as Canadians.

We are very proud of our high tech and knowledge based economy, but we also need to understand that this high tech knowledge based economy interacts with our natural resources economy and our mining economy. Canadians are world-class leaders when it comes to geological sciences to geophysics.

We look at the work of the University of Toronto in developing things, projects that were started in the second world war for military applications for mining and mining for the military. These things have developed because of the mining infrastructure and the knowledge that we have in Canada.

It is important that we continue to develop and build this industry. It provides jobs from coast to coast. It will continue to provide economic development. It is one of those core elements that we need. We need agriculture and food to live. We need elements to provide shelter. For our industrial and manufacturing production, we ultimately need minerals.

That is how I would like the people of Canada and those listening today to view the bill, not specific legislation on its own, standing for one area, but as a symbol, something to speak to the whole broader issue to develop our act.

I am very glad the members for Cape Breton have supported it. I am not quite sure I credit—

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Andrew Scheer]

Order, please. I am afraid I will have to cut off the hon. member for Saskatoon—Humboldt at this point. He will have approximately five minutes to finish his remarks when the bill is debated again.

We now move to statements by members. The hon. member for Nanaimo—Alberni.

The House resumed consideration of the motion that Bill C-15, An Act respecting the exploitation of the Donkin coal block and employment in or in connection with the operation of a mine that is wholly or partly at the Donkin coal block, and to make a consequential amendment to the Canada--Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act, be read the second time and referred to a committee.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Royal Galipeau]

When we were last dealing with Bill C-15, there were six minutes left to the hon. member for Saskatoon—Humboldt, and he has the floor.

[Bradley Trost, Conservative, Saskatoon—Humboldt, SK]

Mr. Speaker, as you noted, prior to question period I was dealing with the Donkin coal block development opportunity act. For the benefit of members who may not have been in the House at that time, I will quickly go through the essence of the bill and then move to questions and comments.

The basis of this bill is a coal mine that was previously built and flooded over. It runs under the surface of and offshore the coast of Cape Breton. For economic reasons it had previously been shut down, but for economic reasons there is now a possibility of reopening it.

Offshore jurisdiction normally falls under the federal government, but because this mine is very close to the shore and most mines are on shore, there is a bit of a jurisdictional overlap between the provincial and federal governments. The purpose of this legislation is to sort that out and make possible the development of this mine off the coast of Cape Breton.

While there are many technical points regarding health and safety, economic development, et cetera, in general it may be said that the purpose of this legislation is, for legal purposes, to expand the jurisdiction of Nova Scotia a little way offshore in a broad non-technical sense. One may think of it in a legal sense as being very similar to a mine that is on ground, shall I say, in Nova Scotia, and not under the water.

My understanding is that all members of the House support the bill. It is a very good bill as far as respecting jurisdictions and promoting the rights of the province. It is a very good bill with respect to economic development. It is very fitting that today this bill is being debated on mining day here in the House of Commons.

In summary, let me say again why this government has proposed this bill and why I believe all members should, and hopefully will, support this bill.

It helps to support economic development in a region of Canada that needs it. It is not that all regions do not need it, but this area, where coal historically was king, can very much use economic development.

It helps to continue to build our mining sector and export oriented industry. While some of the coal will be used domestically, there is a very good probability that a large percentage of the coal will be exported, possibly for metallurgical or thermal purposes. The coal has the potential to be used for both but can be used either way.

This bill is also an example of cooperation between the Nova Scotia government and the federal government. Governments can work together. We have a complex federation. We have a complex series of governments to deal with the nuances and the needs of each region, to respect the local desires and needs, and yet unify our country as one grand confederation. This bill builds on that, both pulling together across the country and developing locally. It provides for the clarity and stability that all businesses need when they are doing it.

It is a bill that is good for Canada, good for Nova Scotia, and good for Cape Breton. There may very well be 275 indirect jobs created through private sector investment and 700 direct jobs. I congratulate the people who are showing the initiative to redevelop this mine, the people of Cape Breton whose industry and initiative are pushing this forward and the members who have supported it.

I urge all hon. members to support this legislation and future similar legislation from this government.

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Mr. Speaker, as parliamentarians we are all very much more aware of trying to reduce our carbon footprint. We want to be assured, though, as we go forward that the demand for energy is not going to subside any time soon and that the demand is going to remain high. It is imperative that clean coal technologies be embraced and developed. Canada has an opportunity to be a leader in that field.

Having had the opportunity to go out to the CANMET plant in Bells Corners and seeing some of the things that have been taking place at the NRCan research project, it has been very reassuring and encouraging with CO₂ capturing and sequestration.

My colleague is from Saskatchewan. SaskPower is very much at the fore of a number of different initiatives. I have received a number of emails from people who are concerned about the further use of coal and fossil fuels. I want to reassure people that there are steps being taken and positive things being undertaken. I know the member's province is at the forefront with SaskPower, so he may want to elaborate on some of the great victories it has had in recent years.

[Bradley Trost, Conservative, Saskatoon—Humboldt, SK]

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the question the hon. member raises on coal and coal issues in general.

When we answer a question on clean coal, we first need to define what is meant by the terminology because the terminology “clean coal” has changed over the years. At one time many of the concerns were the sulphate particulates, the so-called, to use the slang that is often used, the SO_x and the NO_x particles that are emitted.

Over the years that has evolved and become more and more of a concern. Currently, the term is being used to talk about carbon dioxide and, in particular, carbon dioxide captured or sequestration. There are several different approaches to the term. The terminology is flexible.

The coal industry across North American, and in Canada especially, has been very good at developing clean coal technologies to take away those pollutants that previously were there.

In the last few years, with the emphasis on shifting to carbon dioxide, the industry began to shift over to deal with that particular problem.

The Province of Saskatchewan along with SaskPower have been looking at developing and working with technology and is looking to partner with other thermal producers of electricity across the country. Their decision has been to not push quite as aggressively forward as they had previously been thinking with clean coal. It does not mean that they do not view it as having a potential for strong development, but it has to do with various scale sizes in Saskatchewan's economy, the potential to ramp up and to go with natural gas.

The overall future for clean coal is very good. The technology is developing. The one thing we always have to be cautious about is that particular types of coals need particular nuances for certain situations. However, various technologies are being developed by both government and private industries to absorb, sequester or merely use for other purposes the carbon dioxide that is being emitted from coal plants.

[Robert Thibault, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased to discuss this bill, one that is so important for Nova Scotia and particularly Cape Breton Island. This bill demonstrates the entrepreneurship and courage of the people of Cape Breton, who have never lost hope regarding the issue of coal in their economy, their province, their corner of Canada.

If we look at the history of Nova Scotia and, in particular, Cape Breton and other parts, coal brings about the worst and most difficult stories in our history and also the best. We know of the mining disasters. We also know of the labour strife over the years, the beginnings of the industry which was a near slavery type situation for the workers in that industry.

We also know what it has brought to our province in terms of immigration into our province and developing a culture. The songs of Cape Breton alone are great cultural riches to Canada and a lot of it relates back to the growing and the beginning of the implementation and continuation of the coal industry.

Therefore, it was a very difficult day in Cape Breton in that whole economy when we had the loss of the last operating deep mine. It is a great pleasure to see the renewal of this industry and to look at the courage of the people of Cape Breton who never lost faith. The labour unions and the skilled people who worked within those mines never lost faith. They knew of the potential of Donkin. They have had great support and leadership by their members of Parliament, the member for Cape Breton—Canso and the member for Sydney—Victoria who worked ardently on bringing this to where we have it now.

One of the problems that we encounter when we deal with a project like this that is a little bit off the beaten path, slightly different than the others, is that the basic infrastructure for the mine is on land and the resource is under the sea.

If we look at the jurisdictional thing, it becomes a question of who owns it. Is it the responsibility of the Province of Nova Scotia? Is it the responsibility of the Government of Canada? We have been unable to resolve that discussion. Even at this point we have been unable to resolve that argument in ownership.

At least what we have here is an agreement among the two, that the most important thing is the communities, particularly the communities of Cape Breton in this region, and there is a possibility for economic development.

This bill brings us to an accommodation where no party abandons their jurisdiction. The federal government still claims ownership of the resource because it is the sea floor. The provincial government still maintains that it has a right and responsibility for occupational safety and environmental regulations, as do the feds. However, we have come to an agreement where the province will be the regulator and will adopt the federal law, implement federal law and be the agent that will be dealt with in all these matters with the acting companies. I think it is a very good arrangement.

I agree with the member for Charlottetown who said earlier that it would be good if we could have some overarching legislation or proposals in this country that could take care of situations like these in the future because this has kept that community in stress for a long time. For a number of years the community has wanted to redevelop that mine. A very large international company with a good reputation in that field was interested in doing it but it needed a lot of patience because it was a three or four year process and the legislation was not done. We are doing it now but we must wait for the regulations and get the work done. It would be a lot better if we could have it faster in the future.

I was dealing not so long ago on behalf of the federal government with the Province of Nova Scotia, working with the offshore oil industry that was looking at getting permits to operate on the Nova Scotian shelf. Because of those same types of disputes as to who the regulator is on occupational safety, who the regulator is on labour and who the regulator is in all the other fields, both of them claimed jurisdiction, so we ended up with two sets of regulations. The approval process ends up taking two, three or four times longer than it would in another active field in other parts of the world.

If that time could be linked to better operating conditions, then it might be understandable, but it cannot. It is not that we do a better environmental job on those or that we ensure better safety for our people. It is just the bureaucracy and the technicalities of getting those permits which are so difficult.

We have come a ways a bit and have some agreements in Nova Scotia on the offshore that we have been able to improve through the smart regulation process started in the Chrétien days.

We just had good results in my community. A large quarry in a beautiful, pristine community wanted take away all the basalt rock and ship it to the U.S. It did not want to destroy its communities so it tried to excavate the seashore in Nova Scotia.

However, there were federal and provincial jurisdictions. On the socio-economic side, the Province of Nova Scotia was the only one that could stop the proposal. The federal government maintained responsibilities on the establishment of a port and on the environmental questions related to the fisheries and seawater, as well as some elements of the groundwater in the province.

The resolution we found at that point was to have a joint review panel under the Environmental Assessment Act of Canada join with the review panel of the Province of Nova Scotia to create one review panel where the laws of both apply. Dr. Bob Fournier, who chaired that panel, heard from experts and from the community and came out with a recommendation not to pursue the project, which was a great relief to the people of western Nova Scotia, although maybe not unanimously. Some people would have liked to have seen the jobs associated with it, but most people did not want to see that type of activity in their community. On that side it was the provincial regulations that prompted the provincial responsibilities.

From the federal side, Bob Fournier made some interesting points on an environmental side and the whole seacoast of Nova Scotia. That was a good area of cooperation but we want to see more between Nova Scotia and the Government of Canada. As has been pointed out in this House today, for Nova Scotia to advance there needs to be that type of cooperation with the federal government.

It was a great day when the prime minister at the time, the member for LaSalle—Émard, met with the member for Halifax and, with the Premier of Nova Scotia and the minister responsible for petroleum development, signed the Atlantic accord, the Canada-Nova Scotia agreement. It was a beautiful day because not only did it bring us some much needed money to do the economic development and those projects that we needed in Nova Scotia, but it also signalled cooperation for the future. We could set aside some jurisdictional disputes and problems and look at how we could improve the lives of people, and all of Canada benefits from that.

We must understand how disappointed Canadians were when the budget was presented in this House by the current government and, after it had specifically stated that it would support that agreement, it demolished the agreement completely. Nova Scotians know that $1 million were lost in Nova Scotia. What probably bothered them more than that was the pretence over the summer months that the Prime Minister and the premier had resolved it and that they had come to a mutual understanding that would restore the Canada-Nova Scotia agreement.

However, I know that to be false. I know the offshore Canada-Nova Scotia agreement, as well as that with Newfoundland and Labrador, meant that those provinces would benefit from revenues from the accord above and beyond revenues of any new equalization program, any changes in equalization or any other programs of the federal government. The benefits under the accord would be above that.

The Conservatives have said in their exchange of letters, as best as I can understand it and as every analyst has told me so far, that the provinces can choose either/or in any of the given years whether they want to go by the provisions of the new equalization formula or of the old accord, which is a little better than what was put in the budget last spring but is not still the full accord.

I do not know exactly what the loss will be. I would guesstimate in the area of $600 million for Nova Scotia but I cannot say for sure because the government will not show me the information. It will not provide it. What we have seen is an exchange of letters between the Minister of Finance of the federal government and the minister of finance of the Province of Nova Scotia. When we listen to what these people have said, specifically the Prime Minister in the press conference in the foyer when he was with the premier, he said that there would be no stacking. The Atlantic accord is stacking. That is the principle of the accord and that is why it was of such benefit for economic development for Nova Scotia.

The member for Cape Breton—Canso, on behalf of Nova Scotia Liberal members, arranged to have a briefing. The government said that it would have a briefing but that it would have to be with all Nova Scotia MPs. We agreed to that because that was understandable.

One briefing was arranged for a late Friday afternoon. For members from Nova Scotia, myself included, it takes an hour to get to the airport and on the flight. Then it is a two hour flight. Then it takes about three hours to get back to my riding. I had intended to leave as early as I could on Friday afternoon, but this meant I would have to go home on Saturday and I would lose the best constituency day of the week. I agreed to stay here. Then that meeting was cancelled.

I think there was no intention of having the meeting. The intent was to have us wait around here and then cancel at the last minute.

My memory does not permit me to recall the fourth meeting, but I will talk about three of them. Another meeting was arranged during the week of the November 11 break, when everyone was in their constituency. This meant that 11 MPs and a bunch of senators would have to fly back, at the taxpayer cost, to spend a couple of days in Ottawa, perhaps only one, for that briefing. I would have lost those days in my riding.

I attended the November 11 celebrations with students at a number of schools in my riding. I visited the veteran's wing at the Yarmouth hospital and spent an afternoon with the veterans. I would have had to cancel two days of those meetings to be in Ottawa for that briefing.

However, the member for Halifax West raised a point of order in the House. The minister agreed to move the meeting. The parliamentary secretary said that the meeting would be held this morning, November 20 at 10:30. Fourteen minutes before the meeting, we found out that it had been cancelled. No reason was given for this cancellation. We only saw the officials scurrying down the hall to the elevator. They had received their order from on high that there would be no briefing. What do we have? We do not receive a briefing.

Another briefing was planned, but I cannot give the details because it escapes my memory. However, four briefings were cancelled.

I do not think the federal government ever had any intention of explaining to the people of Nova Scotia the details of that supposed agreement between the premier of Nova Scotia and the Prime Minister, which would have restored all the provisions of the Atlantic accord.

This is a shame. Before the election, the Prime Minister sent a flyer to every house, saying something about the worst lie was a promise not kept. He promised to support the accord.

I remember sitting on the government side and the Prime Minister and his ministers, who were on this side at the time, asked that the budget, which included the implementation of the original accord, be divided, so they could support the accord and not vote for the full budget. Opposition members at that time were willing to support the accord, or so they would tell Nova Scotians.

The instant the Conservative government got its hands on the levers of power, we saw in the first budget a warning shot. It said that the Atlantic accord was not well accepted everywhere in the country because it was a special provision. Sure it is a special provision. There are special needs. All these museums in Ottawa, financed by the federal government, are special provisions. They are not a per capita distribution of federal funds.

When our government invested in the oil sands in Alberta, we saw there was a great economic opportunity, and oil was not at the prices that it is now. We accelerated the cost allowance program for that industry so it could become what it is today, the great economic generator of the country. This was not done on a per capita distribution of special tax incentives. It was done as a special assistance to that part of the country because it had a certain potential, a certain resource and it was good for the country.

Many people from all over the country, including from my riding, went and found good work in that area. Hopefully some day they will return to my riding, with the expertise they have gathered there, and develop businesses and give employment in the area. It was that type of an investment as was the Atlantic accord.

The Atlantic accord gave some economic development money to Nova Scotia and to Newfoundland and Labrador so they could develop their provinces. The first $800,000 was delivered by the member for LaSalle—Émard and that went directly to pay off the capital debt of Nova Scotia, debt accumulated through the Buchanan years, with Greg Kerr as minister of finance of the day. We now were struggling with that debt. Finally, we would get some assistance.

Now what do we see? We see that promise completely reneged upon. That brings me back to the bill, which I support. I think it is a great bill.

The Conservatives reluctantly agreed to follow the direction brought by the member for Cape Breton—Canso, who virtually had to write it himself to ensure that the people of his province and his riding would have access to the opportunity, a chance to work hard on developing a resource that is part of their culture and tradition. He warrants the full support of the House and I hope all members will vote with the member for Cape Breton—Canso in support of the bill.

[James Bezan, Conservative, Selkirk—Interlake, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I want to comment on the diatribe that the member for West Nova has brought to the House today, with his rhetoric filled discussion on the Atlantic accord.

He does not realize that underneath the bill, Bill C-15, there is accommodation for the Donkin coal block, under the Atlantic accord, to allow royalty revenues to be shared with the province. We are talking about fairly significant royalties for both coal and for the methane gas that comes off of it. The coal bed methane is a 5% of value royalty, which is very significant and will be very good for the people of Cape Breton and Nova Scotia. The royalty going back to the province has a range of $5 million per year on the coal itself, which will all come out of the consolidated revenue fund. This is very significant and important. The only reason why we should talk about the Atlantic accord is on that basis.

The reality is this government was able to take the considerations of many members of the House from Nova Scotia and Atlantic Canada, including the member from Cape Breton, whose own party was unable to get the job done. Our party was very proactive in listening to the concerns that were raised, including from the member from Cape Breton. I appreciate his concern for his constituents. However, we also know of the hard work that was done by the parliamentary secretary for ACOA, who is the MP for South Shore—St. Margaret's. He put an incredible amount of work into this as well, along with the regional minister for Nova Scotia.

We have to realize that this side of the House finally got this done. After many years of negotiations back and forth, we were able to close the deal. It is a great news story, once we get this bill passed, and hopefully we can see it move fairly quickly through the legislative process. It will address all the concerns that have been raised.

However, let us talk about the economic benefits. I ask the member for West Nova to concentrate, and I know that sometimes can be difficult. Could he talk about the issue of economic development and how important this is for Nova Scotia and Cape Breton, even though Cape Breton and Nova Scotia have such a diverse economy, things are moving ahead and they are moving toward being a have province.

[Robert Thibault, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

Mr. Speaker, I will not fall in the trap set by the member by inviting me to talk about the Atlantic accord because that is not the purpose of the bill.

On the matter of economic development, I thank the member for raising that point because it is very important. When we look at that type of operation in the rural part of our country, it has economic spinoff. There is the opportunity for families to stay close to their home and raise their children in their area. All the ancillary businesses that will grow will provide services not only to those families but to this business. I do not think we can overestimate the value of that, maintaining that culture and providing those opportunities.

There has been a big change in Cape Breton and it has been very difficult. That change has happened all over Nova Scotia, as well as all other rural areas in the country. We have depopulation and the movement of people toward the urban centres or toward areas like the tar sands, for example, where there is a huge opportunity. Therefore, it is very good when we can have this type of attraction that keeps people there.

However, there have been other changes also. We have seen people investing in Cape Breton in non-traditional areas, high technology, robotics type machinery, manufacturing. I have seen some very good investments by the communities themselves to further develop the natural resources. The crab industry, for example, used to be shipped to New Brunswick for canning and processing. It is now done within the island of Cape Breton, which provides new economic input.

The Prime Minister said that Atlantic Canada had a culture of defeatism, but that is not true at all. Atlantic Canadians have courage and ambition. When they have the opportunity this bill will provide, they will make the best of it and contribute to their own well-being.

[Rodger Cuzner, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Mr. Speaker, since coming to the House seven years ago, many moments stand out in my mind. One of the toughest moments was when I and my colleagues, the former minister for ACOA, the member Sydney—Victoria and the natural resources minister, the member for Wascana, boarded the plane and we went to Cape Breton, to my home town. We made the announcement that the federal government was finished in the coal mining business in Cape Breton. It was a tough day. Many of friends were involved in that industry. The impact that had on the community was significant.

However, our community is resilient. We are a tough group. We have moved on from there. As the member has mentioned, we have diversified as a community. I think quite a bit of that was because of a fund and moneys that were invested through his early stewardship through the ACOA portfolio. Therefore, Cape Breton Island has a much more diversified now.

This will be great legislation. Any legislation has to protect the interest of the greater public good. It is important that the legislation does not handcuff industry in moving ahead with these types of opportunities. Also what is important is we protect the health an safety of the workforce.

Does the member believe the legislation does those types of things: protect the public good, unleash the corporate sector, in this case Xstrata, to do what it has to do to develop the project, but still not compromise the health and safety of the men and women who will work on this project?

[Robert Thibault, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

Mr. Speaker, the member referred to what was probably my toughest day also. I had some difficult days as minister of fisheries, but as minister of ACOA in Nova Scotia that was a difficult day.

I remember going to Cape Breton to announce the closure of the mines. The only thing on my mind at that time was probably that I should have taken my guidance counsellor's advice in high school and become a crossing guard. To tell a community that what it has known for hundreds of years is no longer there, it is gone, and that part of the culture that keeps the community together has disappeared all of a sudden is very difficult.

It was a tough time for Cape Bretoners, but they rallied. The federal government at that time put money into the growth fund. We asked people from those communities, some living still in Cape Breton and others living abroad, to volunteer their time and their energies, at a cost to them professionally and personally, to steward the reinvestment into that economy. It was a beautiful thing to watch. We see a lot of those benefits now.

What is unfortunate is a lot of time and ink is spent on the projects that are not working and not enough time and ink is spent celebrating the entrepreneurships of those communities that have been able to take advantage of those investment opportunities and assistance and turn things around.

Like everyone, I see people on airplanes all the time or we meet them somewhere. They talk about Nova Scotia and they talk about going to Cape Breton and the Celtic Colours. It is a beautiful festival. It brings a huge amount of money into Cape Breton. None of that would have been possible if there had not been some government intervention and investment at the beginning to start those projects.

Finally, I will go to the point about the safety of the people. I am quite confident the bill does that because there is no reduction in the criteria at any point. The criteria remains the same. It is the administration of it that is simplified.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Mr. Speaker, it is quite a pleasure as a member of natural resources committee to speak on Bill C-15, the Donkin Coal Block Development Opportunity Act.

Quite a number of folks have spoken today. Quite a number of my Atlantic colleagues from both sides have spoken on the bill. As we have stated before, basically what it does is facilitate an economic opportunity for Cape Breton Island and the province of Nova Scotia, but I am also going to talk a little later about the spinoff benefit for New Brunswick as well. I think this is a big benefit for Atlantic Canada, especially when it comes to coal.

The bill creates a legal framework for the mining operation at the Donkin coal block. The economic opportunity is to be able to bring that coal to the surface from an area some three kilometres offshore Cape Breton and transport the coal to market. The operation, as people have said, will produce 275 direct jobs, potentially as many as 700 indirect jobs, and hundreds of millions of dollars for the provincial economy in terms of salaries, equipment and a range of goods and services.

The opportunity came about on December 13, 2004, when the energy minister of Nova Scotia, Cecil Clarke, sent out a press release. Some of the benefits of this opportunity, stated a news story, would be:

Winning bidders will have to agree to hire local workers and buy goods from Nova Scotia businesses. After an operator is chosen, it will still take months or even years to get the mine running.

That last statement is absolutely true in regard to the complexity of this.

My colleague, the member for Cape Breton—Canso, talked earlier today about the price of coal being at almost record highs of almost $100 a tonne. That is a tremendous development and means a tremendous amount of opportunity for employment in the area.

Since that time, Nova Scotia announced that the Xstrata Donkin Coal Development Alliance was the successful bidder. The company immediately launched a multi-million dollar study to evaluate the potential for bringing the mine into production. The study is currently under way, but the major key decision point on this is February, and if all goes well a positive decision on mine development will be made in August.

Approximately 25 people are currently working at the Donkin mine site. Xstrata has drained the water from the two tunnels dug to the coal face in the mid-1980s by the Cape Breton Development Corporation and the company is now preparing to drill into the coal seam to obtain further information on the resource.

From a resource standpoint, everything appears favourable. However, for Xstrata to come to a positive decision, there is another issue that needs to be clarified, and that is Bill C-15.

As previously mentioned, the Donkin coal block is located offshore Cape Breton Island. Both the Governments of Canada and Nova Scotia claim ownership of the resource. Accordingly, they both believe they have an obligation to regulate the resource. This creates quite a level of uncertainty for Xstrata and puts the company in a position where it is faced with two regulators. Facing even one regulator can be a daunting task, but facing two is incredible.

However, Bill C-15 will remove this uncertainty. It would make clear to Xstrata, its employees and the regulators what laws will apply and who should enforce them. Because regulatory regimes affect costs, Xstrata is looking for regulatory certainty before its February 2008 decision point.

When I think about some of this regulatory uncertainty, I think about our major project office for some of these major projects in the mining area. I think of the potential that this will give some of these projects to get off the ground.

One of those major projects is coming to the fore in New Brunswick in my riding of Tobique—Mactaquac, where a major tungsten mine potentially will be developed in the Stanley-Napadogan area. What a tremendous opportunity this is for an area that has seen its forest industry ravaged. It is a tremendous opportunity. I think this regulatory aspect will certainly help that.

Bill C-15 is the result of a cooperative federal-provincial effort. The objective of the effort is to establish regulatory clarity to facilitate economic development and to do so in a way that is acceptable to both governments. In March of this year, federal and provincial officials agreed on an approach. This was quickly followed by a period of federal-provincial consultations with the public. These sessions resulted in assurances that labour, community and industry groups both understood and supported the proposed regime.

Employee-employer groups, community organizations and the Canada--Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Board were all supportive. In June, cabinet approved the drafting of the legislation required to get this done.

The legal framework proposed in Bill C-15 covers resource development and a number of labour matters. The latter includes labour standards, industrial relations and occupational health and safety, which is so important when we look at the development of these underground mines and consider the inherent danger that goes with them.

The bill provides the governor in council with the authority to make regulations incorporating provincial laws into the body of federal law. Bill C-15 also excludes corresponding federal laws from applying to the Donkin coal block.

The laws would be incorporated as amended from time to time by the province and with other adaptations if necessary. For example, we would not incorporate anything that was in conflict with the federal claim to the offshore without first amending it. Any provincial law incorporated federally would be administered and enforced by the provincial official responsible for the relevant provincial law.

By means of this legislation, both levels of government will be able to work together to ensure that occupational health and safety provisions will serve the Donkin miners well. More specifically, Nova Scotia's trade union act, the occupational health and safety act and the labour standards code will be incorporated into federal law through regulation should this bill become law.

Nova Scotia has accepted to amend its occupational health and safety laws to include certain elements that exist under federal law. This is meant to provide the highest level of protection for workers. The labour matters covered by Bill C-15 will not in any way sacrifice accountability, transparency or health and safety for the sake of regulatory efficiency.

Bill C-15 also clarifies the matter of royalties. These will be collected by the province and then remitted to the Government of Canada. An equivalent amount will then be provided for the province. The bill requires that an agreement concerning royalties with the Province of Nova Scotia is subject to the approval of the governor in council. For greater certainty, it has been made clear that the User Fees Act does not apply to any fees contained in provincial laws incorporated by reference.

Why this bill? It is so important and so critical. The coal that will be produced by the Donkin coal block development is a most valuable resource, one that can contribute to the economic well-being of Cape Bretoners and Canadians as a whole.

One only has to look at the people who worked in the mines before the last underground mine was shut down in 2001. Since then, some of these folks have been working out west. What a tremendous opportunity this represents for these people to return, just like a lot of people from Atlantic Canada would.

Not only does this development represent a huge potential benefit to Cape Breton from a mining perspective, it also could represent a new source of coal for the region's electric generating stations. This mine could bring on stream an additional five million tonnes per year of Canadian coal into the market.

While 16% of Canada's supply of electricity is generated from coal sources, that percentage is much higher in Nova Scotia, where 60% of electricity comes from coal and roughly 15% to 20% does in New Brunswick.

Nova Scotia Power has four major coal stations in operation that use approximately 2.5 million tonnes per year, with the two largest stations accounting for the majority of the use. Those are the 600 megawatt Lingan plant and the 300 megawatt Trenton plant. These generating station investments are important to maintaining competitive power rates in Nova Scotia for the over 460,000 customers of the utility.

Having a homegrown source of coal that could ultimately replace imported coal could be a very important cost and security of supply benefit to Nova Scotians, and to Atlantic Canada for that matter. New Brunswick has a 458 megawatt coal plant at Belledune, which is equipped with scrubber technology and could be a beneficiary of this.

It is also important to note that Nova Scotia Power recognizes that generating clean electricity and energy is important. The utility has taken steps to implement cleaner-burning fuel technology, such as the circulating fluidized bed technology at Point Aconi, with announcements of millions of dollars to equip other stations with scrubber technology.

In fact, in the summer of 2006 there was a project undertaken to retrofit the Lingan plant with pollution control technology for NOx, which has announced another potential $170 million project to put in scrubber technologies to lower the sulphur dioxide emissions, a technology very similar to what exists at our Belledune plant in northern New Brunswick.

These developments are in addition to the announcement of over 200 megawatts of wind power generation in the province.

Nova Scotia, Atlantic Canadians and the utilities recognize the importance of generating clean electricity. We recognize the importance of taking positive steps to develop renewable resources, but we also have to face facts. Our generation's profile is based on thermal. It will take a while for us to wean ourselves off that, but we cannot afford to just leave a stranded investment of many billions of dollars out there with no way to collect dollars of revenue against it.

I believe that the measures being taken in Bill C-15 will provide the regulatory certainty required for the Donkin coal block project to proceed. It will provide the highest level of protection for the workers involved. It will permit both levels of government to retain their current positions with respect to ownership and jurisdiction. It will facilitate the economic development of Cape Breton Island and, I would maintain, Nova Scotia, New Brunswick, and all of Atlantic Canada.

I would add that Bill C-15 is also an outstanding example of cooperation between governments to fulfill a common interest in seeing the development of the Donkin block. By introducing this legislation, the Government of Canada has demonstrated its commitment to the economic development of the Cape Breton community and to Nova Scotia as a whole.

Bill C-15 will clarify those occupational health and safety regulations that apply. We know the dangers that are faced by coal miners and we know that safety is paramount to coal miners. We have seen this in situations that have happened over the last year or two in the U.S. and other countries.

By eliminating confusion over who would protect these workers, we hope to protect them better. I know that Nova Scotia has come a long way since Westray as well. What this does for the Donkin mine is ensure that there are local people who know the resource and who will be there to inspect these mines and inspect them in a timely manner.

Nowadays, as previous speakers have suggested, the technology exists that can burn coal cleanly, and we have an opportunity here to employ hundreds of people in Cape Breton Island. We have an experienced workforce in the coal mining industry and a community that wants this development.

The Donkin enterprise will give us another chance to revive the coal mining industry in Cape Breton. What a great story that is for us. We are certainly pleased to see that legislation was passed already in the Nova Scotia legislature. Now it is up to members here in the Parliament of Canada.

We have heard a tremendous number of positive comments about this legislation today. I suspect that this legislation would not have any problems at committee and in the House. I call upon all my colleagues to support Bill C-15, to move this forward and to make Atlantic Canada a positive development opportunity.

[Peter Van Loan, Conservative, Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Minister for Democratic Reform]

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order. There have been discussions among the party House leaders and I believe that you would find consent for the following motion regarding the bill we have been debating. I move:

That, notwithstanding any standing order or usual practices of the House, Bill C-15, An Act respecting the exploitation of the Donkin coal block and employment in or in connection with the operation of a mine that is wholly or partly at the Donkin coal block, and to make a consequential amendment to the Canada--Nova Scotia Offshore Petroleum Resources Accord Implementation Act, be deemed to have been read a second time and referred to a committee of the whole, deemed considered in committee of the whole, deemed reported without amendment, deemed concurred in at report stage and deemed read a third time and passed.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Royal Galipeau]

Does the minister have the unanimous consent of the House to move the motion?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Royal Galipeau]

The House has heard the terms of the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Royal Galipeau]

(Motion agreed to, bill read the second time, considered in committee of the whole, reported, concurred in, read the third time and passed)