Bill C-31 (Historical)

An Act to amend the Judges Act

This enactment increases the number of judicial salaries that may be paid under paragraph 24(3)(b) of the Judges Act from thirty to fifty.

Judges Act

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

Mr. Speaker, with respect to the member opposite, I believe all the parties in the House, except the Liberal Party, are done. Speaking to this, I understand there was an agreement that one speaker would be put up by the opposition. In fact, one of the members of the Liberal Party attempted to put forward a motion that this bill now pass in the House. However, members of the Liberal Party objected to that motion by their own member.

I wonder if we could have a clear answer on why the Liberals are filibustering this issue. Is it because Bill S-3 is coming up later on in the House and there is an attempt to delay debate on that?

[Judy Sgro, Liberal, York West, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I have not been part of a group or committee that has been involved with filibustering, but I understand that the Conservatives know all about it from what is happening on the other side of the House and in the procedure and House affairs committee. I actually sat in on the procedure and House affairs committee, which is the one that is trying to deal with the in and out issues. That is the only experience I have had with filibustering.

I came today with a prepared 20 minute speech and certainly wanted to deliver it. I know there is one other Liberal speaker who will be standing at some point. I cannot say whether that is the last speaker, but I certainly know that he is more than ready to deliver his comments on Bill C-31.

[Larry Bagnell, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

Mr. Speaker, it is humorous to hear two Conservatives talk about delaying Parliament for a couple of hours, to debate something as important as judges when they have been holding up committees. They have been filibustering and stonewalling the environment committee on making improvements to cutting greenhouse gases and also the investigation into Conservative members' spending in the last election with charges from Elections Canada.

The Conservative chair of the justice committee has walked out four times illegally at a time when he was required to call a vote. Witnesses have come from across Canada at great expense. It was shut down so we could not discuss the problems the Conservative Party was having. For the Conservatives to have the temerity to even get up and ask questions like that is very humorous.

I have a question regarding the bill. The member talked about the appointment of judges. She mentioned that Liberals are in favour of appointing more judges, which is great for two reasons: the backlog related to family law and the six specific claims judges. The Conservative Party has put us in an ambivalent position because of the perverted procedure for appointing judges. Now we are going to have to vote for a bill to appoint more judges but they are going to be appointed in a perverted procedure.

Changes were made. First, there were three categories in recommending judges. Of course there is a committee process, so there is the separation of judges and the executive. As everyone knows, it is very important to have a perception of separation and so there is this committee. The committee would recommend those who are not approved, those who are recommended, and those who are highly recommended. The minister took away the highly recommended category, which means there are only people who are recommended, so the decision is once again back with the minister, who is trying to distance himself from the procedure.

Second, another member was added to that committee so that the government now has a majority of members. He is getting the appointees recommended and then making the decision himself. I would like the member to comment on that.

[Judy Sgro, Liberal, York West, ON]

Mr. Speaker, whether we are talking about judges for the refugee board or judges for anything else that goes on in Canada, one of the things that I had to do when I was appointed minister of citizenship and immigration was to put in a process that was free of any partisanship completely. There was an extensive screening position that was put together by departmental officials that consisted of three avenues of screening. By the time the actual list got to cabinet for final approval, it had very little to do with “the minister and the political atmosphere”. It was meant to be the most qualified people that Canada has to appoint to these important committees to provide the best guidance and judgment.

I still think that was the very best thing that we could be doing as Canadians and as ministers of the Crown to ensure that as little politics play a part in all these appointments. They are far too critical. These appointments are not for two years. These appointments are for years, in and out of many of the different governments here. Whether the Liberals are in power or the Conservatives are in power, we want the very best people making those decisions on behalf of Canadians.

[Gary Goodyear, Conservative, Cambridge, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I guess it is just a comment to clarify some of the misunderstandings in the House by some of the members opposite.

I wonder if the member is aware that at some of the committees she refers to the motion that was ruled out of order was on the advice of the leading legal counsel for the House of Commons. The majority, through their tyranny of games and whatnot, had ruled the chairman out of order on a perfectly legal ruling and that in fact is the cause of all the trouble at committees right now. Members of the opposition continually rule perfectly rightful rulings by chairs out of order to try to take over the committees.

I wonder if the member knows that to be true. I am sure she does because I know the member is honourable. I would ask if she is aware that the motion that was ruled out of order was actually attempted to be expanded to look into all of the advertising habits of all the parties and that motion was ruled in order, but the members opposite refused to do that. I am not sure the member is aware of that truth. I wonder if she could comment on that.

[Judy Sgro, Liberal, York West, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I attended one of those meetings that was being filibustered. It was just an absolute waste of everybody's time.

However, let me tell members, we were there to discuss something that Elections Canada had pointed out. It was not the Bloc, or the NDP, or the Liberal Party that Elections Canada was talking about. Elections Canada clearly indicated that it had some very significant concerns that the Conservative government had broken the rules through its in and out process, and--

[An hon. member]

Allegedly.

[Judy Sgro, Liberal, York West, ON]

Allegedly, Mr. Speaker.

This is Elections Canada talking, though. This is not just a politician talking. This is Elections Canada that raised this issue about the in and out scheme and said that it wanted to look into it. It seems to me that it is a pretty legitimate role to look into that, to try to expand it so that it would then begin to look at other people. If the other parties had also been named by Elections Canada, then I would have supported that initiative.

However, in this particular case, Elections Canada said the Conservative government had violated the rules of election spending, and that is what the committee was trying to look at, so why add on other parties when the other parties clearly had not broken the rules?

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to speak to Bill C-31, An Act to amend the Judges Act. As others have indicated, the bill would amend the Judges Act to authorize the appointment of 20 new judges for provincial and territorial superior trial courts. As it states in the legislation, it moves the number up to 50 in the case of judges appointed to superior courts in the provinces other than appeal courts.

Our party supports efforts to appoint additional judges and we do that for many reasons. However, the additional appointments are not without some worry on our part, and others have outlined that before me as well. Contrary to what the current Prime Minister promised during the election, he has most often let his ideological bent get the best of him when it comes to making appointments.

I remember the appointments board he was going to have. When Parliament took its rightful position and decided that his favourite appointee did not meet the qualifications for that independent job, the Prime Minister picked up his toys and went home. Therefore, we do not have one of the most important parts of the Federal Accountability Act in place because the Prime Minister's ideological bent got the better of him.

It is the same when the Prime Minister makes appointments, that very often we believe not just are independent, but the appointees are strongly leaning toward the Prime Minister's ideological bent. That is certainly a worry. Now let me—

[An hon. member]

That's true.

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

As the member says, that is true and there is no question that is right.

However, what we have to understand in this Parliament the Prime Minister does not have a majority—

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Sure he does. We have a coalition government.

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Malpeque, PE]

He in fact has a minority and the difference between this minority Parliament and Lester Pearson's minority Parliament was when he was prime minister, he realized he did not have a majority and he went about working with the other parties to bring in something that the majority could accept. That is why we had so much progressive legislation from Prime Minister Pearson, in those—

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

We just have to tell you.

[The Acting Speaker, Andrew Scheer]

Order, please. Just because some members are sitting at the other end of the chamber does not mean the Speaker cannot hear them when they interrupt the hon. member for Malpeque. If members could let him finish off and if anyone else has a question or a comment, they can do so after.