Afghanistan Committee on March 31st, 2010

[BGen Denis William Thompson]

Absolutely, we intervene. If you see a serious crime in progress in a theatre of operations, any rule of engagement I've read, regardless of which operations I've been on, obliges you as a Canadian soldier to act.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

Absolutely. Thank you.

You mentioned that the army had no knowledge of techniques that might or might not have been used by the NDS. If the army had no knowledge of those techniques, and, as you said, you were with them constantly in the box, would you expect government to have any knowledge of those techniques if you didn't?

[BGen Denis William Thompson]

The army's not the only source the government has, but I hate to be the devil's advocate.

Now we're splitting hairs.

As I mentioned, it's the whole-of-government team. They may have... I don't know, maybe somebody from the other element of the whole-of-government team operating their stove pipe sent something up. I have no idea.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

And you were in the box, as you said, with a very close relationship with those other members of the whole-of-government approach.

[BGen Denis William Thompson]

Right.

During my time, none of that sort of information would have been shared with me.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Bryon Wilfert]

Thank you.

Mr. Abbott.

[Jim Abbott, Conservative, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

Very quickly, this is actually the nub of what we're spending our time on at this committee right at the moment. We have allegations...

I'm sorry, General. I recognize that I'm making a statement here that you might not be able to respond to in your professional capacity. We are dealing here with allegations from a politically motivated opposition, who are trying to say the government has been doing something that borders on war crimes, or are war crimes. You have made the statement that you would not, and cannot, do anything that would be contrary, or you would not be able to respond to an unlawful command.

I further cannot imagine that any of the advisers to you or to the government would countenance that, either. In other words, there is a lot of speculation that my friends have volunteered to disseminate and to bring to the fore. There's a whole pile of information just spinning around here, but when we get down to the nub of it, we have professional people like yourself, a professional army, and professional bureaucrats doing a job for Canada, and with the full knowledge and consent of the Canadian government. The two are the same thing.

Your comment today really underscored this whole issue that the army will not do anything that would be in response to an unlawful command. That's been very helpful. I thank you for that.

[BGen Denis William Thompson]

So I assume there's no question in there. Is that right?

[Jim Abbott, Conservative, Kootenay—Columbia, BC]

I'm sorry to put you on the spot, General. I really mean that seriously. This is craziness.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Bryon Wilfert]

Are there any further questions?

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

If we have time left...

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Bryon Wilfert]

You have about a minute and a half.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

General, we talked about people making allegations and so on. In your experience or from your knowledge of their procedures, is it routine for Taliban detainees to make allegations regardless of circumstance?

[BGen Denis William Thompson]

I'll be frank. Taliban detainees' opinions aren't really of much interest to me. I'm sorry, they just aren't.

[Laurie Hawn, Conservative, Edmonton Centre, AB]

I think that answers the question.

The Taliban detainees say a lot of things.

[BGen Denis William Thompson]

I'm sure they do, but you know...

Okay.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Bryon Wilfert]

Is there anything further from the government?

Okay, thank you.

Monsieur Bachand.

[Claude Bachand, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

First, I want to welcome General Thompson and apologize for my absence. I was in the other theatre of operations, leading a special mission.

[Some hon. member]

Oh, oh!

[Claude Bachand, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

I read what you said about what can constitute evidence of a link to the insurgency. I understand that. I also saw that you frequently reviewed DFAIT reports when making your judgment. You recognize that you have a responsibility. When you transfer a detainee who is linked to the insurgency, you must ensure that there is no risk of torture, because you know that you could get your knuckles rapped otherwise.

[BGen Denis William Thompson]

Yes, exactly.

[Claude Bachand, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

I want to hear what you think of Colonel Juneau and General Laroche. That question was asked today. A few months ago, this is what Colonel Juneau said:

“The frequency of detainee visit reports is of concern to me,” wrote the senior officer, who required post-handover inspection updates to ensure he wasn't transferring detainees to a “real risk” of torture.

A little further on, General Laroche says this:

...it is considered essential that we gain better visibility of the situation.

You seem to be saying that you did not receive any negative reports. Did you receive many reports? That may be the issue. Juneau and Laroche say that there were not enough reports and that, in their opinion, it was dangerous to transfer detainees. You arrived a few months later; did things change? Did you see those reports?

[BGen Denis William Thompson]

Absolutely.

As I mentioned earlier, I arrived around May 14, 2008. They started transferring detainees again in February 2008, because, between November 2007 and February 2008, they improved the reporting system and put in place a program to build capacity in the facilities themselves. A lot was done before they started transferring detainees again. That was the situation when I arrived.

[Claude Bachand, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Was it DFAIT sending you the reports?

[BGen Denis William Thompson]

No, it was an officer at DFAIT. But, as I said earlier, we were all a team.