For the record, what would the cost be to the--
Evidence of meeting #60 for Agriculture and Agri-Food in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was programs.
Evidence of meeting #60 for Agriculture and Agri-Food in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was programs.
10:05 a.m.
Liberal
10:05 a.m.
Liberal
10:05 a.m.
Liberal
Charles Hubbard Liberal Miramichi, NB
Okay, thank you very much.
In terms of the other commodities, we get concerns everywhere that many of the programs are very complicated. They take a lot of your time. They cost you a lot of money. What programs do you find the most difficult to deal with? We hear CAIS in some provinces. We never know what happens. You put in a proposal. Somebody reviews it. It goes back and forth and they may give you money and then they want money back in some cases. What is the most difficult one in terms of the various federal programs?
10:05 a.m.
President, Perth Federation of Agriculture
There are a few of them, but I think CAIS is one of the big ones because of the lack of justification. With a lot of programs, you'll get your application back or you'll get some sort of worksheet back that will identify where you do or don't qualify. I think that would be a big step forward, so producers would have a worksheet they could start with that's simple, that they could send in. They could get that back to have a very clear understanding of how the program works.
Across the board, I think a lot of money gets put forward and I think a lot of people, including the public, don't realize how much of it goes first to the accountants, as was mentioned earlier, and second to government administration to banter these applications back and forth.
I think simplicity of the programs is paramount for everybody, so the public perception that dollars are being delivered is actually happening.
10:10 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
Thank you, Mr. Hubbard. Your time has expired.
Mr. Schellenberger, I'm glad to be in your riding. Somebody actually said that you were going to come in Shakespearian costume today, and I'm rather disappointed.
10:10 a.m.
Conservative
Gary Schellenberger Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
I apologize for that. They didn't have one to fit me.
Again, I thank the committee very much for coming to Stratford and to this part of southwestern Ontario for this very important meeting.
I feel a little foreign sitting here, as I chair the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage. I just have to watch the clock lots of times, and I don't really have the opportunity to ask too many questions. But I do know that in my riding, in Perth—Wellington, supply management is a very important part of the agriculture.
I also know that grains and oilseeds are very important, and I also realize that CAIS has not worked. It has worked somewhat for the hog industry. There are some good things and bad things.
One thing I keep hearing about is the amount of paperwork that has to be done. I think it was Ed who mentioned this morning again that these programs weren't necessarily put out to help accountants do very well; they were to get that money to the farm gate.
What do you think, other than maybe a one-pager or a two-pager to apply to some of these things? How can some of that be streamlined to help make sure that the bulk of the funds that are set out for farmers do get into the farmers' hands?
10:10 a.m.
President, Perth Federation of Agriculture
I think the government already has a lot of information on most operations through their income tax filings and so on. I think there's a lot of duplication in that information gathering.
I also believe that there is some information there that is technically irrelevant to determining whether there's a claim. If you are applying for different programs or different levels of programs, you're doing more than one set of forms. I think some of that could be streamlined.
Every year you do your farm program support form, and that would automatically entitle you to disaster assistance, CAIS assistance, or long-term support assistance, whatever the case may be. I think that would be a great improvement as well--just to have one set of forms that goes in once and that comes back and shows you exactly what you're entitled to on any of the levels of programming.
10:10 a.m.
Conservative
Gary Schellenberger Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
There was one other thing that interested me quite a bit, which was rail transportation.
I live just down the highway, in Sebringville, Ontario, and the Goderich-Exeter line runs through. The only thing that gets hauled on that track is grain or graders. I see various sizes of trains come down that track, with sometimes from five cars to fifty cars. They are primarily with CN, because that's a private railroad. You don't have too much problem with private rail; it's the national rail that we have the problem with. Is this the case?
10:10 a.m.
President, Huron Commodities Inc.
That's certainly correct. The Goderich-Exeter railroad, for example, has just bent over backwards to try to serve us the best they can.
As you know, their service terminates, I believe, in Guelph, where they interconnect with the CN. If the CN doesn't provide equipment or incoming cars or equipment for outgoing moves, there's really nothing the Goderich-Exeter railroad can do.
Frankly, I'm amazed that they continue to try to encourage investment in business on this line, with some of the frustrations they've had.
Without belabouring this, I think there needs to be some reform in the Transportation Act to really make the railroads accountable. I think most of us understand, as was mentioned earlier, that transportation plays a huge part in agriculture and in what our final realization of receipts or profitability might be.
We're all partners in this right from the farm level through to the grain elevators, the processors, the exporters, and the railroads. We all have to work together to make it a viable industry.
10:15 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
I'll allow it just because this is your home, and I know you have to leave at 11 o'clock, but it has to be very brief, Mr. Schellenberger.
10:15 a.m.
Conservative
Gary Schellenberger Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
It will be. Unfortunately, I can't stay until a quarter after eleven. I wanted to stay the whole day, but I do have another engagement I have to go to.
To any of the other presenters here today and to the committee, I apologize for having to leave, but thank you very much for allowing me to be around the table with you.
10:15 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
Thank you, Gary.
I have a couple of things I wanted clarified. Mr. Woods, you said in your opening comments that article 28 hasn't been used, but it has been used for the dairy industry. I only want to know whether you are aware of that.
10:15 a.m.
Chair of Board of Directors , District 7, Chicken Farmers of Ontario
Correct. It's actually item-specific. It has not been used in the poultry industry.
10:15 a.m.
Conservative
10:15 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
I was somewhat confused about that.
Also, both Mr. Murray and Mr. Woods were commenting on the commitment of the government to supply management. I'm wondering if you're aware that last week Minister Emerson was at the Cairns Group meeting in Pakistan and refused to sign the communiqué because it didn't go far enough to protect sensitive products.
10:15 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
You were aware of it, Mr. Woods, and Mr. Murray wasn't. I simply wanted to say that.
I think, Mr. Danen, you talked about production insurance to cover disease risk. This is actually something we haven't heard much of in our hearings. Have you had discussions with your provincial government and with your crop insurance program to see how that would fit in?