Evidence of meeting #20 for Agriculture and Agri-Food in the 39th Parliament, 2nd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was farmers.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Member of the Board, Saskatchewan Association of Rural Municipalities
We don't think it should be an impediment in that case.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
Are there differences in regulatory costs in compliance? I know a lot of businesses can explain that regulatory compliance and trying to live within the rules imposed by government cause a lot of costs to their operations and it has to come out somewhere along the line. Could this be a factor?
Member of the Board, Saskatchewan Association of Rural Municipalities
You're talking about fertilizer companies in particular?
Member of the Board, Saskatchewan Association of Rural Municipalities
I'm really not qualified. I would defer that question, if you don't mind.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
In the future maybe we should zero in on these things to see if there are significant differences, because it does make a difference if there are.
Member of the Board, Saskatchewan Association of Rural Municipalities
There's one thing I might add. I know--
Conservative
Member of the Board, Saskatchewan Association of Rural Municipalities
There's one thing that the Saskatchewan producers are focused on in this case, and that is competition.
You may have spoken to Farmers of North America. I'm not giving them a plug, but I think they have been instrumental in bringing fertilizer in from other countries. Someone mentioned Russia. It was a huge savings to producers. They brought some in through the Port of Churchill. We met with them about a month ago, and they told us they're bringing fertilizer through the Gulf of Mexico into Saskatchewan cheaper than we're going to be buying it.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
That's basically because prices in other parts of the world are significantly lower than North America, I think.
Did you want to comment?
Vice-President, Plant Biotechnology, Government and Public Affairs, CropLife Canada
Yes, please.
For our products, the prices for Canadian studies--just for Canada--can range anywhere from $1.5 million to $10 million additional to what's required for registrations elsewhere.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
I'm on this point because I've read a fair amount lately about academics on trade issues and so on.
They're really promoting something different in North America with these cross-border issues. They're talking about a custom union between Canada and the United States, as opposed to the current arrangement. I suppose it's more like the EU. I'd be interested in your opinions on that matter, if you have any, and whether that has merit.
Vice-President, Crop Protection Chemistry, CropLife Canada
Certainly for pesticides, the regulatory systems between Canada and the U.S. have been going closer together. We're not to a place yet where we can say there's approval both in Canada and the U.S. They're working towards that, and they've done a number of joint evaluations. But there still are significant Canada-only costs that producers bear in Canada.
Conservative
Brian Fitzpatrick Conservative Prince Albert, SK
If I could just follow up on that issue, when you look at the EU and the United States and the compliance requirements to get a pesticide or herbicide product into the market, it seems to me that the amount of science and the due diligence and so on that goes into that is quite elaborate. When you consider both of those jurisdictions together, to get through the hoops and get the product approved, I've often wondered.... Canada is a small country. We like to see ourselves as a major player in the world, but quite literally, the Canadian population and economy has 30 million people and 2% of the world's GDP.
These giant countries have a lot of science and due diligence to get something approved. Are we right in trying to duplicate the processes that go on in other countries?
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
Brian's time has expired. If you want to make a very brief response, please go ahead.
Vice-President, Crop Protection Chemistry, CropLife Canada
You're quite right, we're still only 3% to 4% of the pesticide market globally. Certainly the bottom-line decisions on pesticides in the EU, the U.S., and Canada are largely the same, so at the end of the day they come to the same decisions on the same products. It's just the timing and the complexity....
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
You're out of time, Brian. Sorry.
I have a couple of things I want to ask.
From CropLife, where are pesticides made in this country? I know that as a farmer, when I'm using some animal health products, they're manufactured elsewhere. Where are most of the pesticides and herbicides that we're using on the farm manufactured?
Vice-President, Crop Protection Chemistry, CropLife Canada
The active ingredients are made all over the world. It's split, probably three ways: the United States, the European Union, and Asia. For formulated product, they will take some of those ingredients, mix them with products, and actually put them in a jug. There's probably about 30% of those that are actually produced in Canada. But as for where the actual ingredients are made, it's really spread around the globe--probably a third in Europe, a third in Asia, and a third in the United States.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
My understanding is that Roundup, for example, is made in one plant, for the entire world if I'm not mistaken.
Vice-President, Crop Protection Chemistry, CropLife Canada
There is one major facility, but there are other facilities. I think for that particular product there are seven or eight manufacturers. There are plenty of companies that are in that business. As I said earlier, the key thing is that some of the ingredients they use to make those products are made by one or two manufacturers.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
I want to follow up with Mr. Qualman and Mr. Orb.
We've had a number of farm groups here and we've talked about input costs and stuff, but we've never talked about the tax treatment of any of those input costs, such as the excise tax on farm fuels or anything along that line.
One thing government can do is adjust taxes, of course, on farm input costs. Is that an area we should be looking at?
Mr. Qualman, you may go first, if you wish, and then Mr. Orb.
Director of Research, National Farmers Union
A lot of people talk about hidden taxes on inputs. We don't see that as a large problem. In the current environment, we're not even sure that tax cuts to these manufacturers would be passed on to farmers. When we look at the margins they're taking right now and the price increases they're putting forward in the absence of any real cost increases, it's not clear that they would have the competitive disciplines to pass those back down to farmers, unfortunately.
But if your committee does identify some hidden taxes that we're not aware of, we'd like to look at those.
Member of the Board, Saskatchewan Association of Rural Municipalities
Just to refresh my memory, didn't farmers used to get a rebate for the federal tax? I realize we get—
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Bezan
You can get your GST, or quite close to it, and probably your provincial sales tax on fuels. You'd get a rebate on that; I know in Manitoba we do. On excise taxes you don't, though.
Member of the Board, Saskatchewan Association of Rural Municipalities
I thought we used to get a rebate, did we not?