Agriculture Committee on May 26th, 2014

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

When you look at transit, when food comes in from other countries as we're importing various fruits and vegetables and so on, does your organization track the kind of waste there is in that particular area?

[Martin Gooch]

We don't do it specifically in that area. However, I was talking just last week to a major food manufacturer, and there were issues regarding the U.S.-Canadian border that led to an entire 40-foot container load of product going to waste.

[Earl Dreeshen, Conservative, Red Deer, AB]

In your introduction, you talked about where we could go forward. What thoughts and ideas do you have in that regard? What types of things would you like to see us doing to help the consumer and also to help the producer?

[Martin Gooch]

I'd like to see more emphasis on developing a business case. Many businesses don't see the connection between reducing food waste and increasing profitability. Many businesses don't see it, often because they don't measure it. It's not high on the radar screen.

I mentioned WRAP in one of my earlier responses. One of the main values that WRAP brings to the U.K. is that it actually works with businesses to identify how they can profit and where they can profit. It has actually helped them introduce the programs that will enable them to profit, or at least reduce loss, from the reduction of waste.

That's not published, because it's proprietary; all you see published are the generic results.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bev Shipley]

Thank you very much, Mr. Dreeshen.

[Martin Gooch]

It's very valuable work.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bev Shipley]

Madame Raynault, five minutes, please.

[Francine Raynault, NDP, Joliette, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank the witnesses for joining us today.

Mr. Gooch, earlier, you mentioned that vegetables were being wasted. People are wasting vegetables at home because they do not know how to preserve them. Someone said earlier that providing information in schools or on labels would help us avoid all that wasting of food. The waste rate of 30% works out to a lot of food.

Asparagus is currently in season in Quebec, and probably across Canada. Who knows how to preserve fresh asparagus? Should it be put in the fridge as it is? Should its bottom part be immersed in water, so that it would stay fresh longer?

I think that starting by educating children on these issues and then educating parents would be a very good idea. Children will tell their parents how to preserve vegetables like potatoes. I think that would be very important.

You also talked about consistency in expiry date labelling, and I agree with you. It is true that this is not always easy. The expiry date does not mean the yogurt will go bad three or four days later. However, people tend to throw it out because they are afraid of getting sick.

All of us probably do some grocery shopping. In our free time, we go to the grocery store and see vegetables. I have been an agricultural producer in the past, and I knew that, when I delivered vegetables, asparagus and tomatoes had to be very fresh. However, those that are a bit less fresh are not necessarily sent to the cannery and are still edible as such. A tomato is still good even if it does not have the little seal of approval someone may want.

What is your take on all this food being wasted? Should companies be forced to can vegetables that are still good, so that they would last longer and so that people could also eat them at a better price? What do you think about that?

[Martin Gooch]

There are some initiatives going on in Canada at the moment—for obvious reasons, I don't want to mention names—for diverting to processing products that aren't suitable for going to retail stores. One of the challenges, though, is that our food industry is so complex that it's often not feasible to take product from one supply chain and move it over, say, from the fresh supply chain into the processing supply chain.

I'm not in favour of more regulation. What I am in favour of is clever regulation. I think clever regulation could actually help businesses manage some of that better. We've done a number of studies in the past that show—and I've heard it said by a number of retailers—you only need one or two pieces of fruit in an entire display that are of poor quality to actually discourage consumers from buying that fruit. But if you purposely mark a product as “second grade“, and yes, if you discount it as well and sell it at a lower price, it can be very effective.

Just for starters, Tesco and Sainsbury's are just two of the retailers in the U.K. that come to mind and have done this quite successfully. Shop 'n Save in the U.S. saves $100 million annually, and part of that is by better managing produce in terms of discounting or actually marketing something as ugly, when it's not class one.

[Francine Raynault, NDP, Joliette, QC]

How could we help food distributors share their surplus with organizations or food banks, so as to reduce waste?

[Martin Gooch]

Some of the distributors and the food banks are working together well now. Certainly, one thing I would encourage more is that there has been talk about a tax incentive, and that is certainly one area that could work. The other area that could work is more explicit protection. Some businesses—many businesses—don't share as much food as they could with food banks because they fear prosecution, even if something they didn't do themselves leads to sickness through the redistribution of food.

There are definitely issues that can occur. Food Banks Canada and many food banks around the country would be in a far better position to advise you on that than I would be.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bev Shipley]

Thank you very much, Madame Raynault.

We'll now go to Mr. Payne for five minutes, please.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, Dr. Gooch, for coming.

This is a very interesting subject. My wife and I go shopping, when I'm around, and it's amazing. When we look at the products we find the ones that are looking good. The ones that are not looking so good, we don't take. I think most consumers are the same in this regard.

The other day we were in Costco, picking up a box of oranges. We opened it, and there were a couple of rotten ones in there, so no one is going to take that box of oranges. Potentially there's further waste by having those rotten oranges in that particular package.

You're absolutely right, I believe. There needs to be much more education of the retailers and the producers. The big question, obviously, is how do you get around to that?

On your website you talked about the Cut Waste, Grow Profit forum. I'm wondering if you could tell us how this forum works and what sorts of things come out of it. Do any innovative ideas come out of that forum?

[Martin Gooch]

Thank you.

We held the Cut Waste, Grow Profit forum two years in a row. We are currently working through the process of whether or not to hold it again this year, for a third year, given the number of other initiatives that have since sprung up.

The forum had two purposes. One was definitely to share ideas, share practices, communicate practices that are occurring around the world, not just in the U.S. and Canada. The other one was to put food waste on the radar screen, both publicly and within private businesses.

At last year's presentation we had a number of great examples from a hotel chain in how their executive chef was saving, in one instance, within one institution, quite massive amounts of food and increasing the hotel's profitability at the same time. We had a presentation from Mark Schembri from Loblaw who talked about how Loblaw managed food waste, reduced food waste in the store. From both of these presentations we had excellent feedback from the audience.

Also, Jason Wadsworth from Wegmans presented on how the Food Waste Reduction Alliance in the U.S. formed and what they're doing. They have just published a tool kit for reducing food waste through distribution and at the retail store and in restaurants.

It was largely a come and share, and let's learn from other practices. We had Dr. Peter Whitehead speak at last year's forum on what he did at the Food Chain Centre and what he has been doing with WRAP. Objectives and measurable results have helped businesses improve their profitability.

It's a hard slog. We work with a very ingrained industry.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

How many people or organizations would attend the forum, and is the message getting out?

[Martin Gooch]

Is it getting out as much as I'd like it to? Absolutely not. Part of the reason is that it's not on the radar of many businesses.

I'm envious of what WRAP has been able to achieve. It hasn't been able to achieve that with a $20 donation overnight; it's taken years. That's spawned a multitude of initiatives around the world. WRAP has, by far, made a positive return on investment from public dollars. The Food Chain Centre, which Dr. Peter Whitehead formerly directed, made, from memory, over 1,000% return on public investment within less than five years.

There's a lot of opportunity out there, and we're not taking advantage of it.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Yes, I know. A couple of organizations in my riding are doing some of that, which we'll hear about at some later date.

I am also interested in.... You talked about incentivizing in the U.K. Is the U.K. government continuing to incentivize organizations there, taking that tipping fee and moving it elsewhere?

[Martin Gooch]

The WRAP program continues to exist. Its public support from the U.K. government has been reduced, though it's also working more and more with mainland Europe. Food waste has become a highly political issue in the U.K., the same as in many other jurisdictions. The fact that it has become such a political issue is one of the reasons the WRAP program has been somewhat reduced.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bev Shipley]

Thank you very much, Mr. Payne.

We'll now go back to Madam Brosseau, please, for five minutes.

[Ruth Ellen Brosseau, NDP, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Thank you, Chair.

I think it's really interesting that we are studying this at committee and putting it on the radar. Comparatively, when we look at other countries and at what has been done in the U.K., in Australia, and even in the U.S., we can see that there is some work that can be done at all levels of government, I guess, because there is a return on investment. It does save money and it does help to diminish the environmental impacts that are caused by food waste.

I know that the Value Chain Management Centre has completed certain projects that have seen positive results. I'm wondering if you could describe those to us, please.

[Martin Gooch]

Yes. One of the projects was, again, with Loblaw and peaches. It was focused on looking at the present situation and what was occurring. This was in Ontario.

We've identified that in some years in Ontario a significant percentage of peaches grown in Ontario will actually go to waste in Ontario. There are a number of reasons for that, including when they were harvested, when they were picked, how they were packed, how they were cooled, how they were distributed, how they were displayed in stores, and how they were handled at every point. We first measured what was actually happening and then introduced a series of improvements in conjunction with Vineland Growers, with Loblaw, and with the involved producers and the distribution trucks. That led to reductions in waste.

We also proved that it's not all about price. There's a decent segment of consumers out there who actually will pay more than an above-commodity price for something they actually value—hey presto!—and we have an industry that largely, worldwide, focuses primarily or to a large extent on price.

So we've worked there and we've worked on other projects—for commercially sensitive reasons, I can't name who they were—where there have been significant reductions in waste, both here in Canada and in the U.S., from the food perspective, the energy perspective, and the labour perspective. One particular vegetable-processing facility has saved $7 million a year by reducing waste. They're not selling any more product. That $7 million has nothing to do with revenue. It's all reduced waste.

[Ruth Ellen Brosseau, NDP, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Canada is a very rich country, and we do import amazing foods, but I think we produce high-quality amazing foods. The problem is distribution.

We still have about 800,00 Canadians who visit a food bank every month. I think that if we had some kind of leadership or a plan to help feed these people better, it would work. I've heard about a project of a grocery store working with a food bank in Montreal. They will take food over to the food bank, and all along the way they will do tests to make sure the food is okay and safe. They'll transform the food and actually give it to Canadians who are in need. These people now have access to fresh, healthy foods.

Do you know about that project? I know there are other groups.

[Martin Gooch]

I don't know about that particular project, although I know of some projects such as Food Banks Canada, of course. Also, Loblaw and Target have an initiative that has been operating for over a year now. A number of retailers work with the food banks.

One of our challenges is that Canada is such a diverse country, so the solution that works in parts of Ontario like the Golden Horseshoe, or in Montreal or Quebec, will not work in other parts of the country. Part of it is that it might not be possible to as effectively distribute food from retailers through food banks in areas that are more rural.

[Ruth Ellen Brosseau, NDP, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

It's very important to be able to quantitate where we are with food waste. You've done a great job, but I think there would be a great need to find out in detail where food waste is and to know where you're coming from in order to know where you're going. Would that be a recommendation that you would have for the committee? Would you recommend that we study exactly where there is more food waste and how we can prevent it all along the food chain, not just for the consumer but in transport and at all levels of the processing?

[Martin Gooch]

Yes, there is a need for that to be done. There needs to be effective, objective measurement, not just asking people how much waste they think occurs. Invariably, what we think and what actually happens is different. We see that regularly in our projects.

There is a report that will be coming out shortly. Ourselves, the Network for Business Sustainability, and Dave Sparling at the University of Western Ontario worked with Provision Coalition on a report that will be released fairly soon. It will shed some light on the answers to the questions you've asked.