Agriculture Committee on Dec. 7th, 2017

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Would the information in that presentation help us? If so, could we get a copy of it?

[Dr. David Sauchyn]

I could certainly share it with you.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Okay. If you could send that to the clerk, it would be wonderful.

[Dr. David Sauchyn]

It was paid for by the taxpayers of Canada.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Well, we might as well use it. Thank you.

Professor Rood, as you were speaking, the pictures of Lethbridge brought back prairie memories. It's great to see that Mr. Barlow pulled you into the study here.

I was thinking of the melting of the snowcaps. The Bow River has some potential challenges with climate change. There are probably some challenges from Waterton. Is losing the snow in the mountains and the spring runoffs that come along with it something that needs to be considered?

[Prof. Stewart Rood]

Absolutely. Perhaps the biggest influence of climate change on water resources is indeed the change in the snow pattern. What we have is winter warming, so the ratio of rain to snow changes. Especially in the shoulder seasons and at lower elevations, we have shallower snowpacks. The problem there is that you really need that deep snowpack to provide the melt in mid to late summer. Unfortunately, the declining snowpacks are moving in exactly the wrong direction relative to our need for more water for our crops in the future.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

Not having the snow cover on the Prairies will drive frost deeper, which will drive moisture deeper, so it might not recover in time for the summer season.

[Prof. Stewart Rood]

That's right. All of these have feedbacks, and unfortunately, a lot of the feedbacks are not what we really want.

The benefit relative to agriculture, unlike forestry or maybe agroforestry, is that since the crops are generally annuals—or if they are biennials or perennials, it's only a few years—there are opportunities to change cropping patterns and to develop some cultivars and things.

There are things that need to be done and there are things that are being done, but it is going to take effort.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

There's research money that needs to be considered as well, then.

[Prof. Stewart Rood]

Sure.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

I have another minute. I wasn't expecting that. I thought I was on a short cycle here, so I'll go back to the health of Prairie soil. We have grasslands that we need to maintain for cattle, but we also need to consider grasslands in terms of soil health and soil management.

Professor Rood, could you start us off with the issues around federally owned grasslands or areas where the federal government could help to preserve grasslands?

[Prof. Stewart Rood]

I think the situation in Saskatchewan may involve more federally owned lands than in Alberta. In relation to PFRA, and it may be the chronology of it, it's interesting that there were a number of transfers of ownership of infrastructure and properties to Alberta Agriculture. They went from PFRA, but they are still on government management. There are some special areas and some protected areas, so I don't think the situation is as much of a challenge in Alberta as it might be in Saskatchewan.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you, Professor Rood.

Now we have Mr. Barlow for six minutes.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Professor Rood, thank you very much for being here with us today. Professor Sauchyn, that was great information. I really appreciate the input that you've had.

I'm really glad, Professor Rood, that you brought up the first in, first out issue, which has been for us in Alberta a huge headache in terms of unused water licences or for those who could really access water. Is that an opportunity for us to have a much more extensive discussion on water licences and first in, first out in terms of ensuring the water resources that are available are being used as efficiently and as well as possible? I'm certain there are some opportunities for us to use our resources better.

[Prof. Stewart Rood]

Absolutely. That principle of prior allocation—first in time, first in right—is really tragic, and it's so inefficient. It does not make sense to allocate something based on conditions of a century ago, so yes, that principle needs to be revisited.

There are one or two fortunate things. One is that during the drought of 2001 in southern Alberta, when it was clear there was going to be a shortage of water, there was a meeting of the major irrigation districts in southern Alberta, along with the provincial water master, who said, “Okay, we're going to have a shortage. What shall we do?” The irrigation director said, “It's easy; with first in time, first in right, we get ours first.” He then had a list of the agencies that would be cut off first . Right at the top of that list was the food processing plant of Lamb Weston, a multi-million-dollar facility that utilized the product from the irrigation crops. The irrigation district said, “We obviously can't have that cut off.” This is the type of leverage that I am hopeful will allow us to revisit this obsolete historic precedent.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Thanks.

I wanted to touch on PFRA a little. My colleague Mr. Longfield brought it up.

If I recall, 90% of the PFRA land that was federally owned was in Saskatchewan and Manitoba. There was very little in Alberta, and what was in Alberta was given over to the provinces. It was up to them to decide what to do. I know that a few farmers and ranchers in our constituency got together and bought land as a grazing co-op, so there were opportunities there for them to save it.

In terms of research, we've also heard in our study that there is a void in research in commercialization, in getting it on the farm. Perhaps we can get some recommendations from this study that will help us address some of these shortfalls.

Last, before I run out of time, Mr. Rood, in the WISE program, the University of Lethbridge has become quite renowned for some of the water, agriculture, and soil studies you've done there. We've talked a little in this committee about some of the opportunities for new crops that are being grown around Lethbridge, the pulses, lentils, and sugar beets that would never have been grown there even a decade ago. Can you talk about the importance of the ongoing study in crop rotations that are allowing us to conserve our soil, as well as educating our producers and taking advantage of some of those new opportunities?

[Prof. Stewart Rood]

It's pretty exciting. It involves partnerships with the federal government. In Lethbridge we have a large Agriculture Canada research station. We have a large Alberta agriculture research group. Then we have the university and college. We're all working together.

There are explorations of new crops, as you've indicated. Lentils is a huge one now, and it's quite new. Potato is likely to take over in crop value. I don't know if it's number two or number three. There are some interesting new ones. I showed a picture of sorghum, and I think some other crops will be considered.

I think we need to think a little differently. If the government can provide mechanisms to help farmers experiment, I think it would be quite worthwhile.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Do I have a little more time?

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

You have a minute and three quarters.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

This is a little outside the box. I'm not sure if you'd be familiar with it, Professor Rood, but in connection with some of those new opportunities and experiments, there has been a lot of work in the Lethbridge area on the poppy farm with API Labs. Is that an opportunity? Do we have to start looking a little outside the box at those types of opportunities as well?

[Prof. Stewart Rood]

I think poppy is an ideal example. It's interesting that poppies were grown in the Lethbridge area during the Second World War when there were embargoes on export and movements of some of these alkaloids, so yes, that plant is well adapted to our climate. Instead of having the hazard of moving these materials across borders, if we could control this production and maintain it within Canada, I think it would be a really nice opportunity. Yes, poppies make good sense.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Last, in addressing our water issues, Professor Rood, what would be some of your recommendations? We talked about water licences, but can you put forward some other recommendations in water conservation that we should be taking a look at?

[Prof. Stewart Rood]

I'm expecting that over time, irrigation will progressively move to the warmer, drier regions for the higher-value crops. We do have a water market in Alberta to allow for the farmer to sell their licence. It's fairly new. I think this should be encouraged. I think it makes sense to grow some of these new specialty crops, some of the vegetables, etc., rather than irrigating hay in all cases. For sure livestock is huge, but at the same time we can grow livestock in the western Prairies quite well in non-irrigated regions.

Again, I think there's going to be a spatial shift, a move eastward in Alberta. I also think that southwestern Saskatchewan has some interesting opportunities relative to further irrigation development.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Pat Finnigan]

Thank you, Professor Rood and Professor Sauchyn. We had a great two hours here today.

This concludes our portion of today's climate change study.

Thank all of you so much.

We'll see you next week. The meeting is adjourned.