Agriculture Committee on Oct. 24th, 2022

[Hessel Kielstra]

We constantly look for better ways to heat, but it's just very difficult in the winters here when it goes down to -40°C at times. We are unique in terms of the coldness we have to deal with. We'll look at any innovation, though. I would have a whole different attitude towards the carbon tax if a percentage of that went strictly to innovation instead of going to other people. If it went to innovation to fix some of these problems and get to a more zero base, we would embrace that very quickly.

I don't know what else to say about it. People have talked, also, about biomass and stuff. There's a huge infrastructure you need with that, and if you need digesters and things like that, our operations in Canada are not big enough for that, and you won't get the heat you need. We're constantly looking.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Kielstra.

Ms. Brekveld, in a few seconds, do you have anything to add?

[Peggy Brekveld]

First of all, incentivize best management practices on the field, in the barn, etc. Second, the question is this: If food is for everyone, then why is it just the farmer who is bearing the brunt of the cost? It's a societal thing—

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, John Barlow]

Thanks, Ms. Brekveld. I have to cut you off there. I'm sorry about that.

We have Mr. Masse for two and a half minutes, please.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'll give Ms. Brekveld the final word here. In terms of generalizing for farmers, where I'm from there is a lot of industry—and I reference Ottawa and so forth. Our workers are also transitioning at home into a cleaner, greener environment, but farmers are doing it on their farm businesses as well as trying to do it in their homes. That would seem like an extra burden to me, coming from an urban area.

Is there a will to do that, and a full-blown culture to do that, but they need extra support to do those things? The auto sector is getting some supports, and purchasers are getting supports to transition and so forth, but they don't have to deal with trying to do this with a home business as well. That seems like an extra burden.

[Peggy Brekveld]

There's definitely going to be a time of transition as farmers move towards better practices. They are doing great practices—don't get me wrong. There are lots of good things happening. We can continue to build and grow and be better. There's always room for improvement.

Saying that, the transition has to come with some investment from society and from government, because it is the purse holder of society, often. There are opportunities to help us continue to invest and do more insulation, to continue to buy and enhance grain dryers, etc. There is a lot of opportunity to continue to get better, and there's a place for dollars to come from government, because it will benefit society as a whole.

[Brian Masse, NDP, Windsor West, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, John Barlow]

Thank you very much, Mr. Masse.

Since we have another minute or two left here, I just wanted to ask a couple of questions that I think came up during the testimonies that I thought were interesting.

Mr. Kielstra, you mentioned—and I think Mr. Bekkering did as well the concern there would be around animal health as well, which I don't think is a subject we've talked about a lot during this testimony.

Mr. Kielstra, could you tell me, square footage-wise, how big the 15 barns are that you mentioned on your poultry farm? How much energy is needed to ensure you keep that to 30°C, and how important is it to keep that temperature? You probably need a very dependable and reliable energy source. Maybe talk about the importance of that to animal health.

[Hessel Kielstra]

The barns are anywhere from 10,000 square feet to 15,000 square feet, but the important thing is that we can have that 30°C to 32°C temperature, and we have to get there in order for those little birds to survive. If there's a faulty furnace or something, it doesn't take much and we have 5,000 little dead chickens. If we'd done this to go with the spirit and intent of the carbon tax, we would have done everything to reduce it, but we can't. We are locked in. Those are the types of temperatures you need in order to raise these little birds.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, John Barlow]

That's right.

You were talking about other technology that may be available. Biomass has been talked about. Heat pumps have been talked about somewhat in this committee. Are they commercially viable, or are they there to the capacity where they would be considered an affordable energy source for barns that are, let's say, 10,000 to 15,000 square feet?

[Hessel Kielstra]

No. As far as I can tell, they don't measure up.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, John Barlow]

Thank you very much. I appreciate everyone's time here today, and I thank you very much for your testimony.

I will now bring this meeting to a close. I'll entertain a motion to adjourn.

Thanks, Mr. Steinley.

We're adjourned. Thanks, everybody.