Agriculture Committee on May 3rd, 2023

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

There is a commitment to animal disease prevention, so you seem to have some resources, but are they sufficient? I am not sure. Would you need more money to ensure herd safety?

[Philippe Morel]

I can assure you that we are making the best possible use of the resources allocated to us by Parliament.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

As I understand it, you use the resources you have, but more resources would be really helpful. Fine, that answers my question.

Inversely, my next question is about bovine spongiform encephalopathy, for which Canada has had negligible risk status for over a year, since 2021. Far be it from me to jeopardize the safety of production or to put the public at risk, but is there any consideration of reviewing this status? Cattle producers frequently talk to us about this, because it reduces their profitability. Is there any way to review it?

If we cannot go back to what was done before, is there any way to find a middle-of-the-road solution that would not compromise safety, but would put fewer restrictions on our producers?

[Dr. Mary Jane Ireland]

Thank you very much for that excellent question.

We received negligible risk status in 2021 from the World Organisation for Animal Health for our current BSE program. Our current BSE program was examined and determined to be strict enough and efficient and effective enough to grant us negligible risk status. That's based on our existing program.

We understand from industry that there are concerns, and that the differences between the U.S. and Canada in the handling and the listing of what we call “specified risk material”—those materials that present risk of BSE—are causing concerns for economic interests.

At the agency we are supporting a risk assessment to look at what the risks would be should we harmonize with the U.S.: risk to human health, risk to animal health, risk to our international trade and risk to our negligible risk status. We are working with industry to have this risk assessment completed so that we can determine whether or if changes to the BSE program could be accomplished and what the risks might be.

To say it perhaps more plainly, we are making sure that we do not make changes to the BSE program that cause risk. We need to know what those are, so a study is ongoing and we are collaborating with industry to get that done.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Thank you very much to both of you.

Mr. MacGregor, you'll end the second round with two and a half minutes, please.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

I would like to get a sense of approximately how many novel pests and pathogens Canada faces each year on average. Is it an overwhelming number? Do you have a ballpark figure?

I'm just curious as to the threat level our scientists have to deal with and the number that are novel, the approximate number that we have to be on the lookout for. If you don't have a number, can you gauge it as a fairly serious threat or a growing threat from worldwide pathogens and pests and their impacts?

[Philippe Morel]

Maybe I could start while she's thinking—

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Can I load you up with a second question as well?

[Philippe Morel]

Sure.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Also, how is the CFIA using its expertise to help other countries develop best practices? We live in a globalized world, of course, and the best defence might be a good offence in helping other countries beef up their internal programs.

[Philippe Morel]

Thank you.

I don't know how many new diseases we face every year. It's a very difficult question.

What I can say for sure is that commerce is increasing and that the risks that come with commerce are also increasing. Every time we refine our detection and our inspection risk, we review the risk grid that we have for every product we import. Our reaction is based on the level of activity that is happening, and we do everything we can to make sure that where the risks are known or potentially known, we are there to respond to it and mitigate them.

[Dr. Mary Jane Ireland]

In addition, you asked about working with other countries to keep animals healthy globally. We do in fact work with other countries, and some of those countries, like the U.S., work with other countries. We are very cognizant of the globalized nature of animals and the movement of animals.

To give you an example, through efforts through the World Organisation for Animal Health, our scientists will work with other countries to help establish diagnostics, capacity and training. We have twinning projects with other countries. We work through WOAH around issues like ASF. At the end of May, I'll go to the general assembly and discuss avian influenza.

The community of CVOs is not that big, and we share our expertise. As I said, we have the best and brightest scientists at CFIA, and they can help countries with capacity building and expertise and are really willing to do that. It enriches their work and their profession as well.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Okay, thank you.

Colleagues, we will do a third panel, but it's not going to be five minutes. It will be about two minutes. It will be two minutes for Mr. Steinley and two minutes for Mr. Louis.

I have one question, and then we'll wrap up and get to our report.

Go ahead, Mr. Steinley.

[Warren Steinley, Conservative, Regina—Lewvan, SK]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I would like to revisit the question around the negligible risk status for our country that we received in May of 2021, two years ago. My understanding is that it was because we have not detected any BSE in this country since 2015.

I am wondering why it would affect our trade status, if the animal health organization felt we had negligible risk, if we changed our regulations within Canada. Did half of the reason that we got that status have to do with our regulations, or was it just because we haven't detected any BSE since 2015 in our country?

[Dr. Mary Jane Ireland]

In order to obtain negligible risk status, Canada provided the World Organisation for Animal Health with a very comprehensive, in-depth package of information and data to show that we have the right controls in place to prevent BSE from occurring again. Those were all the components of our processes, our inspections and our data. That was evaluated by the scientific commission, and it was determined that our program was solid and sufficient and that Canada was deserving of negligible risk status.

The negligible risk status that was given to Canada did not change the program. The program is what that status is based on.

It's not to say the changes can't occur—

[Warren Steinley, Conservative, Regina—Lewvan, SK]

I understand that. I'm just wondering if a regulation change will affect our status.

[Dr. Mary Jane Ireland]

If we were to make regulatory changes or policy changes, we would provide our information to the World Organisation for Animal Health, and they would make an assessment about whether those changes were significant. We would do that through a reporting system as—

[Warren Steinley, Conservative, Regina—Lewvan, SK]

Does America have the same status that we have right now?

[Dr. Mary Jane Ireland]

The U.S. has a negligible risk status also.

The U.S. has a different history with BSE in terms of cases and types of BSE. They have different infrastructure and different risks, which they have addressed with their own program. We have different risks, which we have addressed with our own program.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Thank you, Mr. Steinley.

We'll go to Mr. Louis.

[Tim Louis, Liberal, Kitchener—Conestoga, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you to all the witnesses. I appreciate your testimony here. I think it is instilling the confidence of our committee in your ability to react to situations.

I will direct my questions in the limited time I have to Mr. Hoag.

I live in southern Ontario. The spotted lanternfly is an invasive species in North America and can damage plants and trees, including grapes, apples, fruits. This invasive species has not been found in Canada yet, but there is concern that if it were to arrive in Canada, our wine industry and our fruit and vegetable crops would be at risk.

I want to know whether you could expand on the import controls and the response plans. Dr. Ireland mentioned the term “playbook”. What would our playbook be for invasive species like the spotted lanternfly?

[Shawn Hoag]

Thank you for the question.

I can't speak to the spotted lanternfly specifically, but I can follow up with the committee on plans regarding that invasive species specifically.

In general, the way we approach invasive species is that once we get information from Environment and Climate Change Canada or Agriculture Canada or the CFIA, we convert that into direction to our frontline officers. That direction to frontline officers takes the form of indicators or things to look for. Those could be things on boats. They could be things in wood packaging or pests that are inside containers—all of those different modes or vectors by which goods and pests could arrive.

Once the officers look at the risk of the goods that are arriving and conduct a progressive exam—they look deeper, depending on what they are seeing—then they detain the goods and seek advice if they don't fully understand what's in front of them. If they do fully understand what they have and it is regarded as an invasive species, then they reject its entry or they move to seize and have it destroyed.

[Philippe Morel]

If I may, Mr. Chair, in 10 seconds, we have a very aggressive communication approach on spotted lanternflies to make sure....

With invasive species, rule number one is to detect. As soon as you detect, you can contain, and in some situations you can also eradicate. We have a very aggressive communication package, for example, in southern Ontario and southern Quebec where the risk is higher for these species.

[The Chair, Liberal, Kody Blois]

Thank you, Mr. Louis.

I have just a couple of questions.

We mentioned the foot-and-mouth disease vaccine bank specific to Canada, which I think everyone on this committee would have to agree is a smart and prudent investment.

Mr. Rosser, help me understand. Is it going to be in one place in the country? Are these certain vaccines we have dispersed over multiple locations that have some secure elements? Where are these vaccines actually located in the event they are needed? Could you provide this committee what those considerations would be?

[Tom Rosser]

Mr. Chair, perhaps my CFIA colleagues may have something to add.

I think I may have mentioned previously that we are in discussions with provinces and territories and industry partners through groups like Animal Health Canada, not only on purchasing vaccines and where they would be stored and how they would be accessed but also on how they would be distributed in the event of an outbreak. There is a collaborative exercise to operationalize and make real this vaccine bank and many of the specifics of it.

There is some precedent of a North American vaccine bank in the past. I'm not sure those details have been specified, but there's a very active dialogue going around to work through them.