Evidence of meeting #11 for Agriculture and Agri-Food in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was process.
A video is available from Parliament.
Chief Legal Officer, Loblaw Companies Limited
I don't have the specifics of what you're referring to, so it's hard to talk generally.
As I said previously, the success of our suppliers is fundamental to our success as well, so we look to working actively with our suppliers to make sure that we can set them up for success.
Without some specifics, it's very hard to comment. I'd happily take that off-line and address that. If there are some specifics you could raise, I could come back to you on that.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Michael Coteau
We'll go to the Conservatives now. We'll do three minutes and three minutes, if that's okay.
Mr. Gourde, you have three minutes.
Conservative
Jacques Gourde Conservative Lévis—Lotbinière, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'd like to start with Mr. Rivard.
I'm disappointed because we realize that the Canadian grocery code will not lower costs and make groceries more affordable. On the other hand, will the code succeed in resolving certain disputes between grocers and their head offices, which often impose restrictions? They enter into agreements with suppliers and large farms, but they limit buying locally from small farms. A small farm has to start somewhere before it becomes a large farm.
In my riding, I've seen grocers unable to purchase local products. To get around corporate regulations, they set up a public market outside their building, without any problems. I was told local products couldn't be purchased inside, but that they were allowed to use their entire parking lot to sell these products.
Do you think it's fair that grocers are forced to use their parking lot to sell local products?
Vice President, General Counsel and Corporate Secretary, Metro Inc.
Look, I'm not aware of those situations. As I said earlier, we promote local products. Clearly, we have a policy in effect and we comply with it. Can that kind of thing happen at certain supermarkets? You know, we have independent merchants, affiliates, franchisees, so it is not impossible.
If you would like to bring something specific to my attention after the meeting, we can look into it.
Conservative
Jacques Gourde Conservative Lévis—Lotbinière, QC
Mr. Henn, are your regulations for grocers as flexible as Metro's? Or do you focus more on better supporting your suppliers?
Chief Legal Officer, Loblaw Companies Limited
I'm sorry. Was that a question for me?
Chief Legal Officer, Loblaw Companies Limited
We're the largest buyer of produce in Canada, whether that's in Quebec or in other jurisdictions. We favour, as much as we can, Canadian suppliers, but as Mr. Rivet correctly pointed out, you can't buy avocados and pineapples that are grown in Canada. There are circumstances, because of products or quality, when we have to go outside—
Conservative
Jacques Gourde Conservative Lévis—Lotbinière, QC
I'm sorry to interrupt, but perhaps you didn't understand the question.
When you resell products from headquarters to your grocers, do you allow them to have a place in their store to sell products from smaller producers so that your business partners can buy local products?
Chief Legal Officer, Loblaw Companies Limited
Yes, we do. Wherever we can, we meet the local demand from customers for local products, whether that be produce or beer or other products in the store. We want to be as local as we can.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Michael Coteau
Thank you, sir.
Now we'll go to the Liberals and MP Harrison for three minutes.
Liberal
Emma Harrison Liberal Peterborough, ON
Thank you so much.
The riding I represent, Peterborough, is home to many small farms and local producers. You mentioned that the code might make it easier for local and small suppliers to negotiate. I was wondering if you could elaborate on that, Mr. Rivet.
Vice President, General Counsel and Corporate Secretary, Metro Inc.
The code establishes a framework of transparency, fairness and principles. It is not targeted only at large suppliers and retailers. It also targets small and medium-sized retailers and suppliers. It's like a guide. If they follow the guide, then everything will be fine.
We believe that it will definitely help the relationship. At Metro, we already have a very good relationship, but we think that it will improve the discussions and negotiations for everyone.
Liberal
Emma Harrison Liberal Peterborough, ON
Mr. Taylor, have amendments been made to the U.K. code since its implementation? If so, what is the process for doing so?
October 30th, 2025 / 4:25 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Lactalis Canada Inc.
The text in the statute books remains the same as it was when it was first written, but there have been adjustments to the processes around adjudication, which have come from learnings. It's important that our code continues to adapt to the changing environment that we all operate in, in order to remain relevant.
Liberal
Emma Harrison Liberal Peterborough, ON
Thank you so much.
When people sign on to the code, because now it's mandatory, do they agree to any of the amendments made, or is that brought back to negotiation?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Lactalis Canada Inc.
It's a great question.
The code written in the U.K. was done with a very light touch. The drafting was very broad, which leaves it open to interpretation. It is not a legal tome. If it were a legal tome, people would spend all their time trying to figure out how to get around it. It's there to be interpreted. The adjudicator has the freedom to interpret it and to work with suppliers and manufacturers to adjust definitions that meet need according to particular circumstances at the time.
Liberal
Sophie Chatel Liberal Pontiac—Kitigan Zibi, QC
Thank you. I'll ask it quickly.
Mr. Taylor, what are the current impacts on investment in your type of business in terms of uncertainty around the fees grocers charge? Are there any impacts?
President and Chief Executive Officer, Lactalis Canada Inc.
We're all in the business of managing scarce resources. I'm part of a large international company, and I'm competing with about 100 other countries for investment. If uncertainty around outcomes in my trading relationships is a feature of business in Canada, and if the U.S. or Brazil has more certainty, the chance of them getting that investment, rather than me, increases.
