Agriculture Committee on Jan. 27th, 2026

[The Chair, Liberal, Michael Coteau]

I call the meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 20 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-Food.

Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format, pursuant to the Standing Orders. Members are attending in person in the room and remotely using the Zoom application.

Before we continue, I'd like to ask all in-person participants to consult the guidelines written on the cards on the table. These measures are in place to help prevent audio feedback incidents and to protect the health and safety of all participants, including our interpreters. You will also notice a QR code on the card, which links to a short awareness video.

I would like to make a few comments for the benefit of witnesses and members.

Please wait until I recognize you by name or you are asked a question directly by a member before speaking. For those participating via video conference, click on the microphone icon to activate your mic, and please mute yourself when you are not speaking. For those on Zoom, at the bottom of your screen, you can select the appropriate channel for interpretation: floor, English or French. For those in the room, you can use the earpiece and select the desired channel. As a reminder, all comments should be addressed through the chair. Members in the room, if you wish to speak, please raise your hand. Members on Zoom, please use the “raise hand” function.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) and the motion adopted by the committee on Thursday September 18, 2025, the committee is commencing its study on reference prices in the pork and beef supply chains.

I'd like to welcome our witnesses joining us here today. From the Canadian Pork Council, we have René Roy, chair, and Stephen Heckbert, president and chief executive officer. We also have, from Les Éleveurs de porcs du Québec, Louis-Philippe Roy, chair, and Tristan Deslauriers, public relations manager and secretary-general. Each group will have up to five minutes to speak, and then we'll go to questions.

Before we start, I'd like to turn it over to Mr. Perron.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, committee members.

Mr. Chair, thank you for allowing me to take the floor, as we are making a transition this morning. My esteemed colleague and sincere friend Sébastien Lemire will take over the agriculture, agri-food and supply management file from me.

As you know, this is an issue that I wear with pride, zeal and passion. I may even be a bit nuts at times. I'm very committed to what I do, and it's because I love these people deeply. These are dedicated people who get up early and go to bed late to feed our population. In general, in the political world, we are not sufficiently aware of this. The people around this table and many people in Parliament know this, but it takes apostles to make these people's voices heard. In recent years, I have strived to get to know them well in order to represent them well. I hope they feel that I have lived up to their expectations. I think I have. I'm very proud of the work that's been done. I'm in mourning, obviously, this morning, because this is a roIe I love. These are people I love, and so do you, members of the committee.

I don't know if you've ever heard me say this in Parliament, but I've often cited the Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-Food as an example in a Parliament where we too often see partisan interests, negative comments and criticism taking precedence over the common good. I'm proud to be able to say that I've never felt that in this committee. I've always felt that my colleagues were thinking first and foremost about the people at the end of the table who ensure our collective safety. That's huge.

There's a lot of talk about defence right now. The defence budget will be increased. I don't understand why, even today, we're able to aim to allocate 5% of our budget to defence, when less than 1% of the budget goes towards supporting the people who ensure our collective survival. That's quite something.

I didn't think I would speak for so long, but you'll understand that I'm very emotional this morning. So I wanted to come and see you, to salute my friend Sébastien, who knows that I will always be there, without however becoming his stepfather. I sent the same message to my colleagues around the table and to the people in the agricultural sector. We spoke yesterday, so it's not a shock to them. They already know, because I prepared them for it.

So I wanted to thank you, as well as the people from the agricultural and agri-food sectors. There's often less talk about the people in the agri-food world, who are just as essential. They process the food that has been produced so that we can eat it. We need to support these people and give them the right conditions so that they can feed our people and the whole world as well.

So I tip my hat to you. Keep up the good work. I'll be watching. If you start acting partisan, I'll be back to set things right.

Thank you. Have a good day.

[Some hon. members]

Hear, hear!

[The Chair, Liberal, Michael Coteau]

Thank you very much, Mr. Perron.

I would say, on behalf of the entire committee, thank you for everything you've done to help. I'm sure no matter where you are, on which committee, you'll be a strong advocate for agriculture. Thank you so much.

Welcome, Mr. Lemire.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Excuse me, Mr. Chair, but I looked up and saw the interpreters behind the window, at the back. They know I talk about them often. I was emotional when I was talking about agriculture and agri-food. Agriculture is a technical and complex field, so I also want to highlight their excellence. I wish them continued success.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Michael Coteau]

All right. Thank you so much.

Okay, so we will start. I'll turn it over for five minutes to the Canadian Pork Council.

[René Roy, Chair, Canadian Pork Council]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Honourable members of the committee, let me begin by wishing you all a happy new year.

Before Mr. Yves Perron leaves, I would like.... It was supposed to be a little bit later in my speech.

I would like to acknowledge Mr. Perron's high level of collaboration, availability and open-mindedness in all the work we have done on the committee. I deeply appreciate it.

Thank you, Mr. Perron.

Let me begin by wishing you all a happy new year, and welcome back to Ottawa.

My name is René Roy, and I'm a hog producer on a family farm in Quebec, in the Beauce region. I'm also the chair of the Canadian Pork Council. Thank you for the opportunity to appear before you.

The current information gap is preventing our industry from realizing its full long-term potential.

We are asking Canada to implement a mandatory price reporting system, modelled after the USDA mandatory price reporting in the United States.

My testimony today will focus on two strategic pillars: managing price decoupling from the U.S. market and ensuring our capacity to assess competitiveness.

The first critical issue is the correlation between our price and the U.S. benchmark. Too often, the price paid to Canadian producers decouples—is not aligned—from the reference market without any clear way for producers to identify the structural causes. This will be incredibly important should Canada or the United States suffer a catastrophic foreign animal disease challenge, such as ASF. Setting up price transparency in advance will protect Canadian producers by setting up a Canadian price system before it is absolutely required.

The second pillar is our collective ability to understand our own value chain. We are often told that Canada is globally competitive, but without verified data, we are essentially navigating by guesswork. Canadian pork is world-renowned for its quality, traceability and high animal welfare standards. A transparency system would reveal how this added value actually translates into dollars at the primary transaction level.

A transparent market is a market that inspires confidence. By providing clear data on margins, we make the sector more attractive for the next generation of farmers and for the capital investment needed to modernize our infrastructure.

Price transparency is not punitive to processors or retailers. It is an economic health tool for the entire value chain. By adopting a system similar to the USDA's, but including the retailers in the analysis, we aren't just copying our neighbours. We are arming our producers with the same tools to defend their margins. We are giving ourselves the means to prove, with hard data, the strength of the Canadian pork model.

Thank you for your attention to this matter. We are available to answer any questions you may have.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Michael Coteau]

Thank you very much.

I'll turn it over now to Les Éleveurs de porcs du Québec.

[Louis-Philippe Roy, Chair, Les Éleveurs de porcs du Québec]

Good morning, everyone.

Allow me to introduce myself. I'm Louis‑Philippe Roy, chair of Les Éleveurs de porcs du Québec. I have a pork business in Saint‑Michel‑de‑Bellechasse, on a farm where I live with my wife and our three children. I come not from the agricultural sector, but from the city. I'm a young man who took over a hog farm from a producer a few years ago, and I have been involved with Les Éleveurs de porcs du Québec for almost 10 years.

Les Éleveurs de porcs du Québec is an organization that represents 2,445 producers in the province. Taken as a whole, the Quebec pork industry represents nearly 38,000 direct and indirect jobs and generates $3.7 billion in economic benefits.

The study undertaken today by the Standing Committee on Agriculture and Agri-Food gives us a lot of hope, the hope of finally achieving fairer business relationships between producers and the processing sector, as well as relationships that are better rooted in the reality on the ground.

Greater price transparency in the processing sector will inevitably lead to better trade relations. It will also correct certain price distortions, which happen too often between producers and processors. The pork industry's future depends on the strength and sustainability of the production link. That is what guarantees that Canadian consumers have sustainable access to a very high-quality product.

The first issue concerns the price of live hogs in Canada, which is based on an American reference price. Our markets are highly integrated, and this reference price is usually very relevant. However, the current geopolitical context makes it essential to diversify our reference prices. Otherwise, there may be long periods of time in which they do not reflect the reality in Canada.

For example, American pork prices had a sharp decrease between 2015 and 2019 because of a production surplus in the United States. Quebec producers were subjected to that price drop, even though our production was lower than the needs of the province's slaughterhouses.

More recently, between May 2021 and 2022, the situation was reversed. A number of Quebec slaughterhouses had to reduce their capacity, mainly because of temporary closures, logistical problems or COVID‑19. This limited their orders and drove down the average price of exported meat. Meanwhile, the American reference price that informs the price of pork in Quebec was increasing, which automatically increased the price of live hogs. In other words, even though the American prices were rising, our slaughterhouses had to sell their meat at much lower and thus pitiful prices. That meant that the production link was losing money.

These examples show one thing: All links in our industry become vulnerable when American benchmarks no longer represent the situation in Canada. A number of potential events pose the same kind of very real risks, whether it be the potential imposition of tariffs on Canadian meat exports or the outbreak of swine fever, as my Canadian counterpart also told you. That leads us to really question the actual level of transparency in the Canadian processing sector, as well as the fairness of the price paid to producers.

The second issue that greatly concerns us is the inequality of information available during negotiations between producers and processors. Regardless of the province or the marketing method, one thing stays the same: a price formula must always be used to negotiate the farmgate price for live hogs. However, negotiations are conducted in an unfair context, where one party has access to a lot more information than the other.

On the processing side, there is no obligation to be transparent. It's all opaque. Price information is only disclosed when processors choose to disclose it. It's the opposite on the farm side. For example, producers in Quebec are investigated every five years. Every farm expense item is analyzed to determine how much it costs to raise a hog, and that report is made public by the government authorities in Quebec. The number of hogs sold and the price obtained also have to be published on the Éleveurs de porcs du Québec website. This creates an imbalance in the bargaining power between the producer and the processor.

To illustrate the situation, we can compare price negotiation to a card game. It's as though producers are playing with their cards face up, while processors are keeping their cards hidden. Add the fact that the market is dominated by a few processors, and it quickly becomes clear who has an advantage.

In conclusion, the study that this committee has launched today is promising for the pork industry not only in Quebec, but also in Canada. It is an essential step toward establishing a frame of reference that is better suited to the reality in Canada. There's no question that the American reference price will continue to play an important role, given the integration of our markets.

We can no longer afford to exclude a Canadian reference price from the equation. Setting this Canadian reference price will bring significant and immediate benefits, a better balance of market power, fairer relationships between slaughterhouses and producers, an industry—

[The Chair, Liberal, Michael Coteau]

I have to ask you to stop there. I'm sorry about that.

[Louis-Philippe Roy]

It's not a problem.

[The Chair, Liberal, Michael Coteau]

Thank you, Monsieur Roy.

We'll turn it over to questions now, and we'll start with the Conservatives for six minutes.

Mr. Gourde, go ahead.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Roy and Mr. Roy. You can both answer my question.

Geopolitics has a very significant effect on prices. Whether we like it or not, the Canadian pork market is an export market. We have to ship our hogs all over the world to many countries. Historically, Canada has had many customers around the world. The last time Canadian government officials visited China, tariffs on canola, beef and other products were reduced. Unfortunately, those aimed at pork have not been reduced.

Do you have anything to say about that?

[René Roy]

I'll start, since this is a Canadian issue, but my colleague can add his comments afterward.

We hope those 25% tariffs are going to come down as quickly as possible. They have impacts on our competitiveness and reduce our industry's investment capacity, because that money isn't collected for our industry. It's unfortunate. We're working closely with the government to successfully lower those tariffs. We have established an industrial office in China to increase our co-operation with the Chinese government and work closely with the Government of Canada in the current geopolitical context.

[Louis-Philippe Roy]

Let me add to that.

It's clear that this money that isn't returned to processors could result in a lack of investment. That means that the industry could become less efficient. Our buyers' ability to pay producers properly also has a cause and effect relationship. Quebec, like Canada, has made value added its strength, so if that money isn't available to make investments, the entire Canadian industry will lose out in all markets. This has a fairly negative effect on the industry.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

There's still a lot of work to be done on tariffs at the global level to ensure a certain fairness for producers.

[Louis-Philippe Roy]

There's still a lot of work to be done, yes. It's important to understand that the Chinese market is a very targeted market. Parts are consumed there that aren't consumed elsewhere, in other markets. That makes China a very important market for those parts, which are less noble than the ones we consume here in North America. We must not give up on China; we really need it.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

I'd like to come back to the issue of transparency between producers, processors and distributors, because it's really important.

It's no secret what happens when there's an overabundance of meat among producers: the price drops, sometimes to historically low levels that make no sense. However, there's a certain opacity there, because those who receive that meat always end up reselling it for a profit. By buying it cheap, they're able to find markets to resell it. When the price starts to go back up, it takes some time for the entire stock to run out and for producers to be able to profit from it. Meanwhile, they're losing a lot of money.

I think it's a good initiative, then, but are the processors ready to be more transparent in that regard? Are you reaching out to them?

[René Roy]

We went to the processors and told them that it would be good to have a voluntary system. We have been asking for that for a number of years. Given the circumstances, we can't wait any longer. It's important to set up mechanisms that are ready to intervene in the event of a major downturn. That's why we're asking to find tools that would enable us to get there faster. As I said, it's important for the entire industry, not just for producers.

[Louis-Philippe Roy]

That's correct.

This transparency would enable producers to negotiate on a level playing field with buyers, which would help us greatly. Agricultural production is done by Canadian families, so this issue is very important. Our sector has experienced major crises in Quebec. In 2021‑22, production had to be reduced. Greater transparency might have allowed us to adjust. Some farms still had to close. We have experienced human tragedies among our ranks in Quebec.

This transparency could help producers on the ground and enable them to negotiate better and protect themselves from what's happening in the market. We're very aware that the pork market is a global market, even for processors. Even they don't control everything that happens, but with that transparency, we could be better allies, both as industries and as partners.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

It's also important for producers to disclose their production costs. In fact, I'd like to congratulate all the associations that are doing so proactively. This is important because when the price of pork drops below the cost of production, not just for three months, but for an extended period of time—sometimes two or three years—it jeopardizes the entire industry. If there's no more pork, everything else falls apart.

If a situation like that happens and doesn't recover after two, three or four months, can we sound the alarm and tell everyone that we need to sit down together to at least ensure that the production costs for pork producers are covered? Without pork production, there is no pork. The same is true for other production. This happened with beef. Stocks are very limited, and the price of beef has gone up, but herds aren't being rebuilt.

Could the same thing happen in the pork sector? If the price stays low for too long and the livestock numbers decrease, could the price go back up?

[The Chair, Liberal, Michael Coteau]

We've run out of time. I'm sorry. You're at six minutes. Maybe the question will be asked later.

I'll go to the Liberals for six minutes.

Go ahead, MP Chatel.

[Sophie Chatel, Liberal, Pontiac—Kitigan Zibi, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I would be remiss if I didn't welcome Mr. Lemire, whose riding is just north of mine.

[Sébastien Lemire, Bloc, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

We're neighbours.

[Sophie Chatel, Liberal, Pontiac—Kitigan Zibi, QC]

Yes, we are.

I'd also like to say that Mr. Perron has been an absolutely fundamental member of this committee. He said it was one of the best committees and one of the least partisan, but that's in large part due to his leadership. He has never lost sight of the agricultural community, both in Quebec and in Canada, and it has always been close to his heart, so I'd like to thank him for his passion. He has been a very strong voice for the agricultural community, and we will miss him greatly, but I'm also very happy to have a neighbour as a friend in committee. I'm sure he'll carry on that great leadership.

Gentlemen, there's a lot of talk about food sovereignty and autonomy in Canada right now. It's important. Yesterday, the government announced measures to address food insecurity and help people protect themselves from it, including a Canadian strategy on the matter. That means our study is in line with that thinking, because farmers have to be allowed to be independent in their business planning, seize opportunities, grow and have financial security. It's essential for us to support them, because they're the ones who feed our world. If we want a strong Canada, we need a strong agricultural sector.

With that said, thank you very much for your opening remarks. Here's my question: Can you clearly describe how the system works in the United States and how, in very concrete terms, you would like such a system replicated here in Canada?

Mr. René Roy, I'll let you answer first.