Agriculture Committee on Sept. 25th, 2025

[Emma Harrison, Liberal, Peterborough, ON]

My question is for the Department of Agriculture. You spoke about the 26 actions, of which 12 are done and others are ongoing. The terms, I think, were the medium and long term. Would you say that the department is pleased with the progress you've made so far? Can you talk about some of the benefits that farmers and producers are seeing or have seen over the course of your efforts to reduce the regulatory burden?

[Steven Jurgutis]

Sure. A lot of the things that we put forward, as you'll see in the report, tend to be things that don't necessarily have a direct impact straight on producers but tend to have more indirect impacts on the kinds of organizations that they deal with.

Some examples include things like the marketing boards that we have across the country. Right now, in order to make changes in the way the boards apply levies to their members, which is decided by their members, a federal change is required. That's an opportunity to be able to push that down to the provincial level and to enable those organizations, for example, to spend more time on the things that benefit their members in the sector versus looking to do things that are more administrative in nature. That's one thing I would mention.

I think I did mention, as a highlight, that agile regulations table as something that we've found quite helpful and useful, and we've had very positive responses from the sector about it as well. One more thing I would touch on, as part of the Canadian Agricultural Loans Act program, is looking to modernize the way that the system works, to have different and better indicators for the kinds of information that farmers need to provide, which makes it easier for them to be able to get access in those circumstances to the loans they are looking to get, as part of the system that we have in support.

Thank you.

[Emma Harrison, Liberal, Peterborough, ON]

I was raised in a farm family, and I think there's so much stress and burden when you're working with mother nature constantly and constantly battling the weather. The industry is quite complex, so I'm wondering what supports are available to industry for navigating how complex the sector is. Do you see people regularly taking advantage of those?

[Steven Jurgutis]

We have a fairly extensive support network of programs through business risk management, but also through a number of what we refer to as strategic initiatives, as part of our sustainable Canadian agriculture partnership. We have a lot available in terms of tools and resources for producers to take advantage of. We have, actually, a fairly advanced ChatGPT-style service that's available [Technical difficulty—Editor].

It's important that producers realize that it's not only the federal programs but also the cost-shared provincial and territorial programs that they have available to them as well.

[The Chair, Liberal, Michael Coteau]

I'm going to have to stop you there. Thank you so much, and I'm sorry to interrupt you.

MP Perron.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses for being here. We appreciate their availability.

We're talking about reforms to increase efficiency and reduce red tape, and I think everyone agrees on the basic details. I am in regular contact with people in the agricultural sector, who tell me that the Pest Management Regulatory Agency's assessment and response times are extremely slow. For some products, it apparently took up to 10 years to get a response.

Mr. Jones or Mr. Bissonnette, how do you explain that? It seems to me that 10 years is a long time. Something must have happened. Either you stopped the assessment and shelved it, or something else happened.

[Matt Jones]

Thank you for the question.

In terms of the time, certainly PMRA has faced many challenges with the volume of the work that we have. I think when the act was crafted, it said that we needed to do re-reviews, re-evaluations, every 15 years. There were hundreds of products. There are now between 7,000 and 8,000 products, so the volume is certainly an issue.

We've also had to go through—on re-evaluations—many tens of thousands of pages of information in the literature that exists in order to do these reviews.

I'm sorry. Go ahead.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Did I understand correctly that your re-evaluations go back 15 years?

[Frédéric Bissonnette]

It's more about the workload.

According to the program, the assessment is done in co-operation with Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada, through the minor use program. The program generates data for us over several seasons. As a result, there is a long period between the time when it is determined to be a priority and the time when Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada can undertake the project. I must say that this department has limited capacity. Data can't be generated every year because of the weather. The people at Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada also have to create a file and send it to us for review. Given that we have limited resources, we sometimes work with the provinces to find out what the priority is for the group of products we have. Sometimes it can take time. It really depends on the active ingredient.

I think I know which product you're talking about. Is it the one for beets?

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Could be.

You say that you work with the provinces. People in the industry confirm that, for some products, you clearly work with the provinces. I think this co-operation is necessary, particularly with the Government of Quebec—you can guess where I'm from. However, I'm told that, in some cases, the Government of Quebec and its scientists are in favour of registration, but that you haven't taken that information into account. In your opening remarks, you talked about flexibility and openness to new information, and even the possibility of starting to work with other authorities. I think it's a good idea, but it will depend on the authorities you choose, obviously. Quality must be maintained.

I didn't specify this when I started talking, but I'd like to clarify something: I'm not a scientist. If I say anything inaccurate, please feel free to correct me. I would like to remind you of something about the Quebec scientists who are presenting you with information: In Quebec, we are usually more rather than less demanding in terms of the environment. In any case, that's what our farmers will tell you.

I don't understand that aspect. What is your response to that?

[Frédéric Bissonnette]

Thank you for the question.

I can assure you that, when the Government of Quebec or any other government sends us information, we take it into account. In the case that I think you're referring to, there was some disagreement about the process. The disagreement was not about the data; it was about the process. Under the emergency registration program, we already have products registered for the crop in question. That is always our priority, because we have existing risk analyses.

Sometimes provinces select products on the recommendation of producers, but we don't have risk analyses for those products. When we have to make a decision quickly to solve an urgent problem, our preference is always to choose existing products. We prefer to choose products for which there is a risk analysis for the crop.

[Yves Perron, Bloc, Berthier—Maskinongé, QC]

Okay.

I take it that it doesn't necessarily mean that the other product isn't good, but that an analysis would have to be done. I'm somewhat reassured. I was afraid that, once again, the provinces had to sit and listen to the federal government that knows everything. That's not the case. I'm reassured.

However, is there a way to do these analyses quickly? Is there a way to speed things up? I'm thinking, for example, of drones for spraying. If the products are registered to be sprayed from an airplane, then why not by drone? Why does it take time? It seems to me that there would be a lot less of it in the environment, that it would be much more localized. That would make sense to me as a non-scientist.

I have limited time. You won't have much time left to answer my questions.

[Frédéric Bissonnette]

Thank you for the question.

There were scientific issues with drones at the outset. A drone with eight rotors may not behave in the same way as an airplane. Canada is not the only country to have raised the issue, but things are moving forward quite quickly. I'm pushing my team to have something in place for next year.

As for interactions with the government, you may be pleased to know that we, along with Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada and the Canadian Food Inspection Agency, are organizing a discussion group with Quebec fruit and vegetable producers, for example. We will be able to discuss their problems and find solutions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Michael Coteau]

Thank you very much.

We're going to the second round. We'll have MP Bonk start for five minutes.

Oh, I'm sorry, Monsieur Gourde. Please go ahead.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[Technical difficulty—Editor] registration of a new product, does the industry apply for it, or do you choose what would be, let's say, advantageous for Canada and for producers?

[Frédéric Bissonnette]

Thank you for the question.

Generally speaking, the industry makes the application. There are special programs, such as the minor use one, that people may apply for. However, industry always has a say, because these are their products.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

When you do a study on a product, do you wait until it has already been registered abroad, or can you do it simultaneously with the other country? For example, if a registration application is submitted in the United States, is Canada able to participate in the study at the same time? That way, when the product is registered in the United States, Canada won't have to wait at least 10 years for the same product. It's about efficiency.

[Frédéric Bissonnette]

Thank you for the question.

For a new active ingredient, we work as far as possible with the U.S. agency. We are also trying to work with Australia because it is also facing some challenges and wants to work with us. We work together where we can, especially when it's a new product. Of course, when a product already exists, we look at what has already been done and determine whether it applies to current conditions in Canada, including environmental ones. It's always something we look at.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Are there examples of products that have been registered in other countries but not in Canada?

[Frédéric Bissonnette]

That is certainly the case, because the companies' priorities are not always the same, but Canada usually receives products at the same time as the United States.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

If there is a list of products that have never been registered in Canada, could you provide it to us?

I would now like to come back to the subject of artificial intelligence, since I have a few concerns.

Mr. Jones, going forward, do you think artificial intelligence will make your department more efficient and help it provide services to producers more quickly?

[Matt Jones]

Thank you for the question.

AI is a key part of our efforts to make the process more efficient. We are now working with a new program, a new tool, to expedite the work of the Pest Management Regulatory Agency.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Is this new program Canadian or American in origin? Is the general public aware of it?

[Matt Jones]

I can't say whether it's of Canadian or American origin, but I can find that information and send it to you. This is a new program designed specifically for the agency. We use the information currently available to make the tool more effective and ensure that the work is of high enough quality.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Thank you.

Mr. Jurgutis, you talked about the improvement and flexibility of agricultural loans. What program were you referring to? Was that in relation to Farm Credit Canada? Are those loans from the department? It's not clear to me.