Bill C-2 (39th Parliament, 1st Session) Committee on June 13th, 2006

[Benoît Sauvageau, Bloc, Repentigny, QC]

I'm going back to Bill C-2 in a constructive way. I'm introducing amendment BQ-29, which appears on page 141 and is intended to amend clause 174.

I would humbly like to recall that this is a great victory for the Bloc. My friend and colleague Michel Guimond, the member for Montmorency—Charlevoix—Haute-Côte-Nord, previously introduced a similar bill. We've been requesting it for a long time.

However, we're pleased to note that the Chief Electoral Officer will be able to appoint returning officers in each of the ridings. However, I believe I heard Mr. Kingsley say that he did not disagree with an interpretation more consistent with the Quebec act, that is to say that he would make it so the Chief Electoral Officer would appoint returning officers in the ridings following public competitions.

The purpose of this amendment is to clarify the point that these would not be direct appointments, because there would be public competitions. People would therefore have to meet certain criteria in order to be put on the Chief Electoral Officer's selection list.

The Quebec act already contains this kind of obligation. In case of an emergency, for example, where there is a minority government, an early election or whatever, the Chief Electoral Officer would have some flexibility. However, in a normal situation, there would be public competitions to select returning officers.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. Owen.

[Stephen Owen, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

I'm sorry, I don't have the Public Service Employment Act in front of me. I wonder if Mr. Wild could give us an explanation of what that says, and how it would be applied in this case.

[Marc Chénier, Counsel, Democratic Renewal Secretariat, Privy Council Office]

Mr. Chair, the external appointment process in the Public Service Employment Act is defined as a process for making one or more appointments in which persons may be considered whether or not they're employed in the public service. It's unclear to me at this point how the proposed amendment would provide for open competitions. The way I read the amendment, it would just require a process where people outside the public service are considered, if we apply the definition that's found in the Public Service Employment Act.

It may be useful to the committee for me to go through what Bill C-2 provides right now. Bill C-2 provides that the Chief Electoral Officer has to develop a process to determine merit, and that he has to submit this process to the House of Commons. During the Chief Electoral Officer's appearance before the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs last fall on Bill C-312, it was proposed to implement an independent process for the appointment of returning officers. The Chief Electoral Officer indicated that he would provide for processes where an eligibility list can be used. So where there is a competition to fill a vacancy, he would be allowed to set up an eligibility list. And if there's a further vacancy, he can just pick a name from that list without having the need to open a new competition.

Another thing he mentioned he would use is the reappointment of returning officers who have satisfactory past performance. So when returning officers have proved they are able to meet the merit requirements through their performance on election day, he would reappoint them to any vacancy.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. Owen.

[Stephen Owen, Liberal, Vancouver Quadra, BC]

From the first part of Mr. Chénier's answer--and maybe I can confirm this in my own mind--I take it that the Public Service Employment Act would not be appropriate for appointing people to non-public-service jobs. Is that what I heard you say?

[Marc Chénier]

Mr. Wild can correct me if I'm wrong, but the effect of the amendment, in my mind, would not apply the concepts of the Public Service Employment Act to the appointment process for returning officers. It would mean the definition of external appointment process as found in the act would apply to this process. It's defined as an appointment process whereby people outside the public service can apply.

[Joe Wild, Senior Counsel, Legal Services, Treasury Board Portfolio, Department of Justice]

I think Mr. O'Sullivan may actually have something from the Privy Council Office that may assist in the discussion.

[Marc O'Sullivan, Acting Assistant Secretary to the Cabinet, As an Individual]

Thank you.

I would support what Monsieur Chénier has described. It's an accurate description. The proposed amendment makes reference to the definition clause under the Public Service Employment Act, so it's simply limited to indicating that it's a process for people who are outside the public service. I don't see how that simple reference to that definition clause would incorporate by reference, for example, all the procedural requirements of the Public Service Employment Act. So the effect of this amendment would be to indicate that returning officers are hired in a process for which people outside of the Public Service of Canada are eligible.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Ms. Jennings.

[Marlene Jennings, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

I have a question. Possibly one of you technical experts can answer this. Is the Chief Electoral Officer subject to audits by the Public Service Commission? I know the Public Service Commission does audits of the appointment, hiring, selection--you name it--process of, for instance, the Auditor General. So I would assume so, but I would like to know if my assumption is based on fact. Because in that case, I would have less of a problem with the Bloc amendment, because I would be assured there would be an external independent audit of whatever process the Chief Electoral Officer put into place for this external appointment process.

[Marc O'Sullivan]

The Public Service Commission has authority over the hiring of public servants, so the Elections Canada employees of the Office of the Chief Electoral Officer are public servants, and would be covered by the Public Service Commission—but not returning officers.

[Marlene Jennings, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

So should this amendment go forth, and the Chief Electoral Officer has the authority to appoint returning officers, which he wants the authority to appoint for a term of ten years, there would be no outside or independent scrutiny of the process the Chief Electoral Officer puts into place to actually recruit officers, or of the selection process put into place to actually deem the applicants qualified or not qualified, or of the ranking they receive. So there's nothing in this amendment that would provide for that kind of external, independent oversight.

[Joe Wild]

Sorry, there is an element of oversight on the reappointment, where the Chief Electoral Officer is required to consult with the leader of every recognized political party in the House of Commons in order to reappoint, for another term, any returning officer whose term expires.

[Marlene Jennings, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

But not for the appointment.

[Marc O'Sullivan]

The Chief Electoral Officer, under the act, would have to report to the Speaker of the House on the proposed process for establishing qualifications and the selection process for returning officers, so the Chief Electoral Officer is accountable to Parliament for how he or she goes about establishing qualifications and determining the selection process for returning officers.

So parliamentarians will have that opportunity, and as part of the overall scrutiny of the actions of the Chief Electoral Officer, they will also be able to verify that he or she has in place a rigorous process for establishing qualifications and for a selection process, while at the same time allowing for the vagaries of appointing people from all across the country in ridings all across the country. There may be instances in far-flung ridings when the selection process will be slightly different from what it is in an urban centre, for example.

[Marlene Jennings, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

Thank you.

(Amendment agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

(On clause 176)

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

We're going to the amendments on clause 176.

Government amendment G-44. Mr. Poilievre.

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Nepean—Carleton, ON]

Government amendment G-44 refers to clause 176, which it amends on lines 37 through 39 on page 121. It would change the wording to read, “or if both their offices are vacant during an election period”, so that what we're adding is “during an election period”. The proposed section continues that the election officer “shall designate a person to act in place of the returning officer”, whereupon we add a further amendment, “and that person may, during and after that period, perform the duties of a returning officer in relation to that election”.

I think it's fairly clear what we're getting at here, but if the expert panel would like to add some commentary, I would welcome it.

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Mr. Chénier.

[Marc Chénier]

This provision is meant to offer the possibility for the Chief Electoral Officer to bypass the requirement to apply a merit-based process to make an appointment, specifically during an election period if there is no returning officer or assistant returning officer, because under the Canada Elections Act there are specific tasks that must be performed by the returning officer. And if there is no returning officer and there is no time to go through a merit-based process, then there is no way for the election to be carried out in the electoral district.

As we know, there can be an election at any time, either a byelection or a general election, and if there is a current vacancy when an election writ is issued, then the election would not be able to happen in the electoral riding.

The words that are being added to this section just specify that this power to appoint somebody without the need to apply a merit-based process is only for the purposes of an election and is for the tasks that must be performed in relation to that election.

(Amendment agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

We're now going to G-45, which is on page 144. This is an amendment to clause 177.

Mr. Poilievre, could you move that, please?

[Pierre Poilievre, Conservative, Nepean—Carleton, ON]

I so move.

I gather that the committee is fairly comfortable to go ahead.

(Amendment agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

Now we go back to clause 173 for the vote.

(Clause 173 agreed to)

(Clauses 174 to 178 inclusive agreed to)

[The Chair, Conservative, David Tilson]

We'll move to clause 179.1. This is on page 144.2. This is government amendment G-45.1, which is consequential to clause 179.2. They go together.