Evidence of meeting #10 for Canada-China Relations in the 43rd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was wong.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Davin Wong  Director, Youth Engagement and Policy Initiatives, Alliance Canada Hong Kong
Cherie Wong  Executive Director, Alliance Canada Hong Kong
Gloria Fung  President and Coordinator of a cross-Canada platform for 16 organizations concerned about Hong Kong , Canada-Hong Kong Link
Aileen Calverley  Co-founder and Trustee, Hong Kong Watch
Alex Neve  Secretary General, Amnesty International Canada
Akram Keram  Program Officer for China, National Endowment for Democracy
Sophie Richardson  China Director, Human Rights Watch

12:25 p.m.

NDP

Jack Harris NDP St. John's East, NL

Thank you, Chair.

I too have two questions for Ms. Calverley.

First of all, other than China, Britain is the only signatory to the treaty for the 1997 changeover. What special right does the U.K. have to enforce that treaty that Canada doesn't have or other countries don't have, and why is it not taking a stronger lead in dealing with this? I know there's the British overseas passport, which is a special circumstance.

The second question has to do with other nations. I know 27 countries joined in a statement to the United Nations Human Rights Council. Does your organization, Hong Kong Watch, have organizations in many of these other countries as well, or are you focused on the U.K., and in this case, Canada?

12:25 p.m.

Co-founder and Trustee, Hong Kong Watch

Aileen Calverley

We are international, so we are involved in the U.S., Canada, the European Union and of course the U.K. We are the secretary of the European all-party parliamentary group.

I want to answer your question on the UN. Actually, our colleague who will testify on Thursday will tell you more about the United Nations. We initiated that with Lord Chris Patten, our patron. We really hope there will be a UN special envoy or rapporteur in Hong Kong to monitor the situation. I think that's very important. We need to have Canada and many other like-minded countries join forces to have that happen, so that's—

12:25 p.m.

NDP

Jack Harris NDP St. John's East, NL

Can you answer about the role of the U.K. as the only signatory to this treaty? Do they have any special rights to enforce this that Canada does not have, and are they prepared to use them?

12:25 p.m.

Co-founder and Trustee, Hong Kong Watch

Aileen Calverley

I think under the Sino-British Joint Declaration there was no remedy, so that's what they're talking about when they talk about a breach of the joint declaration. Right now the remedy is to offer British national overseas residents the chance to move to the U.K. We're talking about 2.9 million Hong Kongers who will be eligible to move to the U.K. I think another action the U.K. will do is a sanction action. That will be what the U.K. will do.

12:25 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Geoff Regan

Thank you very much, Mr. Harris.

That concludes our first panel for today. I want to echo the comments made previously. I don't think any of my colleagues who spoke didn't thank all of the witnesses and admire your appearance here today. We very much appreciate you coming before us.

We'll now have to suspend for five minutes while we get set for our next panel. Thank you again.

12:35 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Geoff Regan

I call the meeting back to order.

Welcome back. I would like to make a few comments for the benefit of the new witnesses.

Before speaking, please wait until I recognize you by name. When you are ready to speak, you can click on the microphone icon to activate your mike. Having said that, during the question and answer period I think you'll find that the member who is asking a question will indicate who they would like to answer. You can go ahead and answer without waiting for me, until we get to the end of their time.

This is a reminder that all comments should be addressed through the chair. Interpretation in this video conference will work very much the way it does in a regular committee meeting. You have the choice, at the bottom of your screen, of the floor in either English or French. As you are speaking, if you plan to alternate from one language to the other, you will also need to switch the interpretation channel so that it aligns with the language you are speaking. You may want to allow for a short pause while switching languages. When you are not speaking, your mike should be on mute, please. The use of headsets is strongly encouraged.

It's now my pleasure to welcome our second panel of witnesses. From Amnesty International Canada, we have Alex Neve, secretary-general; from the National Endowment for Democracy, we have Akram Keram, program officer for China; and from Human Rights Watch, we have Sophie Richardson, China director.

Each witness will have up to 10 minutes to make an opening statement, followed by a round of questions from the members. We'll have at least two rounds, I hope.

Mr. Neve, we'll begin with you. You have 10 minutes, sir.

12:35 p.m.

Alex Neve Secretary General, Amnesty International Canada

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

It's certainly a pleasure to be with the special committee this afternoon or this morning, for any of you who are out west, and to join with my two wonderful colleagues.

There have obviously been many troubling chapters along the road that have brought Hong Kongers to the terrifying reality they face today, which is a rapidly deteriorating human rights crisis that needs decisive and concerted international action. There was the umbrella movement six years ago, and then the courageous protests responding to extradition reform last year, and now the national security law, which Amnesty International has described as follows:

...Beijing's most breathtaking, threatening and callous attack yet...the greatest threat to human rights in the city's recent history.... The aim of Chinese authorities is to govern Hong Kong through fear from this point forward.

These are, of course, not abstract predictions, given the backdrop of China's long-standing and, frankly, atrocious human rights record, very much in the spotlight currently with the massive, harrowing campaign against Uighurs and other Muslim minorities, arrests and unfair trials of human rights lawyers and advocates, ongoing abuses against Tibetans, the crackdown against Falun Gong—now into its 21st year—and, closer to home, eight Canadian prisoners in China of concern to Amnesty International. They include four Canadians who have been sentenced to death; two Canadians, Michael Kovrig and Michael Spavor, who have been arbitrarily and unlawfully arrested and detained; and two other Canadians, Huseyin Celil and Sun Qian, who are serving lengthy prison terms after deeply unfair trials.

With all of that in mind, we have pointed to 10 chilling reasons to be concerned about Hong Kong's national security law.

First, endangering national security can and does mean virtually anything. Secession, subversion, terrorism and collusion with foreign forces incur maximum penalties of life imprisonment and are so broadly defined that they can easily become catch-all offences.

Second, the law has been abused from day one. People have been arrested for possessing flags, stickers and banners with political slogans. Police and officials have claimed that slogans, T-shirts, songs, and even holding up pieces of white paper endanger national security. The Hong Kong government has declared that “Liberate Hong Kong, revolution of our times”, a common political slogan during last year’s protests, connotes Hong Kong independence and is forbidden.

Third, the law is all-pervasive, including tightened controls over education, journalism and social media.

Fourth, people could be taken to mainland China for unfair trials, which is precisely what was at stake in last year’s massive protests against extradition reform.

Fifth, the law applies to everyone on the planet—literally everyone, everywhere.

Sixth, investigating authorities have new and extensive powers, including the power to search properties, restrict or prohibit travel, freeze or confiscate assets, censor online content and engage in covert surveillance, including intercepting communications. All are without a court order.

Seventh, the Chinese central government is setting up an Office for Safeguarding National Security in the heart of Hong Kong. The office and its staff do not fall under Hong Kong’s jurisdiction.

Eighth, the Hong Kong government has set up a new body, the Committee for Safeguarding National Security, including an adviser from the Chinese central government. Its decisions are not subject to court review.

Ninth, human rights protections risk being overridden. The national security law includes a general guarantee to respect human rights but grants immunities and vast exemptions to national security institutions, and it explicitly has precedence over any other laws.

Tenth, the law has already had an immediate, chilling effect. Hong Kongers have shut down their social media accounts, shops and restaurants have removed banners and stickers in support of the protest movement, and public libraries have sorted out books on sensitive issues and those authored by activists critical of the government.

There is little doubt that those grave concerns have indeed been proven out. Current Amnesty International press releases and urgent actions make that abundantly clear. The press releases state that four activists, three male and one female, aged 16 to 21, were arrested two weeks ago under the security law and accused of advocating Hong Kong Kong independence. As well, 12 pro-democracy candidates, including Joshua Wong, were disqualified from running in Hong Kong’s now-delayed Legislative Council elections. Among other grounds offered to justify this is that objecting to the recently enacted national security law demonstrates that they could not genuinely uphold their constitutional duty as lawmakers.

Most recent, of course, was yesterday's national security arrest of well-known democracy activist Agnes Chow, accused of inciting secession, and prominent publisher Jimmy Lai, two of his sons, and staff of his newspaper, the Apple Daily, for “colluding with foreign powers”.

Faced with this mounting crisis, here are five quick suggestions as to where Canada should focus its efforts.

First, multilateralism is key, and the wider and more diverse the coalition of states prepared to speak out about concerns, the more effective. Canada has done so on a number of occasions over the past year with respect to the crisis in Hong Kong and other concerns in China, including endorsing a joint oral statement from 28 governments at the UN Human Rights Council on June 30, and Minister Champagne joining counterparts from Australia, New Zealand, the United Kingdom and the United States in a statement of concern about Hong Kong two days ago. Broadening the group of states prepared to exert public pressure on China should be a strong focus for Canada.

Second, staying with multilateralism, Canada should actively pursue action within the UN human rights system. A public statement issued on June 26 by 50 UN independent human rights experts lays out a range of options, for instance, for moves that could be attempted at the UN Human Rights Council, the next session of which gets under way on September 14.

Third, Canada is well placed to lead international readiness for the prospect that many Hong Kongers may be forced to flee as refugees. The geography of Hong Kong is such that, unlike many refugee situations around the world, they clearly cannot escape across the most immediate border, that being China. People needing to flee will be in many different situations, including individuals with citizenship in other countries, such as over 300,000 Canadians residing in Hong Kong; individuals who are not citizens but have close family and other links to Canada or other countries; and those who have no strong connection with any other countries. Canada should be working to prepare arrangements to receive, potentially, a large number of Canadians who may be forced to leave Hong Kong suddenly, and should also be collaborating with other governments to prepare a well-coordinated response to wider refugee needs.

Fourth, Canada should be looking at options under Canadian law and policy to exert greater pressure directly. Human rights concerns in general, as well as with respect to Hong Kong, should be prioritized in all dealings with China, not just between diplomats but across all bilateral exchanges, including trade and investment. Extradition arrangements with Hong Kong have been suspended, and the transfer of sensitive security equipment has been tightened up. The government has been pressed by a sizable group of MPs and senators to consider sanctions under the Justice for Victims of Corrupt Foreign Officials Act. In considering any and all further steps, it's advisable to prioritize measures that can be advanced multilaterally, in concert with other governments.

Finally, let me bring this very close to home. Amnesty International is part of the Canadian Coalition on Human Rights in China, made up of 15 organizations here in Canada. On behalf of the coalition, we have prepared two reports over the past three years that document a disturbing and intensifying pattern of intimidation, interference and threats against human rights defenders who are based here and are involved in campaigning with respect to human rights concerns in China. The individuals responsible for these abuses are linked to, or at least encouraged and lauded by, Chinese government officials. Our most recent report, provided to the Canadian government in March of this year and released publicly in May, notes that over the past year, individuals supportive of the movement for democracy and human rights in Hong Kong in particular have been targeted relentlessly, including at demonstrations and through social media.

In 2017 and again this year, the coalition made numerous recommendations to the Canadian government for more effective action to protect human rights defenders in this country from these abuses, focusing on the need for more coordination among police, security, and government agencies and departments. To our considerable disappointment, we have had little response. Individuals experiencing these instances of interference and threats, including threats of sexual and other physical violence and threats against family members in Hong Kong or China, are largely left without effective recourse, often unsure where to turn and what to expect.

It may be a considerable challenge to counter China's influence on the world stage and it may be difficult to exert pressure for human rights reform on the ground in China, but there is no excuse for a failure to take robust and decisive steps to counter human rights abuses that may be linked to or backed by Beijing, that are connected to what is happening in Hong Kong and that take place here in Canada.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

12:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Geoff Regan

Thank you very much, Mr. Neve.

We'll now go on to Mr. Keram for 10 minutes. Please go ahead.

12:45 p.m.

Akram Keram Program Officer for China, National Endowment for Democracy

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

It's an honour to be offering testimony before this body today with other distinguished guests, including my friend Sophie.

I have been invited to offer remarks on behalf of Mr. Carl Gershman, president of the National Endowment for Democracy, one of 11 Americans officially sanctioned by the Chinese government just yesterday for their support of pro-democracy activism in Hong Kong.

Hong Kong is an international cosmopolitan city and global financial centre that is praised for its cultural diversity and inclusiveness, freedom of expression and robust rule of law. For the past 17 months it has captured the attention of the world as millions of ordinary Hong Kongers took to the streets to protest a controversial extradition bill, which, over time, became a protest movement about the basic rights and freedoms of the Hong Kong people. Sadly, the just and legal demands of Hong Kongers have been met with local officials' indifference, suppression, arrests and breathtaking police brutality, all directly backed by the central government in Beijing. Since June 2019, Hong Kong police have made around 9,000 arrests related to the protest movement. Among them are over 700 children under the age of 18, including eight elementary school students.

Despite international outcry and criticism, things have only continued to get worse for the people of Hong Kong. On June 30, in nearly complete secrecy and with no regard for internationally recognized legal obligations to the city of Hong Kong, the Chinese Communist Party forced through a new law of the People's Republic of China on safeguarding national security in Hong Kong's special administrative region. Hereafter I'm going to refer to it as the NSL.

Already the NSL has brought about one of the darkest moments in Hong Kong's history by attacking Hong Kongers' fundamental rights and freedoms. The NSL has carved out unprecedented space for CCP leadership to deliver and systematically impose its rule in Hong Kong. They have wasted no time in using it to arrest activists in the street, disqualify pro-democracy politicians, dismiss tenured academics, and just yesterday challenge the voice of critical media outlets.

In spite of these heavy-handed and often violent actions, Hong Kong citizens have not simply or quietly given up their rights. Last November, amid a record turnout, pro-democracy candidates won in 17 out of 18 district elections. Since then, Hong Kongers have turned to the international community to take action, actuating their international networks, including those here in Canada, to encourage governments around the world to take a stand, whether by cancelling extradition agreements with Hong Kong or by calling on the United Nations to launch an investigation. Just last month, over 600,000 citizens once again took to the polls to support pro-democracy candidates in the Legislative Council election primaries. Then, in a shocking display of disregard for the legally guaranteed rights of Hong Kongers, and demonstrating the extent of Beijing's fears, the chief executive, Carrie Lam, announced that the Legislative Council elections would be delayed for a full year.

It is crucial that the governments around the world recognize that the CCP's actions stand in absolute conflict with the existing local and international laws and norms. The NSL directly contradicts parts of Hong Kong's basic law and the Bill of Rights Ordinance. Furthermore, the provisions of the NSL also conflict with China's obligations under international law, such as the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights and the Sino-British Joint Declaration. The NSL also takes the unprecedented step of asserting jurisdiction over citizens of other countries. Therefore, it is not just Hong Kong's legal institutions that are under attack; Beijing has also challenged the international legal system with its authoritarian overreach.

There is much that the international community can do in response. First and foremost, it can take steps to protect Hong Kongers who are seeking to resettle themselves and their families. Since May, thousands of Hong Kongers have applied for foreign immigration documents, seeking safety and protection in third countries, including Canada. This includes a large number of students and young activists who are alarmed at the Hong Kong government's effort to impose so-called “patriotic education” and other nationalistic initiatives that challenge Hong Kong's academic freedom and cultural and political diversity.

After the arrest of Jimmy Lai just days ago, Hong Kongers are also rightly concerned that the CCP will begin rolling out the censorship and surveillance machines it has perfected in East Turkestan, which the CCP refers to as the Xinjiang Uighur Autonomous Region.

It is incumbent upon international communities to consider other measures that might be undertaken to protect the future of democracy, freedom and the rule of law in Hong Kong. Without such support, as the events over the last few days have shown, the shadow of authoritarian rule will continue to grow in ways that are all too familiar to those who have already suffered the CCP's coercion and repression, like us from the Uighur community.

Here at the National Endowment for Democracy, we believe in the rights of all people to freely determine their government, one that ensures freedom of expression, belief, and association; respects the fundamental rights of individuals and minorities; promotes a free press; and supports meaningful access to justice. We also believe that the actions of the Chinese government speak for themselves, whether in its denial of basic rights and freedoms for its people or its abuse of authority to breach legal commitments in Hong Kong.

We urge the Canadian government to stand with other nations to condemn the CCP's abrogation of the rights of Hong Kongers and violations of the integrity of international legal order.

Thank you.

12:50 p.m.

Secretary General, Amnesty International Canada

Alex Neve

Mr. Chair—

12:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Geoff Regan

I'm sorry. I failed to unmute. That often happens with folks here. It's not usually the chair, but I apologize for that.

While you couldn't hear me, I was thanking Mr. Keram for his testimony and also for holding up the microphone so that we could all hear him.

We'll now go to Ms. Richardson for up to 10 minutes.

Please proceed.

12:55 p.m.

Sophie Richardson China Director, Human Rights Watch

Thank you, Mr. Chair and members of the committee. I know that you're taking on very important work in studying the Canada-China relationship, and I'm honoured to be here to speak with this committee today.

I've overseen all of Human Rights Watch's work on China since joining the organization in 2006. Throughout that period, we've enjoyed a strong collaboration with Canadian officials in Beijing, Hong Kong and Ottawa. I only wish that there had been progressively less to talk about, but unfortunately the opposite is true. Now we grapple with human rights violations of an unprecedented scope and scale, not only inside the mainland, such as those ongoing against Uighurs and Tibetans, but increasingly outside the country, including Beijing's efforts to undermine the very international institutions we all rely on to protect human rights around the world. Indeed, the Chinese government has generated threats to human rights in Canada.

We're here today to discuss Beijing's unprecedented assault on the human rights of seven million Hong Kong people. The Chinese authority's decision to impose so-called national security legislation on Hong Kong violates the basic law of the territory's functional constitution and violates the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights, which China has signed but not ratified, and to which Hong Kong is a party.

From one minute to the next, on June 30 the Hong Kong people were robbed of their rights to peaceful assembly, expression and political participation, and of the promise of having one country and two systems until at least 2047. The national security law's vague and overbroad provisions are devastating to human rights, not least through creating specialized secret security agencies, denying fair trial rights and periodic elections, providing sweeping new powers to the police, increasing restraints on civil society and the media and weakening judicial oversight.

In Human Rights Watch's view, this is a law that has nothing to do with security. It is a road map for repression. The developments of just the past 24 hours, with the arrest of Apple Daily owner Jimmy Lai and pro-democracy activists, including Agnes Chow, under the NSL, make that reality starkly clear.

We thank Canada for its public concerns about the NSL, its efforts to coordinate that view with like-minded governments and its swift suspension of the extradition treaty with Hong Kong. We also want to thank Canada for its efforts at the Human Rights Council in calling on Chinese authorities to end violations against human rights defenders and ethnic and religious minorities, among other issues.

However, the very existence of the national security law shows that many governments' efforts are unfortunately not enough. It is not only imperative to call out Beijing's violations, but also critically and urgently important to put an end to the extraordinary sense of impunity Beijing continues to enjoy for state-sponsored human rights violations.

To that end, we urge Canada, first and foremost, to publicly and unequivocally state that Canada will not co-operate with or enable the NSL's extraterritorial application or co-operate with Hong Kong police requests for information concerning those accused of national security crimes. Canada should swiftly adopt mechanisms to enable people from Hong Kong to find safe haven in Canada and should ensure that Hong Kong activists who relocated to Canada can continue their activism safely and without harassment from the Chinese government, including by any overseas United Front initiatives.

Canada can urgently augment the capabilities of its consulate in Hong Kong to monitor human rights violations and the impact of the NSL, and it can increase support for human rights groups, independent local media and Internet freedom.

Canada can also impose targeted sanctions on the Chinese and Hong Kong officials involved in drafting, adopting and implementing the law, who thereby violated core human rights as laid down in international law. It can ensure Internet service providers refuse to co-operate with Hong Kong police force requests on providing, removing or limiting online expressions of political views, and it can ensure companies limit export to the Hong Kong police force of equipment or technology and technical support that can be used for intercepting personal communication or conducting surveillance.

Canada can also engage chambers of commerce and other industry associations to reaffirm support for the respect of human rights, the rule of law and civic participation, and communicate publicly the social, financial and operational risks presented by the law.

I want to particularly stress two last recommendations.

As Alex mentioned earlier, one is support for the late-June call by 50 United Nations human rights experts to hold a special session on China at the Human Rights Council and establish a new monitoring mechanism on China. These are the kinds of steps that will help puncture the expectation of impunity on Beijing's part.

I would also like to urge the government to think about creating a cabinet-level position to coordinate, develop and implement China policy. This is no longer an issue that fits solely and neatly in the traditional bailiwicks of foreign affairs or trade. Increasingly, we see threats to academic freedom. We see to the diaspora community. We see concerns across immigration matters. These are not terribly well integrated. This is not a recommendation we would only make to the Government of Canada, but I think this is a particular moment at which the creation of such a position would resonate, both in Beijing and in Hong Kong, but also for citizens across Canada.

We are aware that Chinese authorities place pressure on other governments and businesses to stay silent about human rights violations such as those posed by the NSL, but the importance of ensuring respect for the human rights of seven million Hong Kong people is undeniable. Violations of rights on this scale and severity require steadfastness and perseverance. By actively taking steps to help the Hong Kong people and to raise the price on rights-violating officials in Beijing and Hong Kong, Canada can help mitigate repression both now and in the future. We urge you to do so in coordination with like-minded governments to create more leverage.

We thank you for this opportunity to speak with you, and I welcome any questions you may have.

1 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Geoff Regan

Thank you very much, Ms. Richardson.

Thanks to all the witnesses for staying within your time for your statements.

We'll now begin the first round of questions with Mr. Chiu for six minutes.

August 11th, 2020 / 1 p.m.

Conservative

Kenny Chiu Conservative Steveston—Richmond East, BC

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to all the witnesses for coming to the committee to speak about the issue of Hong Kong and China in relation to Canada.

As a newly elected MP, I was invited to go to Hong Kong on a district council election observer mission in November 2019, and we produced a report that had some positive feedback for the Hong Kong government. We were pleased to witness the exercising of democracy. In that district election, the people in Hong Kong came out profoundly and decisively on the side of democracy. As somebody who was born in Hong Kong and grew up in Canada, it is quite satisfying for me to see democracy in practice.

Fast-forward to 2020, where we are today, and we see that all sectors in Hong Kong are under the dark shadow of fear, including the press. Through Apple Daily, for example, freedom of speech was jeopardized. The Foreign Correspondents' Club issued a very critical statement against the NSL and the arrest of Mr. Jimmy Lai. People could be arrested for singing certain songs or yelling particular slogans, so freedom of expression is also jeopardized. Their association with freedom of expression is also being harmed. They willy-nilly disqualify political leaders and even legislators, based on their opinions.

There is definitely a dark shadow of fear being cast over Hong Kong. However, in Canada, and also in the rest of the world, I would argue there is also an opaque white fear that is being cast. We see that the Hong Kong NSL has also charged U.S. citizen Samuel Chu, who has been overseas for 25 years. He is one of their accused. I have constituents in my riding who presented a petition advocating that the Government of Canada exercise the Magnitsky act in sanctioning China or Hong Kong. He would be under the same cloud as well.

What would you suggest Canadian governments do to safeguard Canadians' safety, regardless of their ethnicity? We know that in 2006 Uighur Canadian Huseyin Celil was arrested in Uzbekistan, but extradited to China. We also have the two Michaels who are being arbitrarily held. What would you suggest Canada do to effectively warn Canadian citizens?

I've just checked the travel warnings on the Government of Canada travel website, and it's warning Canadians to exercise a high degree of caution. How do we know they would not get arrested? How do we know, en route, they would not get arbitrarily extradited to China?

Ms. Richardson, Mr. Neve and Mr. Keram, please respond.

1:05 p.m.

China Director, Human Rights Watch

Sophie Richardson

Mr. Chiu, thanks so much. It's a big question with a lot of different moving parts to it.

At its core, the question is about how to protect Canadians' rights. That's my understanding of your question.

Obviously we've made some suggestions about how to deal with the NSL and issues related to extradition and extraterritoriality. I want to underscore quickly that we're equally concerned about, for example, the confidence that people who have immigrated to Canada from the mainland or from Hong Kong have in their ability to articulate their views, if those are critical of Chinese state actors, and that they will not result in reprisals to them or to family members in China.

I realize there is not necessarily much you can do about the family members in China, but I think reassuring people that the Canadian government encourages that kind of civic activism and will speak up to protect it is critical. I think that's a political question and it's also about law enforcement.

1:05 p.m.

Conservative

Kenny Chiu Conservative Steveston—Richmond East, BC

Thank you.

1:05 p.m.

China Director, Human Rights Watch

Sophie Richardson

A second area I would look at, which we've written about, is Chinese government threats to academic freedom. I think Canadian universities are not doing enough to ensure that all the people on their campuses, whether they are Canadians of whatever descent, whether they come from the mainland or from Hong Kong or Taiwan, all have equal access to academic freedom on their campuses.

There have been examples in the last few years when schools have not stood up to defend that space when it's been threatened.

1:05 p.m.

Conservative

Kenny Chiu Conservative Steveston—Richmond East, BC

Thank you, Ms. Richardson.

Mr. Neve.

1:05 p.m.

Secretary General, Amnesty International Canada

Alex Neve

Thank you very much, Mr. Chiu, for the question. It's very important and I think there seems to be two elements to it.

One is the mounting risks Canadians are facing here in Canada. I would reiterate the comments I made about the report that, on behalf of the Canadian Coalition on Human Rights in China, we have submitted to the government. I believe you are familiar with it. I can certainly provide you with a copy again, because there are a number of not just broadly aspirational but very concrete recommendations for creating hotlines for more coherence across government agencies to respond to what is a deeply troubling and mounting threat. Really, we've seen very little movement at all for many years as that has gotten worse.

With respect to the concerns—

1:05 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Geoff Regan

Mr. Neve, I'm sorry to interrupt but we're over Mr. Chiu's time, so thank you. Hopefully we'll all—

1:05 p.m.

Conservative

Kenny Chiu Conservative Steveston—Richmond East, BC

Mr. Chair.

1:05 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Geoff Regan

Mr. Chiu, your time has expired.

1:05 p.m.

Conservative

Kenny Chiu Conservative Steveston—Richmond East, BC

I understand.

With your indulgence, may I ask the witness, Mr. Neve, to provide the report to the committee?

1:05 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Geoff Regan

Thank you very much.

We'll now go on to Mr. Fragiskatos for six minutes.

1:05 p.m.

Liberal

Peter Fragiskatos Liberal London North Centre, ON

Thank you to the witnesses for their testimony.

Ms. Richardson, in the previous testimony that we heard at committee today I questioned whether or not there is the prospect of what is transpiring vis-à-vis the Chinese state and the Uighur minority also happening in Hong Kong. The witnesses talked about what's happening today as certainly holding a future possibility in terms of what Hong Kongers could face.

Is it a matter of the Uighurs today and Hong Kong tomorrow, as they put it?