From a CSIS point of view, The CSIS Act speaks to foreign influence as a threat, but colloquially, this is what most people consider foreign interference. That is using covert and coercive means when trying to accomplish an objective.
When we have those characteristics, of a coercive and covert approach, CSIS can intervene and investigate the threat to national security. As you probably know, Mr. Harris, CSIS does not lay charges or take enforcement actions.
You're absolutely right to say that foreign influence and espionage are parts of a continuum. Interference is when you have those elements of coercion and—