Evidence of meeting #36 for Canada-China Relations in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was csis.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Heather Jeffrey  President, Public Health Agency of Canada
David Vigneault  Director, Canadian Security Intelligence Service

8:35 p.m.

Director, Canadian Security Intelligence Service

David Vigneault

I'll be very transparent with the member: This is not an issue we at CSIS have looked at.

I have not personally looked at the capacity the way you referred to it, Mr. Chong.

In answering Mr. Bergeron's question, I mentioned we have already connected and engaged with the Saskatchewan entity that is looking to establish that lab. Again, if there's one thing that will come out of the work of this committee, I think it's that everybody will be even more aware of, concerned with and, I would expect, diligent in the setting up and security aspect of any such lab.

8:35 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Chong Conservative Wellington—Halton Hills, ON

Thank you.

8:35 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ken Hardie

We'll go to Mr. Naqvi for five minutes.

8:35 p.m.

Liberal

Yasir Naqvi Liberal Ottawa Centre, ON

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you for being here, Director Vigneault, Mr. Stern and Mr. Fisher.

Director, you spoke about the processes in 2018 and 2019, and it's your testimony that, looking back, you felt the matter was dealt with in a fairly expeditious manner.

I want to ask you a forward-looking question. Having seen this process and the changing climate around safety and security as it relates to the PRC, what do you think needs to happen to improve processes around a level 4 lab and other government apparatuses that may deal with foreign countries?

8:35 p.m.

Director, Canadian Security Intelligence Service

David Vigneault

I think what we realized is that the dynamics in our countries have been changing for some time. There are a number of threat actors, unfortunately, who are after what we have. They want what we have here: our know-how, expertise and intellectual property.

As I mentioned before, there are a number of different elements.

One, you need to talk about these issues. It cannot just be in the confines of CSIS where these issues are of concern. It should be part of a societal discussion. Unfortunately, there are threats to our national security and we need to talk about these. That's one aspect.

The second aspect is to make sure you create the right connective tissue, to use the expression I used before, between different organizations. People need to know each other a bit. People need to have confidence. If I have a concern, where do I go and how do I engage in these discussions?

We definitely do not have all the answers at CSIS; we do not know everything. I would like to think we know a few things, but at the same time, what we need, not just with many other federal government entities but also with provincial, municipal and academic institutions and research laboratories, is to have areas where people will talk to each other. In the last number of years, I have seen an increase in the number of organized venues, formal and informal, for information exchange.

The last thing I would say, as we say in French, is this:

I'm going to preach for my parish.

It's important to make sure you know that the organizations dedicated to protecting national security have adequate capacity to do that, including through legislation.

8:35 p.m.

Liberal

Yasir Naqvi Liberal Ottawa Centre, ON

My last question for you encapsulates the general themes you just spoke about that should be kept in mind moving forward.

Are there specific recommendations on improvements to rules and processes that you can provide, as CSIS, to this committee in writing that can help us in our report writing given what we saw? How can we improve things moving forward?

8:40 p.m.

Director, Canadian Security Intelligence Service

David Vigneault

I welcome the opportunity. I will work with my colleagues and endeavour to provide some of our thoughts and potentially even bold advice to the committee.

8:40 p.m.

Liberal

Yasir Naqvi Liberal Ottawa Centre, ON

Thank you for your time, sir.

8:40 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ken Hardie

Thank you, Mr. Naqvi.

That brings us to the end. We appreciate all the questions and certainly our witnesses Mr. Stern, Mr. Vigneault and Mr. Fisher.

I want to thank the clerk, the analysts, our interpreters, the staff and the service staff.

8:40 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Chong Conservative Wellington—Halton Hills, ON

I have a quick point of order.

I noticed we're meeting on Friday afternoon.

8:40 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ken Hardie

Yes, we are.

8:40 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Chong Conservative Wellington—Halton Hills, ON

I was told today that the only Wednesday slot available is 7:30 p.m. to 9:30 p.m.

Could we quickly canvass members of the committee on whether they want to meet on Friday afternoon or Wednesday evening? I'm agnostic. I realize it's quite a late Wednesday slot. I thought it was earlier in the day.

8:40 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ken Hardie

Can we have the clerk follow up with everybody and get everybody's thoughts and feelings on that?

8:40 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Chong Conservative Wellington—Halton Hills, ON

Sure.

8:40 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ken Hardie

We will certainly go with Friday this week.

8:40 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Chong Conservative Wellington—Halton Hills, ON

Okay. We'll see about next week.

8:40 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ken Hardie

We will see about the wishes of the committee, even though Wednesday evening would be a horrible imposition on your chair. I don't want to play the big victim here, but we will leave that to your conscience, sir.

8:40 p.m.

Conservative

Michael Chong Conservative Wellington—Halton Hills, ON

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

8:40 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ken Hardie

With that, the meeting is adjourned.