I think identifying it clearly.... Somebody passing a regulation saying it's a national security establishment would be a good starting point.
I think the issue is that we're going to have to accept that, in order for this to happen, it's going to make a lot of people unhappy. Scientists in particular really don't like dealing with these kinds of issues. It means that not just senior public servants in this case but also ministers will have to accept that they're going to be criticized for giving less priority to science, technology and whatnot.
The other issue I would stress—and I understand the Minister of Public Safety is looking at this—is that we have to find a way of broadening access to classified information. I mean, you can take some things on faith. I think we all do. However, if you're making a case that the Chinese are very interested in scientific establishments, there are ways of articulating and setting forth these examples—not just in Canada but also in the U.K., Germany, Australia and the United States—to show clearly that it's not just people being worried about it in the abstract. We have to find a way of, if not declassifying, lowering the classification of a lot of these intelligence reports as part of the effort to change the culture.
This is not Ceausescu's Romania. We have to convince people. We're not going to convince them without at least broadening some of the facts to which they have access.