Canada-China Relations Committee on June 10th, 2024

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

Not to my knowledge.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

You mentioned in your opening statement that ASEAN is neutral. Do you feel that ASEAN has been effective in its support for the Philippines?

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

ASEAN continues to provide a very good venue for us to continue discussions with other parties on even the most contentious issues.

Yes, ASEAN has extended assistance to the Philippines in the sense that it provides a forum for discussion, and discussion is always better.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

That's true.

You mentioned that you use ASEAN as a way to speak to China.

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

Yes, among other means. We exhaust all possible means. We speak to China bilaterally, we speak to China regionally and we speak to China in fora like the United Nations.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Do you feel that the code of conduct has been working for ASEAN countries and also for the Philippines?

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

We are hopeful that we would have a more responsive, up-to-date and binding code of conduct.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Canada has had some near collisions with China, whether it's in the air or by ship in the Taiwan Straits. The permanent court has issued a judgment saying rights to the resources or waters without lawful effect.... How does your government manage these near collisions?

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

We have exercised the greatest amount of patience and restraint in handling the disputes. We believe that we have the law on our side. Our claim to the West Philippine Sea is not something we imagined. It is something granted to us by the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, affirmed by the judgment of the Permanent Court of Arbitration in 2016. We know what is right, we know what is ours and we are prepared to defend this.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Many ASEAN countries wish to keep both the U.S. and China on side. How does the Philippines navigate between U.S. and China relations?

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

Both countries are very important to the region. In the Philippines, for example, China is a very close neighbour and our biggest trading partner. The U.S., on the other hand, is our only treaty ally. We believe that both powers need to be engaged but need to be engaged constructively. We don't think that we have to choose sides.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Filipino-Chinese Friendship Day was yesterday, June 9. How do you maintain people-to-people ties with China despite the maritime challenges?

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

We have always said that the issues in the West Philippine Sea are not the sum total of our relations with China. Many Filipinos have family ties to China, and we have very strong economic ties. We share a lot of culture. People-to-people ties have always been at the forefront of our very good and healthy relations, and the West Philippine Sea is a separate issue.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

You mentioned trade and how important it is between Canada and the Philippines. I noticed that much of the trade with Canada involves electronics or electrical supplies. Can you comment on that?

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

The Philippines is one of the biggest suppliers of ignition wiring sets to Canada. That is our main export to Canada, but the balance of trade has mostly been in Canada's favour. We are now working to try to expand the trade relations to make it more commensurate with the maturity of our relations.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken Hardie]

Thank you, Ms. Yip. That's your time.

Now we'll invite you to make sure you have your earphones on, unless you're as good at French as Monsieur Bergeron, which may be difficult.

If you're ready, Mr. Bergeron, the next six minutes are yours.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Your Excellency, thank you to you and your officials for being here this evening. As you probably—

We are experiencing technical difficulties. Please stand by.

[An hon. member]

Oh, oh!

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken Hardie]

The clock has stopped while the referees review the play.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

I'll pick up where I left off.

Your Excellency, thank you again to you and your officials for being with us this evening. Your input will be extremely useful to this study on Canada's Indo-Pacific strategy.

As you probably noticed from my fellow members' questions, we find the Association of Southeast Nations, or ASEAN, somewhat of a fascinating forum. It's a bit strange to us, here, given that it brings together countries that some consider democracies and that, in some cases, are considered to be more authoritarian regimes. Some countries are on friendlier terms with the People's Republic of China, or PRC, while others have a more strained relationship with the PRC. Some countries are on friendlier terms with the United States, while others have a more strained relationship with the U.S. Nevertheless, it all holds together and the group is able to pursue its established mission.

My question is quite simple. It's one I've asked previous witnesses the committee has met with. Is there a red line that the PRC mustn't cross because it would undermine ASEAN's neutrality? Violations that come to mind are the instances of aggression against your coast guard and fishers in the South China Sea.

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

That is a very important and very delicate question. ASEAN has been around since 1967, and I've been fortunate to have been working on many ASEAN issues since I joined the department. We have seen ASEAN grow and mature as an organization and handle many sensitive topics. We like to believe that ASEAN has been effective in managing these issues, and we hope that we will not have to come to the day when red lines will be crossed. That's why we continue to work together. We continue to work intensively to make sure that issues are managed and resolved peacefully.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

I'd like to follow up on Ms. Yip's questions about the reaction, attitude and support of ASEAN and its members vis-à-vis the PRC's harassment manoeuvres targeting your ships. Just a few weeks ago, near the Spratly Islands, the Chinese Coast Guard blocked Filipino vessels trying to evacuate a sick member of the Filipino armed forces to get them to hospital.

When incidents like that occur, does ASEAN step in? If so, how? What support does ASEAN provide?

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

We were very fortunate. Thank you for your concern about that incident. That was very distressing to the Filipino people. We were very clear that it was a medical evacuation that was taking place, and our boats were still harassed.

We have tried to, again, manage the situation to make sure it does not spill over and it does not become inordinately violent on both sides. ASEAN has helped us, again, by providing a forum to discuss these issues. ASEAN continues to negotiate a code of conduct to avoid these issues happening. We are not there yet, but we continue to move towards this goal.

[Stéphane Bergeron, Bloc, Montarville, QC]

Thank you.

At the 34th ASEAN summit, in 2019, the grouping released its outlook on the Indo-Pacific. It took us a few more years to devise our Indo-Pacific strategy.

What similarities and what differences do you see between ASEAN's view of the Indo-Pacific region and Canada's?

[H.E. Maria Andrelita Sacramento Austria]

Thank you for mentioning the “ASEAN outlook on the Indo-Pacific”. The two documents are actually very similar in the sense that they aspire to a multilateral arrangement where all countries bordering the Pacific, and in the region, are engaged constructively toward ensuring a rules-based order, because it is the same rules-based order that has underpinned the security, the stability and the growth. These two documents are both making very concrete investments toward this goal. The fact that Canada came up with its own strategy is very welcomed because other countries in the region like Korea and Japan also had similar documents.