Evidence of meeting #59 for Canadian Heritage in the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was cbc.
A recording is available from Parliament.
9:35 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Independent Film and Video Fund
I'm sorry, I didn't quite understand what the question is.
9:35 a.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
If you go back to my previous question, which is should all these funding envelopes be part of the spokes of the hub that feed into CBC as a national distributor, one of the suggestions is that CBC could become an international television network, given the quality of programming we would be able to show. How would you see that direction vis-à-vis the desire for the independent producers who are creating the product to get adequate recompense if CBC were the end distribution and basically could be the sole distribution of their work?
9:35 a.m.
President, Canadian Independent Film and Video Fund
I really don't think one goes against the other. I think there's a place for both to be there, CBC as a broadcaster, but independent filmmakers receiving moneys to do programs that otherwise would probably not come to life in an institution the size of the CBC. There is more room for independent thought. I don't think one contradicts the other.
9:35 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Independent Film and Video Fund
I also think that the thought of having only one or two commissioning editors at the CBC.... They tend to like only certain programs. People are human, and commissioning editors tend to favour certain filmmakers or certain types of projects. If that were the only game in town.... I think we're advocating diversity. As we say, there shouldn't be one funding source; there shouldn't be solely one exhibition outlet.
Much as your idea has some attraction, there is a negative side to it in terms of the types of projects the CBC might not want. Where does that producer go? I know that brings up an issue of whether the producer should be making the project in the first place, but it also speaks to the issue of diversity and freedom of expression of opinion and viewpoints.
9:35 a.m.
NDP
Charlie Angus NDP Timmins—James Bay, ON
I think we recognize the role of independent producers and think it is very valuable. I only wanted to clarify whether or not there's a way of writing the agreements or whether we do need to have other sources in order for it to have good competition in terms of the cultural market.
9:35 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you for coming.
I was a little surprised that you couldn't answer Mr. Angus's question as to what percentage of your projects are actually shown on CBC. Do you have absolutely no idea what percentage that might be?
9:35 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Independent Film and Video Fund
I went at it from the point of view of what's financed. If it's financed, it's pretty well the same thing. If it's financed, it's going to show on CBC.
9:35 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Independent Film and Video Fund
We finance productions, yes.
9:35 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
And I think your evidence was that 80%, perhaps even 90%, are shown somewhere on TV.
9:35 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
But you have no idea, of that 90%, what percentage would be shown on CBC?
9:35 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Independent Film and Video Fund
No, I didn't go at it that way, but I can.
9:35 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
That's really important, because this is a CBC mandate review. We're trying to get to the bottom of what's required to continue to sustain CBC and perhaps make it more robust. It's that kind of information that we need. So perhaps you could bring that back to the committee.
9:35 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
I went back over some of your testimony, and I think in general terms you're against broad collaboration with private broadcasters—I think you said that early on—because I believe you feel they have divergent goals. You've also said that you oppose CBC trying to appeal to a mass market. You've stated that you'd like to have more of a focus on niche markets, and a focus on high-quality programming that otherwise might not be shown. This brings me to the question, which is again the commercialization of CBC.
You've suggested that CBC focus on activities that might not generate as much advertising revenues. There have been two schools of thought presented at this table. One is that CBC should get out of the advertising business altogether, perhaps follow the radio model as opposed to English and French television.
There are those who believe that we're into advertising now, and if you want to maintain a robust CBC you will have to maintain those advertising revenues and perhaps even top them up with more government funding.
Your suggestion seems to be that we should be weaning CBC from reliance on commercial advertising. Am I correct in reading between the lines?
9:40 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Independent Film and Video Fund
I guess I look at the model of CBC radio. There's no alternative out there, really. It's head and shoulders above any other type of radio in this country. I guess I wonder why we can't do that on the television side. I'm not sure that I'm well qualified to talk about whether they should be getting out of advertising completely or not. I know that the financial ramifications are huge, if they do.
I do wonder about what drives them. I think there's a direct connection between the type of programming they're putting on the air and their advertising considerations.
9:40 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
I think you're probably right in that conclusion, but there are hundreds of millions of dollars a year now that CBC earns from advertising revenues. When we were in Winnipeg probably a month or so ago, we had some of the writers giving testimony. We assumed they would like to see CBC move away from commercial revenue, and their response was “no, no, no--hold it, hold it”. There's so much money now coming from advertising revenues. If we take that away, we don't believe government is in a position to replace that advertising and of course top it up to boot. They felt that the commercial model was in place and it's now going to have to stay there. Their appeal was for additional government funding.
I suppose the direction you've been going with your presentation is that in an ideal world we should have less advertising on CBC. Some of the activities you want the CBC to refocus on are likely going to generate less revenue. Is it your suggestion that these advertising revenues should be replaced with government funding?
9:40 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Independent Film and Video Fund
Have you studied CBC radio? Why is that different? What's the difference there? Why does that model work so well and there's no advertising?
9:40 a.m.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
We have had some testimony before us on that, and I'm not sure I want to answer those questions, but I think there have been a lot of reasons given for the distinction between the success of the radio and the lack of success in English television. As you know, there's also a huge marked difference between the success of English television and French television. Again, there are language circumstances that come into effect and a lack of competition from the United States in French television, which isn't present in English television.
Let me get to one last question, and that has to do with sources of government funding for your organization. You mentioned you get funding from a number of different sources, but one of those was government agencies. How much money do you receive from government agencies, and from which specific agency?
9:40 a.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Independent Film and Video Fund
We get about $1.6 million from Canadian Heritage.
