Evidence of meeting #22 for Canadian Heritage in the 39th Parliament, 2nd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was code.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Jim Abbott Conservative Kootenay—Columbia, BC
Now, with the 20 hours of TV time, do we have any best guess from you, as experts, on whether the image appearing on the screen is coming over the air, or coming by a DVD, or coming from an Internet program?
Director of Economic and Member Services, Canadian Teachers' Federation
I don't have the specific numbers, but we do know that increasingly it's coming over the Internet. We do know that.
Conservative
Jim Abbott Conservative Kootenay—Columbia, BC
Okay. Thank you.
Ms. Graydon, I'm very interested in your proposal. It may sound like I'm being overly critical here--I apologize in advance if it does, because it's not intended that way--but if we're talking about the CBSC panel taking a look at things that come to them by way of complaints, we're talking about maybe a couple of hundred a year. That's versus the couple of thousand programs, or maybe tens of thousands, that they would actually have to look at. Everybody wants to run away from the word “censorship”, but that effectively is what they're doing. They're taking a look and saying, “Is this suitable for broadcast?” And I have a very simple view of this, that it's a form of censorship.
If they currently have a panel of, say, five people--I don't know the numbers here--engaged for 20 hours a week in handling a couple of hundred complaints, versus the number of people they would need to have for however many thousands of hours of broadcast, it just strikes me that it might not be practical. Would you agree with that?
Director, Media Action
It might really reduce the amount of violence on television.
Conservative
Director, Media Action
The short answer is that your point is well taken. I have no idea what the volume of violence currently on television would require in terms of that kind of advance screening. It might be that, practically speaking, you would have to develop a system by which a broadcaster submitted one episode of a series, or, if a broadcaster had not received any complaints over a period of time, they would be released from the responsibility of doing that.
I've come up with something that I could tell you in ten minutes, but if it were genuinely something that there was interest in implementing, I suspect that there would have to be a more sophisticated mechanism to develop it.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Gary Schellenberger
Thank you.
As I agreed, we'll have a three-minute round.
We'll start with Mr. Bélanger.
Liberal
Mauril Bélanger Liberal Ottawa—Vanier, ON
You agreed, Mr. Chairman? Well, it's good to know you agree with yourself on that.
Conservative
Liberal
Mauril Bélanger Liberal Ottawa—Vanier, ON
Thank you.
The testimony is clear. If I could summarize what we've heard--what I heard, anyhow, from not only our witnesses today, whom I thank, but from witnesses in previous sessions--I'd say most people sympathize with the intent of the bill, but nobody agrees with the bill itself, and some people actually disagree with the bill. Mr. Chairman, unless we hear from witnesses who adamantly support the bill, I'm reaching a conclusion that we're there and that the bill in its current form is not where I want to go.
My colleague has asked whether or not the witnesses.... There was a positive response to the notion of these administrative monetary penalties that the CRTC referred to. We asked for, and I hope we receive before the break, a proposal or suggestions from the CRTC. We can look at that. It might be something we could, or could not, include in the bill, depending on the nature of it. I'm quite prepared for that.
I want to reach forward in terms of other witnesses. If we're going to ask other witnesses, I will put forward a suggestion, and it's a serious one.
We heard from parents directly or indirectly, and some of us are parents. We've heard from teachers. We've heard from grandparents, and some of us are grandparents. In answer to your question, Madame Noble, about who would be better than parents, the answer is obviously grandparents, with all due respect.
The one group that this bill targets is the one group we haven't heard from. Just to be clear, Mr. Chair, would it be worth our while to assemble a panel of children, of kids, from the age group we're talking about? I mean those who actually watch TV 20 hours a week and spend 10 hours on the Internet. I know some who are glued to their computer screen, which is also their TV and their telephone. They multi-task to an extent that I couldn't possibly ever dream of doing. It's obviously another generation. It might be useful to hear from them what they think of this, since they're the ones who are targeted. Obviously, from what I've heard today from the Canadian Teachers' Federation, 50% or more of parents don't pay attention to what their kids are doing and watching.
It's a suggestion I hope my colleagues won't take lightly.
Oh, I'm getting some reaction here. Let's get some reactions.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Gary Schellenberger
It will have to be a short answer, because it was a long question.
Director, Media Action
It's been a while since I read this wonderful study the CTF did, but it seems to me that in the study the kids themselves indicate that they think their parents should be more censorious, should be more engaged in telling them that they should not or cannot watch or play certain things. Kids themselves recognize that they're being exposed to stuff that is beyond the pale, that is inappropriate for them to be watching. When I speak to kids in schools, which I do a lot, I get the same response.
Conservative
President, Canadian Teachers' Federation
Grandparents are absolutely wonderful. I think we need to work with grandparents.
One of the video operators that sells video games.... The largest market, of course, is made up of young males 16 to 25 in terms of some of the video games. However, one of the other huge markets is grandparents, who don't want their grandkids to be out of the loop. When you have a grandparent buying Grand Theft Auto for a grandson who is six or seven years old, we need to do some work with grandparents.
Bloc
Luc Malo Bloc Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you for being here today.
Ms. Graydon, have you shared your concerns and your suggested improvements with the CBSC, the body responsible for administering the code?
Director, Media Action
The short answer is no, because I was unaware of the bill until I was invited to appear before the committee.
I see that Ron Cohen, from the Canadian Broadcast Standards Council, who I know and respect, is here, so I will have the opportunity to suggest to him my modifications. I can predict his response, which will probably not be enthusiastic, because he represents the broadcasters, and I understand that.
But, no, I just had this blinding flash of brilliance in the past week.
Bloc
Luc Malo Bloc Verchères—Les Patriotes, QC
Are you saying that before giving testimony on this bill today, your group had not considered the three amendments that you would like to see made to the code?
Director, Media Action
No, in fact, in previous years, when the television violence code was first introduced, we did speak then about our concerns, and have since, about the after-the-fact nature of the way the code is administered. We have previously expressed concerns that the process takes a very, very long time.
When Howard Stern's program was airing in Canada, we repeatedly participated in the complaint process and were extremely aggravated that it took so long and that it happened after the fact. So our dissatisfaction with the process has certainly been expressed previously.