Canadian Heritage Committee on May 27th, 2008

[Bill Siksay, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

When Mr. Laverock was speaking a moment ago about other choices, I had an experience late one night listening to the CBC in my office, on the Internet. Something came on that I wasn't particularly enjoying, so I first of all tried time-shifting to a different time zone to see if I could find something I would enjoy better. That didn't work. So I did what I shouldn't confess to. I switched to ABC, Australian Broadcasting Corporation's classical music station on the Internet. I was enjoying what was on there, and when the announcer came back on I found out that it was actually the CBC Radio Orchestra I was listening to from Australia.

[Voices]

Hear, hear!

[Bill Siksay, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

That kind of proves one of our points anyway.

Dr. Dyck, in your presentation you said you had some concerns about the economic viability of the CBC orchestra. You talked about a number of things where you thought there were other possibilities around connecting to the public, modern technology for accessibility, audience involvement. You talked about the visual basis, the visual accessibility of the music listening experience, I think. Did you intend those to be criticisms of the current CBC Radio Orchestra? I just want to clarify how you saw that. Are they concerns that you have about the current orchestra?

[Calvin Dyck]

In light of the fact that there's been some suggestion from CBC management that the orchestra is in decline, or in my experience in the very few times I've played with the CBC when we've played for not-full houses, I thought we should look at what some other organizations are doing.

The Vancouver Symphony Orchestra, for example, has been experimenting with using large screens and doing close-ups of musicians in live performance. I'm speaking about the live performance now. Vancouver Opera has been using English subtitles, as most opera companies have. Recently they did a first nations version of Mozart's Magic Flute, combining first nations culture and costumes with that. And I think we as classical musicians need to continue to look for ways to invigorate what we do and connect to a larger audience.

In Abbotsford, we've been experimenting with combining classical music with backdrops, with costuming where all the musicians are in gorgeous gowns, and we've been getting a younger and younger audience, to the point where I would say the mean age of the audience is around 30 to 35 now for our concerts. You try to invite the audience to participate, to sing along with the orchestra. You invite somebody from the audience up on stage to dance while the orchestra plays. And the concerts become participatory experiences rather than just watching an orchestra at the distance.

In Abbotsford we have an audience that now feels as if it can't wait for the next show. And yes, some people would say we're combining entertainment with classical music, but we are reaching a younger and younger audience and creating a situation in which people who otherwise would not enjoy it are exposed to it and wholeheartedly embracing what we're doing.

[Bill Siksay, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Thank you.

I wanted to ask Mr. Laverock another question. I think you were the only one who mentioned the issue of employment for musicians in Vancouver. Could you expand a bit more on how you see that particular issue? And others could add something if they want to.

[George Laverock]

I don't know what it's like in all parts of the country, but I did talk with the president of the Vancouver musicians union a few months ago, and he said the number of contracts that come across his desk for CBC work had shrunk from about $500,000 worth of work in one six-month period a couple of years ago down to less than $20,000 in the six-month period recently. So I don't think I have to say more than that.

[Bill Siksay, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Does anyone else have a comment on the employment situation for the musicians of the orchestra?

[Jeremy Berkman]

I'll just say something about the musical ecology of Vancouver. I think one of the things the CBC orchestra has done is bring together musicians from all different types of performing areas in Vancouver. It is true that there is a certain amount of income for musicians from the CBC Radio Orchestra, but frankly, as was previously mentioned, it's not very big. It's a very small amount. And actually it's not as much an issue whether that employment would be replaced or not if the orchestra weren't there, but it's more that the type of employment we'd be having instead would be, in a sense, of lesser value.

[Bill Siksay, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

And I have one other quick question. There's been an idea floated by some folks from the city council in Surrey, British Columbia, about having the CBC Radio Orchestra become the Surrey Symphony Orchestra. Do any of you have a comment about the viability of that kind of idea?

[George Zukerman]

I do, if I may.

It's a lovely idea, but it can't go anywhere because there is no basis for an orchestra series in Surrey yet. There's no structure, there's no federal funding, there's no board of directors. You can go out and hire an orchestra anywhere you want. You can hire an orchestra and put it in Chilliwack and call it the Chlliwack Symphony. It doesn't work that way. An orchestra has to belong to a community. The musicians would not necessarily move to Surrey any more than there are many Surrey musicians who work in the Vancouver Symphony.

So as much as it's a lovable idea, I don't see how it can possibly get off the ground. I have a feeling the Surrey council believes it can have an orchestra on a $700,000 annual budget. Orchestras cost somewhere between $13 million and $20 million a year to run.

[The Vice-Chair, Liberal, Andy Scott]

Thank you very much.

I want to thank the committee. We were able to do this in a reasonably orderly fashion, notwithstanding the rather awkward start.

I'd like to thank the witnesses for their patience, their passion, and the eloquence of their interventions.

I will offer my own bias. Sharing Fredericton with Measha Brueggergosman has left me no choice but to hold a very passionate view on this subject myself.

So to all of you there and to the members of the committee, thank you. We certainly have been informed by this afternoon's proceedings.

On that note, the meeting is adjourned.