Canadian Heritage Committee on May 11th, 2010

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

First of all, if the motion passes, I'd suggest that we strongly consider adding additional time to the committee rather than....

Well, then, find a sub. I'm happy to sit additional time so that we can continue to work on matters before the committee. We have set a schedule. I have no problem with adding some extra time, if that's the wish of the committee.

That said, the original motion was something that we could support. This motion is actually something that we can't support, as amended, because it calls on the Minister of Canadian Heritage and departmental officials, presumably to pass their decision over a hypothetical situation that has not yet come to fruition. There is no evaluation by the department on the impact of such a takeover, and you'd actually be asking them to pass judgment under the Investment Canada Act before they've actually even reviewed what has not yet transpired. This would not be a good precedent.

I understand Lions Gate Entertainment was here last week talking to MPs. I have no problem with their coming in to talk about what's before them. You can call on Mr. Icahn and representatives of Canada's film and television industry to talk about it, but calling on departmental officials to comment on a situation that is as yet a hypothetical situation, which does have market implications, would be irresponsible.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

Mr. Angus, then Madame Lavallée.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Thank you.

In response to Mr. Del Mastro, I certainly understand his concern. That's why I said--and I might not have been that clear--that I'd like to hear what steps they would take in terms of dealing.... I don't want to know if they are going to render a verdict that would be prejudicial, but I think it is fair for us to ask ministry officials to comment, given the scope of this, on whether there are parameters we could discuss concerning what one would look at in terms of net benefit.

I don't want to presuppose a decision on this, because it would be unfair, but I think we need to have a sense of how the ministry would evaluate any project, if they want to talk hypothetically or not, without getting into the specifics of Mr. Icahn.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

Madame Lavallée, and then Mr. Rodriguez.

[Carole Lavallée, Bloc, Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Thank you.

This really is a very important deal. I have met with the Lionsgate people too. They have told me about the issues they have. Given our role, it is clear that our committee should look into a deal as significant as this one. We agree to meeting the people from Lionsgate as well as the people from Icon and from the department, especially since the minister's reply in the House was extremely vague.

Let us set aside two or three meetings for this. It will be just an interlude in the digital media study we are conducting at the moment. Having two full meetings on the matter would be no disruption at all.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

Mr. Rodriguez, please.

[Pablo Rodriguez, Liberal, Honoré-Mercier, QC]

I understand the logic of Mr. Del Mastro's remarks. Perhaps we do not need to see the minister now, especially if we want to expedite the study.

We can see what is going on with Lionsgate and with the other side. We could invite some officials to tell us what the process would be if, hypothetically, something came of it. If it eventually happens, we could ask the minister to come.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

Mr. Del Mastro.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

That's not how the motion reads. As I said, we're still talking about a hypothetical situation. It's not like this has occurred. There is a potential it could occur.

I might add, Mr. Chairman, this comes up because some folks were on the Hill last week raising the attention of MPs to a situation, so let it be said that not all lobbyists are bad. On the Hill, I know we have a tendency to paint them as bad, but without folks coming to us and telling us what's going on, I'm not sure this would have come to our attention. So I'd simply like to put on the record that not all lobbyists are bad, even though we tend to attack them when it appears appropriate.

I have no problem with hearing from the principals involved in this, including folks from the film and television industry. If you want to talk to departmental officials about what net benefit to Canada means, or what the process is, I can't see that as being specifically market sensitive, but you would need to understand that they cannot tell you...or they cannot presuppose a decision on this, nor should we expect them to answer a question that could have market implications.

It will be a terrible precedent if you do that. We'll have folks in all the time making decisions that, you know, folks' retirement incomes are invested in. So it is dicey ground.

I think it is worthwhile to hear what everybody has to say. As I said, I'll set extra time aside to do that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

Mr. Angus.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, maybe we can wrap it up.

I can certainly understand where Mr. Del Maestro is coming from. I don't want to turn our committee into a kangaroo court; I've been on kangaroo courts in the past.

As long as we understand that ministry officials will be there to explain what a process will look like....

It's not for us to judge one side or the other, but I believe we have to hear both sides out. The implications are huge.

So that's my only proviso. I don't see that anyone will necessarily come down on one side or the other. It's not either/or.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

So can we propose an amendment then?

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Certainly.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

So after “That the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage hold hearings with officials from Lions Gate Entertainment Corporation, Carl Icahn,” we take out “the Minister of Canadian Heritage” and just have “and representatives from Canada’s film and television industry”.

So we would swipe out “the Minister of Canadian Heritage and departmental officials to address concerns”, and then we can add that we would further like to hear from departmental officials about the evaluation process.

Is that fair?

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Yes. Good.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

So after “and television industry”, strike the balance, all the way to the word “with”.

Then, after the period at “Carl Icahn”, indicate that committee members would also like to hear from departmental officials about the process of evaluation.

Is that fair?

Okay.

Is there any agreement as to whether we can find an extra day or something to undertake this?

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

According to the clerk, the first two meetings in June are still available. We could hold them on June 1 and June 3.

We've heard the amended motion. Can we just have agreement that we would forward and we would hold those two meetings on June 1 and June 3?

[An hon. member]

Perfect.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

Can we hear just hear the motion, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Conservative, Gary Schellenberger]

Michael.

[Michael Dewing, Committee Researcher]

The motion as amended reads as follows: That the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage hold hearings with officials from Lions Gate Entertainment Corporation, Carl Icahn, and representatives from Canada's film and television industry to discuss the attempted takeover of Canadian film production and distribution firm, Lions Gate, by U.S. investor Carl Icahn; committee members would also like to hear from departmental officials in order to understand the process.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

The “evaluation” process.

[Michael Dewing]

The evaluation process.

[Dean Del Mastro, Conservative, Peterborough, ON]

That's fine.

[Michael Dewing]

Yes.