Evidence of meeting #34 for Canadian Heritage in the 40th Parliament, 3rd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was programming.
A recording is available from Parliament.
5 p.m.
Liberal
Bonnie Crombie Liberal Mississauga—Streetsville, ON
Thank you.
To Access 2020, why hasn't the CRTC required full accessibility? Was it a cost issue? Why hasn't there been any enforcement and monitoring? Why do you rely on complaints?
5 p.m.
President, Media Access Canada
Certainly there is the cost issue, but relative to the system itself the costs are not large, and there are also solutions to bringing down costs. It requires technical innovation. It requires all kinds of things. The technology exists today; it has to be put together. That's why we were asking for the 1% to 100%, led by the coalition.
Today we have captioning. It was the accessibility organizations that created the business model for closed captioning. When we expand to descriptive video, the accessibility organizations are going to lead that as well. We know how to do it.
5 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Michael Chong
Thank you very much, Madam Milligan and Madam Crombie.
Madame Lavallée.
5 p.m.
Bloc
Carole Lavallée Bloc Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
I would like to ask you a question, Mr. Perreault. In fact, I have several questions, but I won't be able to ask them all. I am aware of your vast expertise in broadcasting, and I would like to ask you a series of questions, including some on regulating the Internet. If we get through the comments in your brief, we can come back to that.
In the meantime, I want to talk about your brief, especially paragraphs 12, 13 and 14. I find them very interesting, because in my view, thanks to your experience, you have realistically identified the huge constraints linked to vertical integration. In paragraph 12, you ask, among other things, how “is a small programmer going to constantly complain against the people they need to [...] price [...] their services?” You are absolutely right.
I see something in your brief that no one else has pointed out: specialty channels do not have access to their customers. You do not know who they are. The BDU knows who your customers are, but they do not share that information. You cannot contact them directly. In terms of marketing, that must be a major handicap.
In paragraph 14, you mention the “risk that vertical integration poses to the diversity of voices” and you suggest that “legislative frameworks” be developed. I would like you to explain what kind of legislative framework should be developed to help specialty channels. You say that you have not had a problem, but you are in a highly specialized market—weather—and you do things that are impossible to imitate technologically speaking so I don't see how BDU could push you aside and set up its own weather service.
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
That has not happened yet, but...
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
We hope not.
You pointed out first of all that we cannot directly reach subscribers, but we do reach them through the BDUs. You are absolutely right. At recent CRTC hearings, my colleague Paul and I told the commission that with the arrival of digital technology, BDUs are in a position to know precisely what each user does with his digital terminal: what channel he tunes into, for how long he does so and what channel he switches to after that. BDUs already have that information.
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
We do not.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Carole Lavallée Bloc Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC
So you cannot know how much time I spend watching MétéoMédia.
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
No.
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
We deal with Nielsen and they provide us with monthly reports. The BDUs have reports that are up to date to the second.
Vertical integration comes into play because these people, now... If you look at the sheet we distributed, you will see that there are not very many independents, there are very few.
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
They are all linked to BDUs.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Carole Lavallée Bloc Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC
In passing, by the way, does your third column, which corresponds to reach, refer to GPRs?
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
Yes, let's put it that way.
A BDU that owns programming services can use the information from the decoders to determine which programs are the most watched. Then, if that programming belongs to an independent or if it has been acquired from a producer, all they need to do is find the producer and subsequently offer the programming themselves.
That puts us at a disadvantage with respect to those customers. That is the first thing. That answers your first question.
As regards the CRTC, I think there will be regulations. We have already discussed that with the commission. In the spring, the commission will hold a very important hearing on vertical integration and we will participate. We will have comments for the commission on that topic, namely whether steps should be taken quickly to prevent the diversity of voices from disappearing. Diversity of voices exists not only at the editorial level, but also at the owner level. We feel that it is important...
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
We mentioned that briefly here. We are talking about perhaps—not favours—but openings on basic service so that independents can benefit from them.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
Precisely.
In addition, if we want to sustain independents in their development... I read many of the debates that take place here in committee. Some people say that a company has to be big to succeed, but that is not true. All large companies were small at one time. Small companies must be given a chance to prosper.
5:05 p.m.
Bloc
Carole Lavallée Bloc Saint-Bruno—Saint-Hubert, QC
Do you think that one of the solutions could be to merge the Broadcasting Act and the Telecommunications Act?
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
5:05 p.m.
Vice-President, Communications and Regulatory Affairs, Pelmorex Media Inc.
No, not for the time being. We will come back to that in our document on vertical integration, because copyright is not taken into account. That is another area that needs to be looked at.