Canadian Heritage Committee on Dec. 7th, 2010

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

Yes. That is a completely different subject matter, and I'd be happy to address that issue with you right now, if you wish.

[Scott Armstrong, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester—Musquodoboit Valley, NS]

Go ahead.

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

Absolutely.

[Scott Armstrong, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester—Musquodoboit Valley, NS]

Could you please explain it to us? Why wouldn't you just comply instead of taking the Information Commissioner to court?

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

They are two completely different stories, Mr. Chairman, and I need one minute to do this quickly.

The Access to Information Act is built in two different pieces. The first part of the Access to Information Act is about who is subject to the act. It has certain exemptions--the information that you put out, and then you decide what you retract. There is no mention of CBC/Radio-Canada in there. You have to go to section 68.1, and I'll be referring to section 68.1 many times if we come back to this. This is the issue and the paragraph under which we're in front of the court.

It says:

This Act does not apply to any information that is under the control of the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation that relates to its journalistic, creative or programming activities, other than information that relates to its general administration.

So the act has a clear exclusion--not an exemption, an exclusion--for information that is considered to be journalistic, creative, or programming in nature.

And it's pretty obvious that the legislator here—because one of the first rules when you interpret a statute is that the legislator doesn't speak for no purpose—did not use superfluous words. We have an exclusion in section 68.1, and that is the subject of our conversation in front of the court: what is the ambit and the scope of section of 68.1? It goes to our journalistic sources. It goes to things that we believe in. We think that nobody but us should control that.

[Scott Armstrong, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester—Musquodoboit Valley, NS]

If that court case comes back and does not rule in your favour, will you then comply with the request of the Information Commissioner? I think the taxpayers of Canada would be very interested in that. Will you then comply with what the Information Commission is asking you to do?

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

The answer is that obviously we will comply with any legislation that applies to us. But section 68.1 right now--this is not about expenses.

[Scott Armstrong, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester—Musquodoboit Valley, NS]

My question was that if it comes back, you will then comply, so the taxpayers of Canada--

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

We will look at what our recourses are at that time. We will look at the content of that decision--

[Scott Armstrong, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester—Musquodoboit Valley, NS]

So now you're saying you're not going to comply. You're going to evaluate at that time.

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

No. We always comply with legislation. If we still have a recourse in front of some court at that time, we will look at recourses, but at the end of the day, when all the recourses are épuisés, are no longer available, obviously we will comply with any kind of legislation. We comply with all sorts of legislation that affects us every day, sir.

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

Thank you very much, Monsieur Lacroix. Thank you, Mr. Armstrong.

Mr. Simms.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

I'm going to be splitting my time with Mr. Scarpaleggia.

Welcome to our guests.

In your speech, you referred to the stable funding, year over year, of $60 million. We found out the other day that the payment was actually $47 million, tied up in a measure in budget 2010 about executive compensation.

Could you--

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

It's about wages. It's just an adjustment. We were paid ahead of time for a wage assessment, and the government chose to no longer give that assessment. We got the full value of the $60 million last year.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Okay. So the $13 million you have not received, does that affect your programming whatsoever?

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

It affects our operations. We have to find it in some other way.

This is something that applies not only to us but to all crown agencies.

But the answer is yes.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

In your particular situation, how would that affect you, to find the $13 million?

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

We have to find $13 million in our operations, which means trying to increase revenues or reducing our costs.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

And you haven't discussed yet how you're going to do that?

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

This was for 2010-11. You know what we did in order to balance our budget on a two-year recovery plan. We balanced it last year. If things go as we think they will, we're going to be able to balance at March 31, 2011, for the year that finishes then. We sold some assets and made some readjustments to our workforce, unfortunately, and to our production methods. We have to continue doing that.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Would it be safe to say that it would be much more beneficial for your corporation if you were given stable funding on a long-term basis, similar to the model that's used in the BBC? That certainly would go a long way, wouldn't it?

[Hubert T. Lacroix]

I can't tell you how important stable funding is for the public broadcaster. The answer to that question is obviously yes.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

Mr. Chair, how much time do I have?

[The Chair, Conservative, Michael Chong]

You have some more time. Go ahead.

[Scott Simms, Liberal, Bonavista—Gander—Grand Falls—Windsor, NL]

All right.

You know, we heard from the smaller independent people talking about...kicked up to the upper tiers from the cable companies. You did mention that in Prince Edward Island, if I have either Bell Direct or Shaw Direct, I do not get the local CBC.