Evidence of meeting #34 for Canadian Heritage in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was films.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
I wouldn't have written anything different, absolutely not. the first graph you are referring to on page 20 shows the trends in the movie theatre market. As for policy tools, they are basically the same.
Liberal
Stéphane Dion Liberal Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC
It is surprising for this committee to see that the technological environment has changed enormously, but that the policies haven't changed.
Is there something in that?
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
Just be careful, the tools themselves may have not changed, but Telefilm Canada, which has been around since 1967, has tailored its programs to the new technologies. The NFB has adapted to the new technologies. The industry and entrepreneurs distribute films over new channels. They use social media. The expenses associated with using those tools are now eligible for the Telefilm Canada fund, for instance.
The details of how the fund works have therefore been adapted, but the policy framework is basically the same.
Liberal
Stéphane Dion Liberal Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC
So there have been changes, but we don't see them in your document. We will find out what they are when those folks appear before us to give testimony. Is that right?
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
Yes, I tried to paint a picture today of the policy framework. Clearly, I don't know who you are going to invite, but if representatives from Telefilm Canada or the CRTC—
Liberal
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
If CRTC representatives appear, they will tell you that video-on-demand services did not exist 10 years ago perhaps—I don't know exactly when the first services came out—but once they became available, they were regulated. The CRTC imposed rules on those services, requiring, for example, that one Canadian film be broadcast every month or something like that. So there are some regulations for those tools.
Liberal
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
We have amended the Income Tax Act for tax credits. We adopted a new audiovisual co-production policy in 2011. In fact, the committee recommended it a number of years ago. We have adapted our performance metrics. Ten years ago, you would not have seen the graph on page 20. You would not have had the multiple platforms. At that time, our focus was only on movie theatres because the other markets were not as present.
Conservative
Jim Hillyer Conservative Lethbridge, AB
Thanks for coming. It's very interesting.
You say in response to Mr. Young's questions that the change in technology is the biggest change in the industry. Would you say that these new platforms are giving the Canadian film industry a broader audience? Are they getting more views now?
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
In theory, yes. As I mentioned, the market is now the planet. So as soon as a film is on Netflix—and there are Canadian films on Netflix—it has an audience that was not there before films became available on this streaming service.
My difficulty in answering your question is that I cannot give you the metrics of what this new viewership is. In a few years from now, maybe, but the data is just not available.
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
No, it's not available.
Conservative
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
I invite you to ask Netflix.
Conservative
Jim Hillyer Conservative Lethbridge, AB
Would you guess that, besides the worldwide market increasing, more Canadians are watching more Canadian content through these platforms?
Director, Film and Video Policy and Programs, Department of Canadian Heritage
As Jean-François mentioned, in theory, yes, because in the past, if your film wasn't available in theatres, or even if it was, some Canadian films in theatres would last for a week or so. You had a very small opportunity to see the film, even if you'd heard about it.
In theory, online platforms, where the films stay for months or years, offer greater opportunity for Canadian films to be seen. Of course, as we've also mentioned, there's the issue of being lost in a sea of content. If you just have thousands of films on Netflix, for example, how do you stand out above that? That's definitely an issue as well.
Conservative
Jim Hillyer Conservative Lethbridge, AB
Maybe growing up or even as a younger adult you don't really pay attention to whether something is Canadian content or not. You don't notice that there is a lot of Canadian content in the mainstream theatres. I don't think there is. Even on television, there's more on CBC, but even CTV and the private networks have some Canadian content, but more television series than movies.
Is the percentage of Canadian content worse on Netflix? It seems like there's not much in the mainstream television and video stores and movie theatres either, is there?
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
There are Canadian films on Netflix, and we're just talking about Netflix, but there are other streaming services. There are Canadian alternatives: shomi, CraveTV, Illico. There are Canadian alternatives.
I'm sorry, but we have no idea how many Canadian films are on Netflix. We know there are some. We have no idea of their viewership. That could be a good question for a Netflix representative if you were to invite them to your study.
Conservative
Jim Hillyer Conservative Lethbridge, AB
Could you talk a little bit more about the international co-production model and if you think it's a good thing and why there's an advantage to it? Just help us to understand more about that model.
Director General, Cultural Industries, Department of Canadian Heritage
More and more films will need to diversify their sources of financing. As I've mentioned, financing remains a key challenge in this business. Co-production agreements are international treaties signed between two countries. I'm no lawyer, and when I started in this job a few years ago, Mr. Brown, I had not realized how important a treaty is. It's the mother of all contracts between two countries. It opens doors for Canadians.
Canada started with France in 1967, so we were the initiators with France of co-production treaties. After all those years, we are now partners with 54 countries. Essentially, the benefit of a co-production agreement is that it opens the door to the domestic programs. Let's say it's a France-Canada co-pro. France has tools for its film industry; Canada has tools for its feature film industry. That co-production is considered a national production in both countries. It opens access to foreign financing, and it opens access to markets.
Canada signed a co-production agreement with India last year. India is a big country. It will bring Canadian films to a market that would have been—I shouldn't say closed; India is not closed. It opens doors for Canadian actors, Canadian talent, Canadian products.
Conservative
Jim Hillyer Conservative Lethbridge, AB
Just as there are Canadians who take pride in watching Canadian productions, there are probably Frenchmen who take pride in that, and they're watching a Canadian production at the same time.
I just want to make sure I get this question in before I run out of time. You talk about the need for public funding, because it's a high-risk business, so you have trouble getting private funding. When you do get private funders, if the risk pays off they get paid back, and then some, does the public get anything back?
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Gord Brown
We're out of time. Maybe in the next round you can get in on that.
We're now going to move to the five-minute round. We're going to hear from Mr. Stewart.
NDP
Kennedy Stewart NDP Burnaby—Douglas, BC
Thank you.
I'm from Burnaby, British Columbia. We've got over 120 businesses that are related to the film industry, including multiple studios. We are really proud of our film industry there. What I hear constantly is that the British Columbia film industry is quite different from the film industry in the rest of Canada, in terms of the nature of the production that's done there.
I'm just wondering if you could perhaps comment on that, as this is the beginning of the study, just to give us a sense of the differences across the country, with specific reference to B.C.
Perhaps you could also comment on how the national policies play out in encouraging the B.C. film industry to grow.