Canadian Heritage Committee on Nov. 21st, 2013

[François Lapointe, NDP, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

Thank you for that answer.

There was an aspect at the end of your presentation that was also very interesting. You have opened the door to the idea that we pioneered winter Olympic sports, but that we must be careful because many countries are catching up with us by taking a creative approach to how they support their athletes. Could you elaborate a bit more on the next steps we need to take to remain pioneers in the way we support our athletes?

[Dale Henwood]

First of all, my comment would be if you look at it from a winter side, countries like Korea, Japan, and China are investing heavily in sports such as speed skating and snowboarding, sports where we have traditionally done very well. It's a real challenge for us to continue to get the number of medals that we have in the past, because as I said, they have really targeted their investment.

I guess among the things we have to do is on a regular basis keep good connections with universities in terms of some of the very much applied research. Also, all the people we deal with have a real attitude of striving to get better every day. That's one of the questions they're always trying to look at. What are some of the new things? What are some of the different things? What are some things we could do better to try to make sure that we're getting an advantage or keeping an advantage for Canada? There are a lot of things.

Perhaps Dr. Norris could talk more specifically about some of the physiological things that are going on. Certainly in the area of medicine, we're doing a lot of work in concussion research right now. I would say that we are a Canadian leader, and I might even be so bold as to say an international leader, in some of the concussion research that we're doing, based on some of the equipment that has been bought through organizations such as Own the Podium, which is, as you know, primarily a federal support.

There are things that we do on a daily basis from a physiological and a psychological standpoint, but I can't speak specifically about some of those. We have people who are a lot more expert than I am who can talk about them, but I do know that every day they're looking at new ideas and new areas where we can try to get better.

Could I perhaps ask Dr. Norris if he wanted to expand on that?

[The Chair, Conservative, Gord Brown]

Very quickly.

[Dr. Stephen Norris]

I think your point about the links with universities and certain industries is extremely important and actually verges back on that aspect of the worth of sport. To work with, say, Bombardier, you'd think maybe designing an airplane would be enough for some people, but you put an athlete, say an alpine skier, into their wind tunnel, and you see the engineers' faces light up. It's an exciting proposition for them. We get information back from industry to the sports that we wouldn't normally have without this arrangement, this partnership with industry, and they get excitement that helps them in their own endeavours. Perhaps there's an exchange of information and knowledge as well.

The universities are absolutely critical in this process for us, and making sure that we have those avenues is a strong component of why we're successful.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gord Brown]

Thank you.

Mr. Dion, you have seven minutes.

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to the three of you for being with us today.

I would ask Mr. Heck or Dr. Norris if they have something to add about what Mr. Lapointe asked on the ability to be sure that francophone Canadians have all the support they need in Calgary or in other areas in Canada where English is the predominant language.

[Barry Heck]

Do you want to speak to that?

[Dr. Stephen Norris]

Dale, do you want to answer that first?

[Barry Heck]

I think he wanted us to answer.

[Dr. Stephen Norris]

Okay. From my standpoint, absolutely, we would rely very heavily on the services through the Canadian Sport Institute, where we're able to supply French-speaking individuals. We take inordinate lengths to ensure that we are able to communicate effectively and provide services.

There was an interesting question that came up earlier about bobsleigh. With bobsleigh in Ontario and in Quebec, we utilize Lake Placid, actually, for the eastern athletes. Of course it's a facility-based sport and the facilities are in the west, at least in Canada, so eventually, when athletes make the grade, they do have to move to Calgary, typically, if they're in those sliding sports, so that we can take them to the next level.

I deal with the women's hockey team, for example, and we have fortunately a real cohort of incredible talent that comes from the province of Quebec and is integrated obviously clearly into the national team. They have to come to Calgary for the six months leading into the games, and yes, whilst English would be the predominant language, we go to what I would hope are very clear lengths to ensure that our communication in both directions with the francophone athletes is of the highest order.

I would hope that when the Quebec athletes are asked those questions, whilst Alberta is not home for anyone from another province, they feel like it's home when they're there and they have the level of care and attention that any other athlete has.

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

Thank you very much.

Again this is for you, Dr. Norris. In your presentation you mentioned a concern you may have, if I understand well, about the danger that after the Olympics the focus will be less on the support for the athletes. You said that it's a pattern you have seen in other countries. You mentioned Australia. Can you explain more to the committee about what you have in mind?

[Dr. Stephen Norris]

Let me say that there's perhaps the honeymoon period, whereby there's the euphoria particularly around Vancouver, and then after that the memory dissipates. If you look at the way the media treats the Olympic sports, there's a big focus in the months, weeks, and days leading into the games. There's a lot of focus of attention around that two-week, three-week period. There's a latency period of perhaps a few weeks after the games, and then it almost disappears out of the communal psyche for the next few years. We have to understand that although there's that period of two weeks, there's always other games. We're always preparing.

In fact, it's not limited to just the year before the games that the preparation is occurring. Many of the athletes who will compete in Sochi are possibly at the end of a decade of the pursuit of this particular excellence. Unfortunately, I do feel sorry, at times, for the people working within the system and the athletes themselves, because we go through this very cyclical attention to these athletes, and they're almost forgotten for a period of time. To really have a high performance model, we need to have greater stability, if you like, in terms of everything: the resources that are applied, the attention to the athletes, the understanding of the process they're going through, because it is a long-term process, not a short-term one.

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

You would like this committee to take your recommendation to the government. For the three of you, are there other recommendations you would like this committee to consider?

[Dale Henwood]

First of all, I don't believe it's always financial resources that are needed. At times it's more will than wallet, but if we want to maintain our position and improve our position internationally, I think we do need some investment in people, and that's primarily, I'm going to suggest, first and foremost, in coaches. Second, I think we do need good support personnel for the athletes and coaches. That's again what we try to do through our institute, and not just in Calgary but those who are across the country.

As we move into facility-based institutes, there is a need for some ongoing operational costs that we're going to have to come up with somewhere. If there is any way we can get some support for those, it would be very much appreciated.

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

Mr. Heck, do you want to add something about the recommendation you would like this committee to consider?

[Barry Heck]

I would certainly echo Mr. Henwood's comments. I would add that I think there is a need across the entire system for us to work more collaboratively. There is some duplication in the system that we all have to get better. Whether that's on the governance side right down to how we manage our resources, I do believe there is some work that can be done there. I think the federal government can play a role in that, in just ensuring a more effective way of operating so that at the end of the day, more dollars are getting to the athletes, the coaches, where they're truly needed.

[Dr. Stephen Norris]

I would agree.

[Stéphane Dion, Liberal, Saint-Laurent—Cartierville, QC]

Are you in a situation to specify what you mean by duplications that we should address?

[Barry Heck]

Do you want to speak to that?

[Dr. Stephen Norris]

The governance structure and the role of central government, I think, at times is underestimated. I personally look to the central government to be a leader. It doesn't mean to say necessarily, as Mr. Henwood said, invest money. I think there are a number of things in terms of getting the agencies responsible for sport at all levels across the country to work together more effectively, to reduce the level of national duplication, but understanding the needs for the different geographical aspects of the provinces. There is, let's say, a level of competition among some of the more senior agencies that I think we need to eradicate so that we can be a lot more purposeful in what is actually done.

One area for me is for government to really lead and perhaps coerce, to actually challenge corporate Canada to become a lot more involved. I think the federal government has a role to encourage that type of activity.

[The Chair, Conservative, Gord Brown]

Thank you.

We'll move now to Mr. Richards and Mr. Young, who are going to split the seven minutes.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Wild Rose, AB]

I understand our beginnings in sport are somewhat similar. I played junior hockey in Alberta, but I think that's about where it ends. That's probably why I'm sitting here asking the questions and you're sitting there as one of our foremost experts in high-performance sport. We're really pleased to have you here today.

Mr. Heck, Dr. Norris, welcome from back in Alberta where, of course, my home is as well. As a native Albertan and someone who represents the area surrounding Calgary and certainly represents Canmore, where you have a well-known training centre that you're responsible for, I've been in most if not all of your facilities, many of them multiple times. There's no question you're doing a wonderful job of what you do there, so we're pleased to have you both here with us, remotely, as well.

I have one question, and any remaining time I have I'd like to turn over to Mr. Young.

You spoke about Frozen Thunder, Dr. Norris. I was there to help open it a few years ago. I've mountain-biked at the Canmore Nordic Centre fairly extensively, and I can remember times when I was mountain-biking and watching the athletes training already on the snow. It makes for some interesting mixes.

In 1988, I was a fairly young teenager, and I remember the excitement about the Olympics and certainly the legacy that they left. I only have to look at communities like Canmore as a great example. The number of Olympic athletes that have come from Canmore since that time is a clear indication of the legacy the Olympics can leave. I'd ask any of the three of you who would like to, to comment on that.

Obviously, we've seen greater success in our Winter Olympics in the last little while. Certainly, Vancouver was an amazing accomplishment of our athletes, although we may have gone through a period of time in the nineties when some of the results weren't as much as we had hoped for. As a government, we've invested a lot in sport. The WinSport facility in Calgary is one of those examples. It's an amazing facility. I wonder how much of that greater accomplishment we saw in Vancouver and which I'm sure we'll see next year in Sochi is based on some of those legacies that you're responsible for, Mr. Heck, with WinSport, and how much of it is based on some of the greater investment there has been in sport in recent years. Is it a combination or is there some other factor you might want to point to that has led to some of that greater success we've seen?

I'd ask for any comments on that from any of you.

[Dale Henwood]

I'll start and say that the facilities absolutely from 1988 have really been a catalyst to a lot of things that are going on. Once you have the facilities, then I think you're able to bring in the people, meaning the science and medicine personnel, and attract the athletes and coaches from across the country to use those facilities.

There's a whole gamut of things that are critically important, and we need to invest in all of them. As a country, we are very successful. We got medals, and that's a pretty good level of excellence, in 10 summer sports and in 10 winter sports. That's excellence in a wide array of summer and winter sports. Certainly in our part of the country, and with Sochi right in front of us, we are focused on the winter side. We also do a tremendous job on the summer side, I think, for the size of the country and population we have and who we compete against.

Yes, I would certainly say the real impetus has been the legacy of the facilities from 1988.

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Wild Rose, AB]

Is there any comment that either of the other two gentlemen wanted to make on that?

[Barry Heck]

Yes. I would echo Mr. Henwood's comments. I think it clearly is a combination. With the completion of our new facility, the Markin MacPhail Centre, which is absolutely state of the art, we are spending a lot of time understanding how we are going to become world leading.

The bricks and mortar are extremely important. We have the bricks and mortar, but as Dr. Norris referred to earlier, it is really now what we do with them. It's what goes on inside. Our challenge will continue to be how we keep those facilities world class. We're not done building. We have a bobsleigh track that needs to be refurbished and refreshed. It's 25 years old. It's still very good, but it's near its end of life. We need a new indoor aerial training facility that we can use year round. We have lots more projects on the books that we're going to have to find a way to finance and fund. It is a combination of both of those to keep us world leading.

We're in a bit of a holiday now in the sense that we have this new $200-million facility, so we don't have to repair it yet, but come very soon we know that we're going to have to invest significant dollars in keeping the facility world class. It's going to be a challenge for us, and it's very important.