Evidence of meeting #31 for Canadian Heritage in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was crtc.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:35 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
You feel that people who use Netflix are not watching other products. However, you just have to think of Unité 9 and La galère. Other channels are available on Netflix.
11:35 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
I find it curious that everyone is promoting a foreign service when we have Canadian services in Canada.
11:35 a.m.
NDP
11:35 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
We have Canadian services, like Illico and Tou.tv. Tou.tv was the first streaming service in Canada, but that has never been promoted.
11:35 a.m.
NDP
Pierre Nantel NDP Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC
Current conditions did not allow Shomi to have a viable business model. As proof of that, the service has just shut down.
11:35 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
It is a business decision, but we still have other services. In the francophone market, Vidéotron might be of interest to you. Illico is in that market and provides a service. So we can say that there is a supply of Canadian French in the Quebec market.
11:35 a.m.
NDP
11:35 a.m.
Liberal
11:35 a.m.
Liberal
Seamus O'Regan Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
Thank you, Monsieur Blais, for appearing. Ms. Dabrusin and I get into arguments over who represents the most artistic constituency. I can say the A1C and A1E postal codes that I represent have more artists per capita than any other part of the country. I'm very proud of that. We have movies like The Shipping News that are made there, and the Republic of Doyle, which is seen in 96 countries. We have Frontier coming up, debuting in a couple of weeks, which is the gripping tale of the struggle for power in the 18th-century Canadian fur trade. It looks fantastic. I know it's a hell of a premise, but it looks fantastic.
When we were elected, we were elected to promote Canadian culture, Canadian voices, Canadian talent, and right now we are in the middle of an unprecedented cultural review. I want to come back to the point that Ms. Dabrusin made about the six out of 10, reducing the number of points. Basically, for people who are watching who are unfamiliar with this, it's what a production needs to count as a Canadian production in order to avail itself of public funding.
Let me be more direct.
11:40 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
Okay.
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Seamus O'Regan Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
It's been reduced to six out of 10.
When you spoke about Orphan Black earlier, you said that it's nine out of 10 and sometimes only eight out of 10. I fail to see how lowering it is better. Six out 10 was a D grade when I went to St. Bon's school in St. John's. It was barely a pass. Who thought that was a good idea, and what was the argument, in as succinct a way as you can make it, that this was good for Canadian voices and Canadian culture?
11:40 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
I'll try to explain it again. In the last opportunity the question was very long, so it probably cut out the point of my being able to explain it.
Six out of 10 in the CRTC world has been the standard for what is Canadian since 1984. That has not changed. The Canadian Audio-Visual Certification Office, which has certified content for the tax credit since 1995, has used six out of 10 as the norm to define what is a Canadian production.
There are a few exceptions for matters done under an official co-production treaty, for co-ventures, and for animation, but here we're talking about live action. It has always been six out of 10, plus the two 75% rules, and the requirement that the producer—the directing mind behind the production—also be Canadian.
Outside of what is recognized as Canadian, there are numerous funding mechanisms that say that if you are at a higher level or at that level, we will also provide production financing of one sort or another. There are a bunch of independent production funds that have been created. They represent about 1.6%, of the funding. They have always been described as being the “innovative edge” of what they're doing, because the Canada Media Fund usually requires 10 out of 10, and it's funding most of the productions in this country that you probably see in prime time from Canadian broadcasters.
The independent funds were quite pleased to have this added flexibility, because the documentary makers could not sometimes make it in a 10 out of 10 world. The 10 out of 10 still exists. They'll still be financing the Orphan Blacks of the world, because that's the only way they'll be able to get to the CMF.
It is a complicated ecosystem. Anybody who is telling you that we have reduced to six out of 10 from 10 out of 10 is misleading you, because what is recognized as Canadian was, is, and continues to be six out of 10. The issue here is accessibility to additional funding given by either taxpayers or subscribers.
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Seamus O'Regan Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
If there is one thing you learn on this committee, it is that it's all about the money, so if the reduction in points means that—
11:40 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
There are productions that are made—
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Seamus O'Regan Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
—those productions that have less Canadian content, or less Canadian contribution, can avail themselves of the same funds as productions that have more of a Canadian voice and more of a Canadian contribution, then that seems to be the issue to me.
I realize it's complicated, but I do my level best here.
11:40 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
What can happen is that a producer who has a very innovative project that won't be able to qualify as a 10 out of 10 for the Canada Media Fund, which represents a much more important portion of the funding than the 1% for all the independent funds—let's say they can't qualify for that—gets another door to knock on to produce the project, because they're a six out of 10, a seven out of 10, or whatever.
That makes for a richer ecosystem, because one fit cannot suit everything from a lifestyle show to a high-end historical drama, and one that you mentioned, which probably needs international sales to make it happen.
11:40 a.m.
Liberal
Seamus O'Regan Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
Which it will, if they have Jason Momoa, who is a huge American star. He is Aquaman. He's fronting it, he's coming back for season two, and Republic of Doyle is in 96 countries. The system of discoverability, which is the ability to have a Canadian voice on a myriad of digital channels around the world, is obviously something you know full well. Australia, Denmark, the U.K., and everybody is looking at this and finding more and more pointedly unique Canadian stories that will stick out in a global marketplace.
Rather than our trying to fix it in regulation, it seems to me that productions like Frontier, Republic of Doyle, and Orphan Black are being innovative in themselves, in the current framework.
11:45 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
Right.
11:45 a.m.
Liberal
Seamus O'Regan Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
I don't understand why we have to change that framework when we do have success stories that are beating it in the world, and I don't understand why you had to do it now when the minister and the department are in the middle of this comprehensive review. I don't understand why it had to be done now.
11:45 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
As parliamentarians, you should know that the Broadcasting Act guarantees, codifies, and ensures the independence of the CRTC as a quasi-judicial body. This gives more power for the minister to engage in this review. The act that this House, this place, has adopted provides a way for the minister to speak to the commissioner. It's a formal, distant relationship. There are ways for the minister, if she chooses, and her cabinet colleagues to send us requests.
11:45 a.m.
Liberal
11:45 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
Sorry?
11:45 a.m.
Liberal
Seamus O'Regan Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL
Surely you can share the reason for urgency.
11:45 a.m.
Chairperson and Chief Executive Officer, Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission
We started this in 2013 with Let's Talk TV. This is nothing new. We said in Decisions 2015 that we would be doing this. There is no news here. I know people are spinning it as news, but we said we would be doing this in 2015. In fact, I looked quite carefully in the last election. Nobody commented on it.
