Evidence of meeting #47 for Canadian Heritage in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was veterans.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Conservative
Kevin Waugh Conservative Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
What is really the impact for federal employees? I'm going to give you an example. I was at CTV, the national broadcaster. We all had it in our agreement at one time that we were going to get November 11 as a holiday. Over time, CTV decided that it wasn't a holiday, so everybody works on November 11.
Conservative
Kevin Waugh Conservative Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK
I'm looking at you. You were in Toronto, the centre of the universe, when this decision was made.
Anyway, I'm just going to tell you that with federal agreements now, this could be a bargaining chip with federal employees. Is it a national holiday? You're saying that it's a legal holiday. Canada Day is, Victoria Day is, and you're saying that Remembrance Day is, yet “I don't have it in my collective agreement”. You can see where this is a wedge with federal employees.
If I'm a broadcaster, I'm regulated by the CRTC. We lost that right. Now you're telling me that I have to go back to try to get it to be on the same level as Canada Day and Victoria Day, which in most provinces and territories, if not all, are legal holidays.
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
On the last point, Victoria Day is not a statutory holiday in four provinces, even though in federal law it's called a “legal holiday”. There can be differences. That's exactly the point. This can change only the federal statute. My understanding is that this has no impact on collective agreements, collective rights, and that it's not a legal issue with regard to changing the language. This is simply adding consistency to the language, which is why I suggest that it may be correct to argue that it's a symbolic change, but it's already in the act, right?
Remembrance Day, let's not forget, is already in the Holidays Act. This is about adding the word “legal”. Many people say that it was an oversight in the original drafting of the bill and that it should have been in the Holidays Act to begin with, so we're just correcting a past error. As to whether somebody can use that as a bargaining chip at some future negotiation, I suppose that's possible, but I don't think that should deter us from doing the right thing.
Conservative
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
That's a fair question. I think, though, that what it does is fix a past wrong with regard to the language, and that has to be done by another bill. It has to be done by another act, which is what this is doing.
You're right. As for raising the status of Remembrance Day to encourage people to honour this important day, that could have been done by a motion but it wouldn't have tidied up the language, which I'm trying to do at the same time.
Conservative
Kevin Waugh Conservative Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK
Yes.
Are you pitting provinces against one another?
Conservative
Kevin Waugh Conservative Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK
Four or five already don't.... Well, two don't call it a holiday right now: Quebec and Ontario.
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
It's a fair question. What I would say is that it's up to each province or each jurisdiction, each province and territory, to determine for itself what days are statutory holidays and how they mark the solemn occasion of Remembrance Day. That's up to them and their elected officials. In no way am I trying to encroach on that. If this has some impact on causing people to think about asking questions about how we can increase attendance at Remembrance Day ceremonies, I'd be okay with that, but that would be totally incidental to this bill and what it aims to achieve.
Conservative
Kevin Waugh Conservative Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK
I think you know where I'm coming from. If at CTV, for example, they were where we used to be, which was coast to coast.... Let's say Nova Scotia has it, Ontario doesn't, and Quebec doesn't. All of a sudden people are comparing holidays, right? They're saying, “In Ontario you get six a year, and in Saskatchewan you get seven, so I'm out one day.” That's where I think this is going to go down the road, and then all of a sudden they're finger-pointing and asking questions about how much this would cost. For businesses, we know that it has changed dramatically coast to coast. For November 11, you have to pay benefits, usually.
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
Again, it's up to each province to determine for itself how it marks the very important, solemn day of remembrance. Manitoba does it differently from Nova Scotia, and they do it differently from Alberta, but they each in their own fashion have come up with a way to do it. Ontario used to have this as a statutory holiday and decided in their legislature to change that.
Some people think that was the wrong decision. It's not for me to say or to opine about. All I can do is say that we have federal legislation before us that has inconsistent language with regard to Remembrance Day. We can fix that and that's what I'm seeking to do.
Conservative
The Vice-Chair Conservative Larry Maguire
Thank you.
We'll move over now to Mr. Vandal for five minutes.
Liberal
Dan Vandal Liberal Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB
Thank you very much.
Thank you, Mr. Fraser. It sounds very clear to me.
First of all, I am learning something. I was under the impression that Remembrance Day was a national holiday to begin with. It has been in Manitoba for as long as I can remember. It's a very cherished day to share with the Legions and the schools and the churches.
Your bill essentially adds consistency to the legal definition of “holiday”, and it adds significance or status to Remembrance Day. That's what it does, essentially.
With regard to your proposed subsection 3(2), which was deleted, was it your original intention, when you crafted it, to make it an actual holiday? I'm just asking for my own information.
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
Proposed subsection 3(2) is still in there. I'm suggesting that either you agree to vote it down in clause-by-clause or I'll prepare a draft amendment for you to consider. It has to do with whether or not you put it to the Monday for the holiday, which is wrong. It should just be on November 11.
Again, that wouldn't have had any effect with regard to changing the day in each province. That would only be federally legislated.
Liberal
Dan Vandal Liberal Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB
Your recommendation is that we remove that during committee.
Liberal
Dan Vandal Liberal Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB
Do you have any recommendation in terms of adding to it in order to make it better?
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
No. I think November 11 is on the 11th. It should always be marked on the 11th at 11 o'clock, and—
Liberal
Dan Vandal Liberal Saint Boniface—Saint Vital, MB
We don't have a lot of time, so I'll pass it over to Mr. Schiefke.
Liberal
Peter Schiefke Liberal Vaudreuil—Soulanges, QC
Thank you for allowing me some time to ask a question.
First of all, Mr. Fraser, I want to say thank you for all the effort you've put into drafting this bill. The passion that you have for this issue is evident in the way you've answered the questions thus far, so thank you very much.
Speaking as someone from Quebec, I'm wondering how this bill would in any way affect the way in which Quebeckers celebrate or commemorate Remembrance Day. Would this bill in any way move or work toward Quebec becoming one of the provinces that adopt a national holiday, if you will?
Liberal
Colin Fraser Liberal West Nova, NS
What it would do, as we've already done with this bill so far, is shine a light on the importance of Remembrance Day—having a discussion in Parliament about what Remembrance Day means, making the language consistent in the federal law, and if it passes, having Parliament affirm, and members of Parliament from Quebec affirm, the importance of Remembrance Day to them and to their constituents.
That may have an impact, sparking conversations in provinces like Quebec, which don't already have it as a statutory holiday—conversations such as, “Are we honouring that day appropriately? Are we giving due respect to the veterans and the fallen?” That's a perfectly legitimate debate.
This bill doesn't do that for Quebec, however. It's up to each province to decide for itself.
