Canadian Heritage Committee on Nov. 30th, 2023

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

We are ready to begin.

We have two new members of Canadian Heritage here. If I could find their names, that would be great. They are David Dendooven, assistant deputy minister, strategic policy, planning and corporate affairs; and Joëlle Montminy, senior assistant deputy minister, cultural affairs.

Thank you for joining us, and thank you to the other two officials for staying all of this time.

We will begin again the questions and answers. We will start with the Conservatives.

Kevin Waugh, you have five minutes, please.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Welcome, again, to the officials.

I just recently toured the RCMP museum in Regina. This government wants to move the RCMP Depot out of Saskatchewan, out of Regina. That will be a battle that the Conservatives will always fight. Regina deserves the Depot. Regina deserves the museum.

The museum—with this Liberal government, I don't have to tell you—is struggling. The mandate letter from 2019 says, “We're with you.” Budget 2021 says, “We're going to give you some funding.” It wants to become a national museum, as you well know, but it is seeing no action from this government. It sees the precinct museums gobble up all the money: the one in Halifax and the one in Winnipeg. We're hoping that the one in Regina can come through some day and actually have some resources to be a national museum.

Where is this in today's pecking order with the department? Is the RCMP museum in Regina going to get national status?

[Isabelle Mondou]

You're right. There has been a commitment by the government to install a museum of the RCMP in Saskatchewan, in Regina. There has been quite a lot of work done with the administration. I have to say that it's an amazing administration, which has done consultations to really work at becoming a national museum. We have resources in the department to assist in that work. We have worked closely with them. They are at the point now where—you're right—they need further investment to become a national museum.

I have to say that I receive letters almost every day from constituents who are supporting the next step. I think it's a good question that you can raise with the people who are making the decisions in the next budget.

Thank you.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

Who makes that decision?

[Isabelle Mondou]

I will say that it's the government.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

We often talk about truth and reconciliation. I mean, this is where it should start: right at the RCMP, the museum, the Depot. To be blown off for five years.... This government started this conversation in 2019. We're already heading to 2024. I met with the executive of the museum. They are frustrated, and they want answers. I think they deserve answers.

Ms. Mondou, what do you think they should do?

[Isabelle Mondou]

I wouldn't say that there has been no work during the last five years. Actually, we have worked very closely with them, doing some of the work you are talking about. They have gone out there. They have worked with the community to better understand what the community needs, including on the reconciliation file. I have to say that they have done tremendous work in collaboration with us. We have been working for the last couple of years on moving further on the national museum. We have great collaboration there.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

How close are we?

[Isabelle Mondou]

I think we are ready to move to the next step, which is really defining what the museum is going to look like and what budget is going to be needed. For that reason, I think it's a good conversation to have in the context of the next budget.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

The minister was here and talked about indigenous voices being at the table when, in fact, Google's $100-million donation is going to hit the tracks this June. I have a number of reserves in Saskatchewan that want to start their own radio stations. I think you're aware of that. Where do they fit in?

All that I have right now is Missinipi in La Ronge. I can tell you three or four other reserves in my province that want to have their own communications networks.

I didn't get a chance to ask the minister, but it's interesting that indigenous and northern voices will be at the table. What do I tell my three or four reserves in Saskatchewan that want to start their own networks? Where does this leave them today?

[Isabelle Mondou]

Madam Chair, I have two answers to that.

The first one on Bill C-18 is that, as the minister said, indigenous newspapers, print and radio will be included, and they will be at the table. They have already engaged.

The point you've raised is very important. They're trying to make sure that everybody in Canada knows about it and that no small community is forgotten. The outreach is going to be very important, and there will be a call when the legislation comes into force to make sure that people can raise their hands.

I also want to mention another program to you. We have in Canadian Heritage a broadcasting program for the north. If you want to put me in contact with those organizations, I will be happy to follow up with them.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

I think what's happened here is that their voices have not been heard. I have seen this with newcomers coming to this country, and I've seen this with indigenous voices not being heard in traditional media. They want to have their own network now. They want to start this. They're concerned that they're going to be left out of this. I'm just relaying the message that I'm receiving from four or five reserves in my province.

[Isabelle Mondou]

I think it's a very important message. They should not be forgotten.

You may know that in the department one of the things we've founded is the Indigenous Screen Office. It is giving indigenous people the capacity to do, under their own sovereignty, movies and productions of their own. I think you're raising a very important point, and I think Bill C-18 is putting the rules in place to make sure their voices are not forgotten.

[Kevin Waugh, Conservative, Saskatoon—Grasswood, SK]

I think that's time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you, Kevin.

We're going to the Liberals, with Mr. Taleeb Noormohamed for five minutes.

[Taleeb Noormohamed, Liberal, Vancouver Granville, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to our witnesses for being here with us today, in particular Ms. Mondou, who was a colleague of mine at the Privy Council Office almost 20 years ago. It's good to see her in this role.

We've heard a lot today from the minister.

We heard from the minister yesterday about the importance and the value of the agreement with Google. One of the things I was wondering about—and if you could talk a bit about—is a comment the minister made yesterday about the notion that, if there is a better deal somewhere else in the world, Canada reserves the right to reopen and move towards that.

For the benefit of those of us in this room who may not have heard the whole statement and have more information, could you walk us through what that actually means?

[Isabelle Mondou]

Yes. Thank you.

Basically, the concept is drawn a bit from international law, where we have the most favoured nation clause.

The idea is that this negotiation will continue across the world, and Canada wants to be able to reopen the regulation if we find out that Google does a better deal in another country. That's very much the same principle that we use in international law. It's applied in that context.

We'll keep following the file. We'll keep attuned to what's going in the world. We have committed to reopen the negotiation and basically the regulation if needed.

[Taleeb Noormohamed, Liberal, Vancouver Granville, BC]

I want to go back to a very important question that Mr. Shields asked earlier of the minister.

The $100 million is cash on the table from Google, and it's indexed. Is that correct?

[Isabelle Mondou]

That's correct.

[Taleeb Noormohamed, Liberal, Vancouver Granville, BC]

That's annual...?

[Isabelle Mondou]

It's CPI indexation. It's what we normally use in any legislation.

[Taleeb Noormohamed, Liberal, Vancouver Granville, BC]

Good, and then on top of that, the minister also mentioned that there were other services that Google was providing. Can you talk a bit about that, but for avoidance of doubt, can you also confirm that the value of that is outside the $100 million that was in cash on the table?

[Isabelle Mondou]

Effectively, the $100 million in cash, annually indexed, is a given, and it's all in cash. There is nothing that will prevent Google from entering into other deals that are non-monetary, as they do now. They provide all kinds of services, training, conferences, etc. It is valued by the sector. They will be able to do that on top of the cash value of the money that is in the regulation.

[Taleeb Noormohamed, Liberal, Vancouver Granville, BC]

Thank you.

I want to switch gears a bit. We've heard a lot about the CBC in this committee, as you know. Can you talk a bit about the way in which the CBC contributes to providing information and news to rural and northern communities, where they may not have as much access, and what that means in terms of ensuring Canadians have access to good-quality information?

[Isabelle Mondou]

I will start, and then will ask if my colleague wants to add something. Essentially, Radio-Canada and CBC have a presence in the north. This has been a long-standing commitment of theirs. I should mention too that they're going to launch the.... They have announced their indigenous strategy too, which has been developed very much in the spirit of working in the north and working with indigenous communities.

In addition to that, they are present in local communities. I think that, when the chair of the CRTC came here, she mentioned some localities in which they have added journalists recently. They found out that there was not a lot of media left on the ground, so they are trying to really be present where there are not a lot of journalists to serve the public.

I don't know if my colleague wants to add something.