Canadian Heritage Committee on May 9th, 2024

[Rachael Thomas, Conservative, Lethbridge, AB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I was stating that we have a whole host of witnesses who are here. They've come to speak to Bill C-316.

The motion that is on the floor, brought forward by the Liberal members, is something that can be debated at any point in time. It's common that a motion can be brought forward when we have witnesses here, but most often a courtesy is granted, and the motion is moved toward the end of the committee meeting in order to respect the time of our witnesses.

I do wonder if Mrs. Romanado would agree to, perhaps, in a friendly way, withdraw the motion. She could then move it within a matter of time, when it comes back around for the Liberals' question period. It would give the opportunity for the motion to still be moved, but it would also give us the opportunity to respect the time of our witnesses.

In a friendly way, I'll propose that to Mrs. Romanado, but I would just remind the chair that I do still have the floor, and if she's not amenable to this friendly suggestion, I still wish to speak.

[Sherry Romanado, Liberal, Longueuil—Charles-LeMoyne, QC]

I think we could probably deal with this quite quickly.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you, Mrs. Romanado.

She did have the floor. It had been sent to everyone on May 2, I think. There was enough notice of this motion coming forward. It being tabled right now means we have to discuss it. If Mrs. Romanado does not want to move it forward, you continue to have the floor, Mrs. Thomas, to speak for or against the motion.

[Rachael Thomas, Conservative, Lethbridge, AB]

Thank you.

I would move a motion that we adjourn this debate, and we continue to hear from our witnesses today.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Does everyone feel we should have a recorded vote on this?

[Rachael Thomas, Conservative, Lethbridge, AB]

Yes, I would like a recorded vote.

(Motion negatived: nays 7; yeas 4)

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

The debate continues.

Mrs. Thomas, I'm going to move to the next speaker unless you want to continue.

[Rachael Thomas, Conservative, Lethbridge, AB]

Thank you, Chair, for checking in with me. I appreciate that. That's very kind.

I am good to cede the floor for now.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you.

I will now go to Mr. Lawrence.

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

Thank you very much.

I am disappointed. It was really only through the courtesy of my colleague Mr. Champoux that the Liberals even had the ability, because otherwise they would have blown through the time. It's unfortunate that courtesy was taken advantage of.

To move a motion that is clearly partisan in nature when it's meant to obstruct our study is strange, because it's led by a Liberal member.

I thought we were having a constructive conversation. I thought there was some excellent witness testimony from all witnesses—from Liberal, NDP and Conservative witnesses. I would very much have liked to go forward.

I know Mr. Serré has been waiting patiently to get his legislation through. I have a lot of respect for the member. It's disappointing that they've decided to obstruct their own legislation.

We will be reviewing and providing more in-depth feedback with respect to this motion. I think it's fair to say that it requires some changes to take some of the partisan bite out of it and to move it to an area that is important.

Of course, all parliamentarians want to make sure that we protect all people and that everyone feels safe, regardless of their gender, sexual orientation, race, culture or ethnicity. I believe that all 338 parliamentarians have it in their hearts to make sure that everyone gets an opportunity— whether they're born in Alderville First Nation, downtown Toronto or downtown Vancouver, and regardless of who they love—to be treated with the respect and dignity that all people deserve.

I know from earlier that Mr. Coteau has spent some of his life fighting racism, which I think is brilliant. I appreciate his service.

I think this is a very serious issue. I'm disappointed by the partisan tone of the motion. I think we could all work together to fight racism and to fight discrimination in all forms.

There is just one area that is missing. You could perhaps put it under religious minorities. I would specifically like to see anti-Semitism called out, which we don't have in this.

I'll actually bring back and just discuss a motion that the Conservatives brought forward, which unfortunately was stonewalled by the Liberals. I would just like to read into the record—

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Mr. Lawrence, we are now debating a specific motion on the floor. You cannot read another motion right now to discuss it.

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

I can read it for context. I'm not moving it. I'm not giving notice of it. It's just for context. It's no different from reading a piece of Hansard or something.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

All right then, continue.

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

Conservatives brought the following motion:

Given that,

according to a National Post article published on April 17, a York University faculty committee has presented a list of anti-Semitic recommendations that include labelling the support of Israel as “anti-Palestinian racism”; classifying anyone who supports Israel as “anti-Palestinian, Islamophobic, and anti-Arab”; granting academic freedom and free speech to pro-Palestinian students, while revoking these same rights from Jewish students and anyone supportive of Israel; and identifying Zionism as “a settler colonial project and ethno-religious ideology” that should be isolated and destroyed, and that

the Government of Canada has committed to the Canada anti-racism strategy, and that

the Minister of Canadian Heritage is responsible for “fostering and promoting Canadian identity and values, cultural development, and heritage,” and

the 2024 Canadian universities anti-Semitism report highlights—

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Mr. Lawrence, I don't know if this is a filibuster or not, but this has nothing to do with the motion on the table. I'm sorry.

The motion on the table is to study far-right extremism and the role it plays in misinformation and disinformation.

I would like to ask you to stick to the motion, please.

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

I am.

Part of it says, and this is the part that I'll relate back, “and harassment towards journalists, women, indigenous peoples, Black and racialized communities, members of the 2SLGBTQI+ community and religious minorities”.

I'm hoping that religious minorities, on harassment, would include anti-Semitism. I certainly hope that's the truth.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I would hazard a guess.

I'd ask Ms. Romanado to explain, but I would suggest that religious minorities would mean all of the religions in Canada.

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

Right. That's why I want to talk about the importance of fighting anti-Semitism in Canada. That brings me back to the motion that was unfortunately stonewalled by the Liberal Party. It is:

the committee unequivocally condemn the anti-Semitic conduct of this faculty committee at York University and report this to the House.

As a practice, I never try to impugn the intentions of other members. I believe we are all honourable, all 338 of us, and I believe that we all want to fight the scourge of racism and anti-Semitism. Just to show that clearly this motion needs to be amended to include the fight against anti-Semitism, I'm going to ascribe that to an oversight although I will express my disappointment on behalf of the Jewish community. I certainly heard from them about the failure of this committee because of Liberal stonewalling to pass a motion clearly calling out anti-Semitism, and it would be an absolute travesty if we were to do that twice.

The Jewish community is under incredible pressure regardless of what's going on in Israel or Gaza. I have talked to many parliamentarians, and I've talked to many people in the Jewish community who don't feel safe. They feel like they are under pressure.

I have to tip my hat to Anthony Housefather, a Liberal MP, just to show you that I'm non-partisan, in his calling out of the City of Ottawa for their refusal to celebrate Israel because they couldn't guarantee safety. I think Anthony Housefather is 110% right when he said that it is the obligation of our country, and it is the obligation of all of our police forces, to protect our individuals at any—

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

A point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Mr. Champoux.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Madam Chair, I feel like Mr. Lawrence is talking about a subject that falls more within the purview of the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National Security than the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage.

I'm not opposed to what he's saying, on the contrary, but I think we should get back to the subject of the motion at hand. If we want to get back to our witnesses and the topic of the day, perhaps we could stick to the content of the motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you.

Mr. Lawrence.

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

I have a great deal of respect for my colleague, and I understand his point of view.

I want to apologize. I'll extend my apologies to my friend.

This contemplates the harassment of religious minorities. I think it's important to specifically call out anti-Semitism. If there is not a mention of it—I thought I saw it, but maybe I did not—there should also be a specific call for the protection against Islamophobia as well.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Are you going to propose an amendment, Mr. Lawrence?

[Philip Lawrence, Conservative, Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON]

I'm going to discuss it. I do have a wide latitude and those are the rules—