Evidence of meeting #131 for Canadian Heritage in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was hate.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Bloc
Martin Champoux Bloc Drummond, QC
I find it hard to understand why there is still reluctance to quickly implement a measure or to intervene, so as to set an example, at the very least, for those who might be tempted to follow suit.
Liberal
Kamal Khera Liberal Brampton West, ON
I know there's a law in place; we have these parameters in place. It is up to the jurisdictions. I know they're very much engaged, particularly in an event that happened on Wednesday, including in Montreal. We hope that the local law enforcement agencies will be doing their job to make sure that those who incite hate in this country are held accountable.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry
Thank you very much.
I now go to the New Democratic Party and Niki Ashton.
Ms. Ashton, you have six minutes.
Niki Ashton NDP Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB
Thank you.
Welcome, Minister.
In the foreword of the current anti-racism strategy you said:
...since the events of October 7, 2023, we have seen unprecedented levels of hate towards Jewish, Muslim, Arab, and Palestinian communities right here in Canada.
This is unquestionably true. Since then, we've seen a worrying explosion of hate and anger directed at members of these communities. The reality is that no Jewish family should worry about the safety of their kids when they drop them off at Hebrew school. No Muslim should fear violence as they walk into a mosque. We have a responsibility as legislators to do everything in our power to protect communities from hate. This is why I don't understand why your Liberal government steadfastly refused to define anti-Palestinian racism. You acknowledge that it's a problem, and the strategy explicitly recognizes Palestinians as a group that faces a unique form of racism. You acknowledge that work needs to be done, but for some reason you refuse to actually do that work. You refuse to consult with community members on the topic. Their voices were silenced.
This can't come as a surprise. Thousands of Canadians wrote to you, calling on you to define anti-Palestinian racism. I've raised this repeatedly with officials in your office, and we've also raised it here at committee. I would argue that ignoring these calls is, frankly, a clear and explicit example of systemic anti-Palestinian racism. You've refused to give a clear reason for why you refuse to define anti-Palestinian racism.
My question is this: Did you intentionally leave out anti-Palestinian racism from your Liberal anti-racism strategy, yes or no?
Liberal
Kamal Khera Liberal Brampton West, ON
I want to be very clear to all Canadians that this strategy is designed to support all Canadians who experience discrimination and racism, including Palestinian Canadians. That is very clear in the strategy.
I think it's also important to recognize the fact that this strategy is meant to be evergreen. We never had a strategy. We put it forward in 2017, alongside community members, because we knew we needed to do this work. We then extensively met with community members across this country to talk about what more we can do to support communities. This came out of the two summits that our government held on combatting anti-Semitism and, of course, Islamophobia. We are obviously going to continue to listen to Canadians from all different backgrounds because we need to make sure that this is a policy that all Canadians can see themselves in. This is meant for every Canadian, including Palestinian Canadians.
NDP
Niki Ashton NDP Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB
With all due respect, the actual substance of the anti-racism strategy does not actually call out anti-Palestinian racism.
I want to go back to that question of consultation and definition.
Given the fact that you refuse to define anti-Palestinian racism, I thought it would be appropriate to read into the record the definition provided by the Arab Canadian Lawyers Association.
Anti-Palestinian racism takes various forms including: denying the Nakba and justifying violence against Palestinians; failing to acknowledge Palestinians as an Indigenous people with a collective identity, belonging and rights in relation to occupied and historic Palestine; erasing the human rights and equal dignity and worth of Palestinians; excluding or pressuring others to exclude Palestinian perspectives, Palestinians and their allies; defaming Palestinians and their allies with slander such as being inherently antisemitic, a terrorist threat/sympathizer or opposed to democratic values.
Why do you take issue with the Arab Canadian Lawyers Association's definition of anti-Palestinian racism? Why wasn't their voice and their work—which is cutting edge on this front—included as part of your anti-racism strategy?
Liberal
Kamal Khera Liberal Brampton West, ON
We are going to continue to listen to all Canadians. This strategy is designed to support all Canadians who face racism and discrimination, including Palestinian Canadians. Those words are exactly in the strategy.
I also want to take a moment to recognize the fact that this is meant to be evergreen. This is meant to evolve with the needs of the communities. We're constantly going to be listening to communities to make sure that their voices are included and to ensure that we are at the forefront of leading this work. We continue to have very meaningful conversations, and it's not just me. My predecessor had many conversations prior to my taking on this role. This is work that takes time. This is work in which we need to make sure that we are pragmatic and that we're thoughtful in the conversations that we have with people. Everyone can see in the strategy that they're reflected in it.
Thank you.
NDP
Niki Ashton NDP Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB
I'll outline that it's not evergreen to exclude substantive action on anti-Palestinian racism. This is a very clear type of racism. It's very disappointing to see the Liberals exclude it from the anti-racism strategy but continue to play games with Palestinian and Arab communities, trying to score points by doing consultations that are not actually part of the department's work or influencing your anti-racism strategy.
I'll move on to another critical issue, which is anti-indigenous racism. We know that an insidious form of anti-indigenous racism is residential school denialism.
NDP
Niki Ashton NDP Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB
I'm proud of the work that my colleague MP Leah Gazan has done on this front with her bill, but we know that neither your party, the Liberals, nor the Conservatives have come out with a clear position on this bill.
From the Conservatives, we've heard some very problematic statements, including from at least one candidate, Aaron Gunn, who thinks the only injustice of the residential school system isn't the genocide but what's said about John A. Macdonald—an absolutely horrifying example of anti-indigenous racism.
Do you support my colleague Leah Gazan's bill—yes or no?
Liberal
Kamal Khera Liberal Brampton West, ON
Madam Chair, I think we can all agree in this place that the tragic—
Liberal
Kamal Khera Liberal Brampton West, ON
Madam Chair, as we all know, and it's in the strategy as well, anti-indigenous racism has plagued our system systematically for generations. We as a government have been doing everything we can to support communities on the ground. There's the work that my colleagues Minister Anandasangaree and Minister Patty Hajdu have been leading. We know the impact of that on the ground.
It's unfortunate that the member is playing political games with this. I think this is fundamentally something that we need to be working on together—
NDP
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry
Thank you. This is not a debate, Ms. Ashton.
I think the time is up.
We'll go now to the second round. This is a five-minute round.
We will begin with Mr. Jivani, please, for the Conservatives.
Conservative
Jamil Jivani Conservative Durham, ON
Thank you, Madam Chair.
The minister's colleague MP Anthony Housefather is actually on Twitter right now agreeing with the Conservative position that Samidoun should be listed as a terrorist entity. I wonder if the minister responsible for anti-racism would agree with her colleague Mr. Housefather and the Conservative Party on that position.
Liberal
Kamal Khera Liberal Brampton West, ON
Madam Chair, I'm not sure if my colleague was in the House during question period. This was a question that was posed to the Minister of Public Safety. I think he was very clear in his answer. Any indication or—
Conservative
Jamil Jivani Conservative Durham, ON
But his answer wasn't good enough for Mr. Housefather. I thought maybe the party's position had changed since then.
Liberal
Kamal Khera Liberal Brampton West, ON
Madam Chair, through you, I think we can all agree that any listing of a terrorist organization is not done by politicians. It's done on the advice of national security and intelligence. We take public safety extremely seriously. This is the work that our intelligence does on a daily basis with our Five Eyes partners.
The minister, as he mentioned in the House of Commons today—
Conservative
Jamil Jivani Conservative Durham, ON
I think the minister may want to meet with Mr. Housefather to discuss this, but okay—answer received.
Conservative
Jamil Jivani Conservative Durham, ON
It is customary that the witness has only as much time as the questioner.
Liberal
Kamal Khera Liberal Brampton West, ON
—I think it's important to get the answer on the record. I think it's important to get my answer on the record. Thank you.
As the Minister of Public Safety indicated, he has urgently asked for expedited advice from national security and intelligence. He'll have an answer in the next coming days.