Canadian Heritage Committee on Nov. 25th, 2024

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Ms. Tait, how many Canadians still depend on conventional television for the information they seek and to access culture? Do you have any figures on that?

[Catherine Tait]

That's a very important question.

In 2018, six years ago, roughly 29% of Canadians watched only linear television, while approximately 22% used digital services. In 2023, 11% of Canadians only watched linear television; now 32% use digital services.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Can we say that people who still rely on linear television don't do so necessarily by choice but rather, in many cases, because it's impossible for them to access digital content? I'm thinking of those who live in remote regions, for example.

[Catherine Tait]

Yes, absolutely. That's why we say we will never abandon those people.

I'd like to point out that more people in the francophone market still rely on linear television than in the anglophone market.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Yes, we love our good old TV in Quebec.

Do private broadcasters such as TVA and Bell have the same obligations as the public broadcaster regarding news coverage, particularly in the remote regions?

[Catherine Tait]

They have obligations toward the regions, of course, but they aren't as profound as ours. We have an obligation in the Great North of the country and in minority communities, among other regions.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Approximately how many tens of millions of dollars would it cost if, for example, a Conservative government made good on its foolish and crazy commitment to cut the CBC's funding and, at the same time, that of the SRC, while maintaining all the latter's services to preserve the broadcaster of French language and culture across Canada? I just want to show how ridiculous that proposal is.

[Catherine Tait]

It would be in the tens of millions of dollars. I mentioned the Great North, for example, where Radio‑Canada has very few journalists.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

It wouldn't be a major saving.

[Catherine Tait]

No.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

You can't say we could save $1 billion out of the $1.4 billion of public funding.

[Catherine Tait]

I would add that we also have certain contract-related financial obligations. For example, we have the broadcasting rights for the Olympic Games until 2032.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Do you agree that this is a ridiculous and very populist commitment?

[Catherine Tait]

Yes, absolutely.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

I gave you the answer. In good French, we call that “une passe sur la palette”.

Thank you, Ms. Tait.

Madam Chair, I can continue if you wish.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I've given you some leeway, Mr. Champoux, but you're fine.

We'll go to Ms. Ashton for two and a half minutes, please.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Thank you very much.

Ms. Tait, we have a problem. You yourself identified the momentum behind the “defund the CBC” movement. We've all acknowledged that this is core to the Conservatives' ideological attack, but it certainly rubbed Canadians the wrong way to see that the CBC was doling out $18 million in bonuses at the same time as so many Canadians were suffering. We know that a number of CBC employees have been laid off. Local broadcasting is not being invested in in the way it was.

Going back to your message to your successor, if you could change anything about your time at the CBC, would you have given up those bonuses to save the jobs of CBC employees?

[Catherine Tait]

As we have said many times—I say “we”, because the chairman of the board of directors has also underlined it—we have obligations to the unaffiliated and union employees at CBC/Radio-Canada. Those obligations are legal. You keep using the word “bonus”. Performance pay is part of a person's salary. It's part of our contracted obligation to them to honour that, so I would not change that decision. I think it was extremely wise of the board of directors to consider revisiting and looking at all the compensation to make sure, and to assure Canadians, that we are doing the right thing. Beyond that, I cannot say that we would change our position, because it was a legal obligation.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Ms. Tait, I think your answer is part of the problem here. The CBC belongs to Canadians. Without question, there are certain legal obligations, but one would also note that we are in exceptional times. The CBC's mere survival is at risk. Canadians want to see a public broadcaster that is accountable to them, not doling out executive bonuses while cutting jobs and failing to invest in local and regional broadcasting. I hope your successor will do a better job when it comes to ensuring that the CBC is not out of touch on that front.

We have asked, and the NDP has asked, for a banning of executive bonuses, making sure that CBC employees are kept on the job to ensure that local and regional broadcasting is able to be done the way Canadians deserve that it be done. The last thing we need is a CBC that is out of touch with Canadians.

I also want to question you about the importance of Radio‑Canada.

When the Leader of the Opposition speaks to the media in English, he often mentions his objective to defund the CBC, but he never mentions the SRC. He always refers solely to the CBC.

But his plan is clear: He wants to defund both. His Quebec members never speak in the same way as his other members. That's precisely how “the two solitudes” are expressed for the members of the Conservative Party. They say one thing in French and another in English.

Would you please describe how the efforts that the Conservative Party leader has made to attack the CBC and the SRC have affected your work?

[Catherine Tait]

The present situation is obviously very hard for CBC and SRC employees. They do their work in an atmosphere of uncertainty. Then there are all the financial pressures coming from outside. Our media industry is in crisis.

It goes without saying that people wonder what another government's approach would really be, but, for the moment, I always tell them to stay focused on the job and make the news credible and reliable for Canadians.

You must never forget that the CBC and SRC have been around for 90 years and that they have offered Canadians their services over all those decades.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Thank you, Ms. Tait.

We'll now go to Monsieur Berthold.

Luc, you have five minutes, please.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Good afternoon, Ms. Tait.

Do you acknowledge that there was no Internet 90 years ago and that the situation then was very different from what it is today? Constantly looking back over 90 years somewhat diverts us from the current issue.

Don't you also acknowledge that the parliamentarians who created the CBC absolutely have the right to decide its future?

[Catherine Tait]

What's the question?

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

Are the parliamentarians who established the CBC 90 years ago completely entitled to decide its future?

[Catherine Tait]

I referred to influence—