Evidence of meeting #74 for Canadian Heritage in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was safe.
A recording is available from Parliament.
11:50 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Coaching Association of Canada
Why is diversity important in safe sport?
11:50 a.m.
Liberal
Lisa Hepfner Liberal Hamilton Mountain, ON
Yes. Why is diversity key to safe sport? Why are those linked?
11:50 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Coaching Association of Canada
Historically, we've had all male coaches driving sport. That has caused risk and—I would suggest—cultural toxicity around having men driving sport across the board with no gender diversity, different thoughts or different voices, with the diverse nature of Canada. We had a one million increase in population last year in immigration. The bastion of white male coaches is no longer acceptable, quite honestly.
Safety comes with diversity of thought for men, for women, for LGBTQI2S+, for Canadians, for people in Canada and for indigenous peoples. It's needed.
11:50 a.m.
Liberal
Lisa Hepfner Liberal Hamilton Mountain, ON
Thank you.
Continuing with you, Ms. Lafrenière, you also mentioned in your opening statement—we've spoken about it a bit more—that a lot of parents can't afford sports for their kids. We also heard today that a lot of sports organizations aren't transparent with their funding.
Do you think there's a link there? Do you think that if organizations were forced to be more transparent with their funding, they would be under a lot of pressure to make sports more affordable for kids?
11:50 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Coaching Association of Canada
I think transparency is a cultural condition, and transparency across an organization is important as it relates to issues of complaints, abuse, harassment or financial wealth. I've really taken to heart listening to that need for transparency as an organization, as part of its culture and DNA.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
Lisa Hepfner Liberal Hamilton Mountain, ON
Ms. Bahen, would you comment on that as well? Might transparency in sporting organizations lead to greater equity among players?
11:55 a.m.
Managing Director, Charity Intelligence Canada
I don't know about the equity, but transparency is cultural. It's an attitude. It's a belief.
On top of transparency is accountability, and exactly what we've seen in this toxic culture is that they're not accountable to anybody. They're their own private club. What happens in the locker room stays in the locker room. This is unacceptable in 2023.
It's one small piece of it to be required, if you are a large sports organization, to be open with your books and to be open with your finances, rather than have that “it's nobody else's business what we do” attitude.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
Lisa Hepfner Liberal Hamilton Mountain, ON
Thank you.
We've also been speaking at this committee about this idea of possibly having a database, whereby sporting organizations could share with one another if somebody among them was facing allegations or had to leave the organization because of allegations.
What are your thoughts, first of all, Ms. Lafrenière, about the idea of a database? Do you think that would capture all of the problems?
11:55 a.m.
Chief Executive Officer, Coaching Association of Canada
It's an element. If we want to look at quality sport delivery, we have to consider it in its entirety, but a database is a critical step. It would mean things like Mr. Arsenault, who was a gymnastics coach in Montreal, when he had a safe sport complaint, wouldn't go and start up a new club in Edmonton to be brought back and abuse again.
My goal is for it to be established and for all provinces and territories to partner.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
Lisa Hepfner Liberal Hamilton Mountain, ON
Ms. Gassewitz, do you have thoughts on that, on the database and whether it would solve or do a lot to solve the problem of safe sport?
11:55 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Sport Information Resource Centre
I would agree with Lorraine. I believe it's an element, and I do think it would be a strong asset if we could be consistent in the sharing. If it opens up that facilitation and sharing of information, it would be a very constructive element and component of safe sport.
11:55 a.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry
Thank you very much.
Lisa, your time is up.
I am going to Mr. Lemire for two and a half minutes, please.
11:55 a.m.
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
Thank you, Madam Chair.
Ms. Gassewitz, in your testimony to the Standing Committee on the Status of Women, you said, “... we need to fund sustainable programs to promote safe sport at all levels of sport.”
I understand that you have signed an agreement with the OSIC and I would like to know how that works. Obviously, it is important to be transparent and demonstrate good governance with public money. What information do you provide to Sport Canada, and what is required of you when you join the OSIC? Do you think the office analyzes the data you submit? You had to pay a certain amount of money to join the OSIC and benefit from its services. How does this work? Does it affect a certain number of participants? Can you tell our committee what formula is used to arrive at the amount you have to pay to join the OSIC?
11:55 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Sport Information Resource Centre
I'm sorry, but I'm actually not sure which organization you're referring to. Did you say “BCIS”? I'm not sure what that is.
11:55 a.m.
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
It's the Office of the Sport Integrity Commissioner, the OSIC.
11:55 a.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Sport Information Resource Centre
Okay. It's OSIC. I'm sorry. Thank you.
Yes, you're right. It is a federally funded organization. We are all paying toward OSIC to make sure that, again, we're learning, we're accountable and we're all trying to move forward. This is that collective effort, with all embracing it to go forward to see how we can make sport safer. Yes, we are paying toward that.
I'm sorry. I got lost on what the second part of your question was.
11:55 a.m.
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
What is the calculation formula used? You must pay a certain amount to join the OSIC—let's say $5,000. That varies depending on the size of the organization. How does it work?
Noon
President and Chief Executive Officer, Sport Information Resource Centre
I can't speak to everybody's calculations, because I'm not a part of those. I can speak to ours on the SIRC side, in which case the base entry point was $5,000. The entry level was at $5,000, so that's what ours was assessed against.
Noon
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
I feel that, often, only frameworks are analyzed. In the Hockey Canada case, one of the things the minister had asked for was an audit. Obviously, this would never have enabled us to know whether there was a fund within a fund within a fund that was the equity fund. In short, we would never have been able to get to the bottom of what happened at Hockey Canada with the documents that this organization is required to provide.
Do you think more should be required in terms of data analysis from organizations like the OSIC or Sport Canada?
Noon
President and Chief Executive Officer, Sport Information Resource Centre
Being a strong advocate of research, I always think there's merit to being able to look at data and being able to evaluate and apply those learnings so that we can continue to learn more.
Noon
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry
Thank you very much.
Now I will go to Peter Julian.
Peter, you have two and a half minutes, please.
Noon
NDP
Peter Julian NDP New Westminster—Burnaby, BC
Thanks very much, Madam Chair.
I want to go back to Ms. Bahen about the issue of financial statements.
We had Canada Soccer here before the committee, and the point you made in your initial statement was bang on right. As we were speaking with Canada Soccer, we asked them about financial statements. They said they hadn't filed with Corporations Canada, as the law requires. Subsequent to that, to catch up on it, they did a week of filing going back nine years. Is it your impression that many national sports organizations are not following the basic issue of ensuring their financial statements are accessible and transparent?
My second question is related to the access of kids to programs across sports as they're growing up. Do you see a relationship between how we have these often non-transparent national sports organizations with a lot of money, while at the same time kids from underprivileged families are having more difficulty in accessing the sports programs that can make such a difference in their lives?
April 17th, 2023 / noon
Managing Director, Charity Intelligence Canada
If I may take this backwards, I'll go with the second part.
Yes, with the high cost of sports.... Not that the financial statements tell you everything, but one of the things they do tell you is how much hockey moms and dads have been gouged over the years with higher fees. That's what allows the surpluses and reserves to build up. Maybe it was provisioning for future law settlements or whatever, but that's where the $32 million over the years was coming from—and another $10 million, which was taken off Hockey Canada's books and put into its foundation. You could definitely see that the moms and dads who were registering their kids were paying far more than the actual costs.
That's a good area for questioning.
In terms of financial transparency on the RCAAAs, I would suspect most charities are small organizations—under $1 million. They probably wouldn't have complex audited financial statements, and they probably wouldn't say anything on that. We just need more transparency. They have to have a T3010A. We have to know how many full-time staff and how much compensation. Right now, it's black.