Canadian Heritage Committee on May 8th, 2023

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I appreciate all of the witnesses being here. No matter what the context, I think that what we found the last time, when we finally had.... I appreciate your coming, but the people we were looking to come should understand the frustration that we had when the appropriate people did not come. It makes it very difficult for us to have good clarity in the questions, because those people can answer them.

When you see our frustration, our concern that we are not getting to where we were....

With the resources that you have, to suggest that you did not know what that original motion was and that you found out late last week what that motion originally was, whether I agree or disagree with it, I find that it's just highly unlikely to have happened, and you would have known what that motion was a long time ago when it was passed.

You have incredible resources, so for somebody to take that and say, “I'm not coming because of that one” really taints the conversation in the room. It really does, no matter what your position or mine might be. The experts in the room that we need to have here make those conversations much more useful.

Having said that, I'm going to go specifically to—and this has been already alluded to—the contracts that you've already signed.

It's been reported that you have 14 of those contracts signed in Canada now. Is that true?

[Rachel Curran]

We have 18 now, Mr. Shields.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Would you define who those 18 are?

[Rachel Curran]

Mr. Shields, through the chair, the content of those deals and who they are signed with is a matter of commercial confidence.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

I understand that.

My honourable colleague here suggested that they had amendments approved that would help support local newspapers, but he didn't support ours, which would have supported solo journalism. In my riding, where there are 13 weekly papers, we have a number of those with one journalist. They have not had an agreement with you.

Are you going to have an agreement with them?

[Rachel Curran]

Through the chair, we share your concerns that small and local publishers and news outlets will not benefit from this bill. In fact, as the Parliamentary Budget Officer has recently confirmed, more than 75% of the funds that are purported to be raised under this bill are going to go to the most profitable and highly subsidized broadcasters in Canada.

In fact, Mr. Shields, that's one of our other concerns with this bill. It's not going to help small local journalists like the ones in your riding.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Yet you've gone out and made agreements with 18 others. Why aren't you making agreements with those independent small ones? If you can take the time to do 18, why aren't you doing those ones?

[Kevin Chan]

Mr. Shields, we would welcome a conversation with the CEO of your publication, if that is what you are seeking. I think that would be very appropriate.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Would you like the names of the 13 weekly papers in my riding owned by the one-journalist operations? Would you meet with them and make a deal with them?

[Kevin Chan]

We have before, Mr. Shields.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

No, you didn't.

[Kevin Chan]

No, it wasn't in your particular riding, but we have met with other one-person operators or owners, as you say.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Can you give me an example of one of those?

[Kevin Chan]

Sure. We've met with Indiegraf and Erin Millar. We've met with Jeremy, whose last name starts with “K” at The Sprawl in Calgary.

I guess what I'm reacting to maybe is to clarify, Mr. Shields, if you are under the impression that we have not talked to small publishers, that in fact it's the opposite. We've spent most of our time with small publishers.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

But you've made no agreements with them.

[Kevin Chan]

I believe we have some agreements with.... I'm trying to remember. We have an agreement with Indiegraf and with The Discourse.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Are those one-journalist....?

[Kevin Chan]

I think there might be two. I'm not sure, exactly, but I think, by anyone's definition, it's a very small publication.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

In the 13 in my riding, that's what they live on, by the way.

[Kevin Chan]

We would be very pleased to speak with them, especially—

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

You have 30 seconds.

[Kevin Chan]

—out from under the challenge of Bill C-18.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

You'll get those names. I'll be looking forward to those conversations happening.

[Kevin Chan]

Thank you, sir. Sure.

[Martin Shields, Conservative, Bow River, AB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.