Evidence of meeting #87 for Canadian Heritage in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was athletes.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Clerk of the Committee  Ms. Geneviève Desjardins
Susan Auch  Olympic Medallist and Former Chief Executive Officer of Speed Skating Canada, As an Individual
Karl Subban  Committee Member, Ban Ads for Gambling
Tara McNeil  President, Bobsleigh Canada Skeleton
Nathan Bombrys  Chief Executive Officer, Rugby Canada
Debra Armstrong  Chief Executive Officer, Skate Canada

11:10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting 87 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage.

I would like to acknowledge that this meeting is taking place on the unceded traditional territory of the Algonquin Anishinabe people.

Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format, pursuant to the House order of Thursday, June 23, 2022. Even though public health authorities and the Board of Internal Economy no longer require mask wearing indoors, I would like to ask you to think about wearing a mask for your own good.

I would like to take this opportunity to remind everyone in this meeting that you cannot take photos of the screen. The proceedings will be made available via the House of Commons website.

If you look at the bottom of your screen, for those of you who are attending virtually, there's a little globe, and that is your interpretation. If you press it, you can have your translation of choice. Please turn your microphones off when you're not speaking, and speak only when the chair recognizes you.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) and the motion adopted by the committee on Tuesday, September 20, 2022, the committee is meeting to continue its study on safe sport in Canada.

Today, we have two sets of witnesses, and we're dividing—

11:10 a.m.

Bloc

Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC

Point of order, Madam Chair.

Is it possible, with unanimous consent, to add Lisa Ross, former coach of the women's national sailing team, as a witness? She is present, but there is some confusion about her being called, and I'd like her testimony to be heard. We're supposed to hear three witnesses per hour, and so we'd have time to hear her. I'm asking the committee members for unanimous consent to do that.

Thank you.

11:10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Thank you, Sébastien.

There is a little problem. She may have to go into the 12 p.m. to 1 p.m. slot, which will give us four people in that slot. In the first slot, we had a request from one of the witnesses that they didn't want to be on the same meeting as other sports teams. We're following that request.

I don't know if you'll get unanimous consent for the second hour. That gives us four people in the second hour.

11:10 a.m.

The Clerk of the Committee Ms. Geneviève Desjardins

I have Ms. Gladu, who has her hand up here.

11:10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Ms. Gladu, go ahead.

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

Thank you, Chair.

We definitely want to hear from the witness, but there are a lot of witnesses who have asked to appear before the committee, and there's a process of how they get slotted in. I wouldn't want to create a precedent of people showing up at committee thinking they can join the committee. That's not the way we operate.

Although I do want to hear the testimony, I don't want to hear it today. I want to follow the normal protocol.

11:10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Thank you, Ms. Gladu.

Are there any other comments? Does anyone disagree with Ms. Gladu?

11:10 a.m.

Bloc

Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC

Obviously, I disagree, Madam Chair. I want her to be able to testify.

11:10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Thank you, Sébastien.

I'm going to ask the committee if we have unanimous consent.

11:10 a.m.

An hon. member

No.

11:10 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

We do not have unanimous consent, so we're going to have to ask the witness to speak at another time. The clerk will look after that.

In the first hour, from 11 a.m. to 12 p.m., we have Susan Auch, Olympic medallist and former chief executive officer of Speed Skating Canada. Then we have, from Ban Ads for Gambling, Karl Subban.

Ms. Auch, you will speak for five minutes. You can begin now with your opening statement.

Thank you.

11:10 a.m.

Susan Auch Olympic Medallist and Former Chief Executive Officer of Speed Skating Canada, As an Individual

Thank you, Madam Chair and the entire committee, for inviting me to speak today.

I am struggling a bit with asthma right now, so please bear with me.

As a child, I ran track, played ringette and swam at the local pool. I bike-raced around Birds Hill park and, of course, skated on frozen ponds. I cherish the time I spent doing sports as a child. These positive beginnings set me up for a lifelong love of sport and drive my passion to see sport delivered safely, fairly and inclusively for all Canadian athletes.

However, within our Canadian sport system today, this is not possible. I know this first-hand. I'm a five-time Olympian, three-time Olympic medallist, the first speed skater to be named a Bobbie Rosenfeld female athlete of the year, and a member of the Olympic, Canada, Alberta and Manitoba halls of fame and the Order of Manitoba.

I am also a survivor, and I am a victim of retribution from the Canadian sport system.

Blinded by a learned and ingrained desire to make my country and community proud, I endured treatment that no young person should have to endure. I paid a high price for my Olympic success and an even higher price when I went back to sport to try to make positive change.

The verbal abuse, sexual harassment and isolation began when I moved to Montreal, and again when I moved to Calgary to pursue speed skating internationally. I remember my coach sticking his finger in my face and yelling, “Don't eff up!” before races. I remember the relentless sexual harassment by my coach on the ice, in my dorm, in the elevator and even in the Calgary Oval offices, to the point where I had to squeeze between the dividers and windows to get out. When I finally reached my breaking point and told him to eff off, I was suspended from the team.

I used to think I became focused and resilient because I was able to survive this abuse, but no young Canadian needs to go through that to win medals. It's impossible to know what I could have achieved had I not had to waste energy just surviving the system. Systemic problems in sport cause this enabling of abuses and result in retribution for anyone who speaks up or tries to make change.

In the early 2000s, Own the Podium was created and sport began receiving much-needed funds to help support athletes competing with the world. By 2006, we saw amazing results. Now, OTP is fully funded by taxpayer dollars and involved in much more than just directing funds to high performance, which has been problematic enough.

The OTP CEO and directors impose themselves on national sport organization staff interviews, and now even on CEO and ED interviews. OTP and the Canadian Olympic Committee put themselves between HP staff and the organization, generally undermining the employer. OTP pressures CEOs to keep the national sport organization staff they prefer, regardless of the problematic culture they create or the blatant overspending of taxpayer dollars. Generally, anyone OTP prefers is protected by OTP. We see that in the constant revolving door of fired then rehired people in sport.

The worst is that OTP puts pressure on sports to refrain from reporting allegations if it risks Olympic medals, even when the allegations are about harassment or sexual in nature. In 2016, after I reported sexual harassment by the president of SSC, the CEO did mediation instead of an investigation, which allowed the perpetrator to step down with accolades. The bystanders, including an SSC staff person, were not interviewed or investigated, and the victim, after signing an NDA, was left isolated and gagged. I was left exposed.

When I became the interim CEO, one of the bystanders to the incident became a director and, last summer—despite my objections to the president—the chair of the SSC HR committee. I was terminated shortly thereafter, even though SSC was in the best shape it has been in many years. CEOs are in an impossible situation. We either hold on to our convictions and prioritize our duty of care to the athletes, or we satisfy and please OTP and the COC—we become their puppets. Sport Canada generally stays out of the conflicts.

I have been subjected to baseless and nameless complaints that don't amount to anything, but they sure are scary to navigate. I still feel controlled, and I don't work for the organization or any of its affiliates. When I tried to make governance changes, the board refused to accept that diversity was just as important as skills, and the nomination committee preferred white men at a disproportionate rate. SSC now has a president who has exceeded his term and number of years on the board, according to the bylaws. He is the president beyond reproach.

I gave 20 years of my life to HP sport, and 20 more to volunteer and work in sport. It didn't make a difference. Ultimately, my experience taught me that even an Olympic medallist who is qualified and experienced at being a CEO can't go in and try to improve the system without facing retribution.

There are many, many people who still are unable to come forward for fear of breaking the code of silence or because of a non-disclosure agreement. No one is safe. Speaking up and change are not welcome in Canadian sport. For this reason, the sport system will continue to erode, and possibly implode, if we do not immediately enact a national inquiry and abolish NDAs that cover up wrongdoing.

Thank you very much.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Thank you very much, Ms. Auch.

I'm going to go now to Karl Subban, committee member for Ban Ads for Gambling, for five minutes, please.

May I ask the clerk to help me with the stopwatch? My stopwatch doesn't seem to be working this morning.

Could you time the fragments for me and call the time?

11:15 a.m.

The Clerk

Yes, I'd be happy to do that.

I'd just note that Mr. Subban is having trouble connecting. He's still on the phone with IT.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Shall we go with asking questions of Ms. Auch, then?

Ms. Auch, there will be a question and answer session, and the first round is six minutes. The six minutes include questions and answers, so try to be as concise as possible.

We're going to begin with Kevin Waugh, for the Conservatives.

11:15 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

Actually, Madam Chair, I'll start. Thanks so much.

11:15 a.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry

Okay, Marilyn, go ahead.

11:15 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

Thank you to our witness for being here today. You made us proud as Canadians, and I appreciate your candid testimony.

We have heard a lot of testimony about what's going on in sport across the country. I heard you say that Sport Canada did not really intervene. It is the one that is supposed to be doing something about this. The minister most recently introduced a mechanism to solve abuse, which involves Sport Canada. What do you think about that?

11:20 a.m.

Olympic Medallist and Former Chief Executive Officer of Speed Skating Canada, As an Individual

Susan Auch

I think Sport Canada should be intervening. It's the money of the federal government that is.... Many of the sports, specifically speed skating, function at a high percentage with federal funds. They just wouldn't support.... I'd call and try to get help with the intervening that OTP did, and frankly, it's excessive to have an overlap of two organizations. It causes more bureaucracy and just isn't necessary.

No, I never had any success in going to Sport Canada directly to try to get it to support me in letting me run the organization, which is a fully independent organization, a corporation. It's not part of Own the Podium, the Canadian Olympic Committee, or Sport Canada for that matter. We do answer to Sport Canada, but we're a separate organization. To have that kind of imposition where interventions are able to happen with threats of losing funding if we don't behave exactly the way Own the Podium wants us to behave.... That's inappropriate.

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

What would you say is the effectiveness of the OSIC in conjunction with that? Is it helping at all?

11:20 a.m.

Olympic Medallist and Former Chief Executive Officer of Speed Skating Canada, As an Individual

Susan Auch

You know, I left before the OSIC was accepted by Speed Skating Canada. It was in its infancy, and I believe that Speed Skating Canada accepted it shortly after I left. The hope is for the OSIC to work. I think there are serious limitations for it.

What I don't think works is independent third parties hired by organizations. The OSIC is a welcome step, in that it is not an independent organization hired directly by the specific organizations, but I think it's in its infancy. I think it has a long way to go, and it can't accept many complaints. There are only certain things it can accept, and there are so many other things—specifically in grassroots sports—that are not covered by the OSIC.

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

Thank you. I would argue that anything that is criminal in nature should actually not be even investigated by any of these sport organizations. It should be a police matter.

Hockey Canada received funding again from the Minister of Sport, after all of the situations that we've seen there and the fact that it has implemented only six of the 36 recommendations. What do you think about that?

11:20 a.m.

Olympic Medallist and Former Chief Executive Officer of Speed Skating Canada, As an Individual

Susan Auch

I don't know a whole lot about Hockey Canada. I, for one, really tried to implement Sport Canada recommendations that came directly from the Prime Minister. That was one of the fun parts of the job. It was one of the things that made me feel fulfilled.

That being said, you often have very strong boards that oppose. As a CEO, you're balancing so many different things. You're balancing trying to please the athletes and get them all to the World Cup, and we know that no one has unlimited funds to do those things. We have boards that simply don't necessarily always want to move forward. Now, I know that hockey has a federally implemented board—I'm not sure how they were instituted. I would think they are trying to make the changes, but I suspect it's difficult.

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

Marilyn Gladu Conservative Sarnia—Lambton, ON

You spoke a little bit about the retribution you received. We have heard from other testimony that anti-retribution legislation would be important, as well as getting rid of these NDAs.

Can you comment on that?

11:20 a.m.

Olympic Medallist and Former Chief Executive Officer of Speed Skating Canada, As an Individual

Susan Auch

Yes, for sure. Retribution is one of the ways we're all silenced, of course, whereby if you say something, there will be retribution to you individually or to the organization—withholding of funds or just online, on social media.

NDAs are a way for organizations, not just in sport.... Sport is the one that's in the public eye, along with the arts sector. We have an opportunity to lead the way and abolish NDAs to cover up bad things. For sure, that is one of the simple things to do. I know it's somewhat complicated because NDAs also protect important private or corporate information, but they should not be allowed to be used to cover up bad things, for sure.