Canadian Heritage Committee on Nov. 5th, 2025

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome, everyone, to meeting number 12 of the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage.

Before we begin, I would ask all in-person participants to read the guidelines that are written on the updated cards on the table in front of you. They are measures in place to help prevent audio and feedback incidents and to protect the health and safety of all participants, including the interpreters.

You will also notice a QR code on the card. It links to a short awareness video, if needed.

Pursuant to the routine motion adopted by the committee, I can confirm that all witnesses are completing the required connection tests in advance of this meeting. I believe we have some issues online right now, but we'll move forward. Hopefully, those issues will be resolved before we get to our online participants.

Please wait until I recognize you by name before you speak, and all comments should be addressed through the chair.

Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) and the motion adopted by the committee on Monday, September 22, 2025, the committee is meeting today to study the effects of technological advances in AI on the creative industries.

With us today we have Stephanie Enders, chief delivery officer at the Alberta Machine Intelligence Institute.

We have Pierre-Philippe Côté, entrepreneur and founder of Orio.

From Rezolution Pictures International Inc., we have Archita Ghosh, president.

Union des Artistes is represented by Tania Kontoyanni, chair of the board of directors.

From the Writers Guild of Canada, we have Victoria Shen and Neal McDougall.

Each of you, or each organization, will have five minutes for opening remarks.

We will start with Stephanie Enders. You now have the floor for five minutes.

[Stephanie Enders, Chief Delivery Officer, Alberta Machine Intelligence Institute]

Thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today.

I am Steph Enders, the chief delivery officer at AMII, one of three national institutes for AI excellence in Canada established as part of the pan-Canadian strategy in 2017.

It is vital to begin by recognizing Canada's unique and rich history in this field. Canadian researchers, including AMII's chief scientific adviser, Dr. Richard Sutton, as well as Dr. Geoffrey Hinton and Dr. Yoshua Bengio, are often referred to as the godfathers of AI. They laid the foundational theoretical groundwork for modern reinforcement learning and deep learning, fields at the heart of applied AI that you use each day.

With Dr. Sutton's recent Turing Award, our national institutes are now guided by three Turing laureates. This legacy gives Canada global leadership and an ongoing responsibility to define the ethical and innovative path forward for this technology.

At AMII, our mission of AI for good and for all is fundamentally built on three interconnected pillars: invention, innovation and diffusion. Invention is our commitment to fundamental research. Innovation is the adoption and commercialization of this research, and perhaps most crucially for this committee’s mandate, diffusion is the broad transfer of knowledge, training and workforce upskilling.

To truly advance the field responsibly, we are making targeted research investments in a new generation of bilingual researchers. These are individuals advancing not only AI methodologies but also deep domain knowledge in fields such as space, health, chemistry, biology and the creative industries. This expertise uniquely positions our next generation of talent to advance the field with encouragement, but it also ensures that AI serves the domain and not the other way around.

While public discourse is currently dominated by generative AI—the tools that create images, music and text—I want to stress that the impact of machine learning extends far beyond novelty outputs, also known as AI slop. We must consider the other forms of AI that offer tremendous, often overlooked opportunities, from recommendation engines that help audiences find local artists to predictive analytics that can help with tour scheduling to tools that optimize production pipelines. AI has the potential to support the business of the creative industries, not only the creative outputs themselves.

The productivity potential leading to incredible gains in creativity, productivity and new business models is real. However, it must be matched by responsible AI practices that prioritize privacy, security and fairness, along with the necessary mitigation steps to reduce risk.

Canada has been slower than our G7 counterparts to adopt AI and to build the scaling companies that will ultimately have the greatest impact from this research. The creative industries have the opportunity not only to adopt these technologies but also to commercialize them through AI-first start-ups. Think of companies like Artificial Agency. Canada can rapidly increase this opportunity for the creative industry by focusing on levers to increase access to capital, compute and customers for these AI-first start-ups.

In addition, we must address human capital. We believe that AI literacy, aligned with established frameworks like the UNESCO's AI student competencies, is not a niche skill but a fundamental requirement for all workers, including those employed by the cultural industries. If you work with content, you must understand the technology and tools for generating it or advancing your practice.

AMII has already achieved success in this field through specialized programs for K-to-12 teachers, post-secondary students and energy workers. They are slated to reach hundreds of thousands of Canadians in the year ahead.

This brings us to a profound opportunity inherent in play. Think of how community sports create lifelong patrons of professional games, like baseball, because participants build muscle memory—a tangible connection to the effort required. The arts work in a similar way. Creativity assisted by generative AI can be another powerful gateway, allowing citizens to engage directly and playfully with the creative process, thereby increasing their love and appreciation of the arts as a whole, but only if AI literacy accompanies access to the tools.

The immediate application of AI, particularly generative models, raises real ethical considerations regarding the use and provenance of data. We must be clear about what ownership means in this new ecosystem.

We see three areas: data where ownership resides primarily with the individual and the community whose efforts, likenesses and works created the training material; models where proprietary IP and open-source models reside, often owned by companies and research organizations; and oversight, where ownership has a shared responsibility with public systems, such as regulation and policy mechanisms, providing the framework to prevent harm and ensure fairness, but also the professional accountability of those who develop and deploy AI models.

Finally, I wish to share a crucial observation. The creative industries play a monumental role in shaping how our citizens think of, imagine and understand this technology. The narratives crafted by our filmmakers, authors, musicians and artists shape the public understanding, the value perception and, at times, the misunderstanding of AI. Investing in the creative sector is thus an investment in the national dialogue around our technological future.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

Thank you.

Next we'll turn to Pierre-Philippe Côté from Orio.

You have the floor for five minutes.

[Pierre-Philippe Côté, Entrepreneur and Founder, Orio]

Thank you.

I have just a few words about Orio.

Orio is a company that fosters data sovereignty and security, first and foremost. At Orio, the security and sovereignty of our users' data are paramount. We operate decentralized data centres that are intelligently distributed to minimize the risk of breaches and to ensure that every piece of data remains protected and confidential. Our advanced security protocols and regular audits ensure strict compliance with international standards, creating an environment resilient to cyber-threats.

Our operations are powered by hydroelectricity, and heat is recovered from servers for a reduced environmental impact. Orio is a secure and sustainable cloud infrastructure meeting the highest security and data integrity requirements.

Regarding the impact of artificial intelligence on the creative industries, I am going to put on my creator hat, since I, myself, am an artist and the founder of BEAM, a creative crossroads located in Saint‑Adrien in the Eastern Townships that was, in fact, the first creative crossroads funded by Canadian Heritage, in 2018.

Members of the committee, thank you for inviting me to speak today to discuss a crucial subject: the impact of artificial intelligence on Canadian creative industries. Every day, as cofounder of BEAM, a community creative crossroads based in the Eastern Townships, I observe the speed with which our practices are changing as we deal with this technological revolution. As a creator, music publisher, producer and philanthropist, I have a particular interest in these subjects. I am also here today in another role, as cofounder of the Orio Cloud computing constellation, a technology enterprise whose goal is to provide cloud computing solutions to creative enterprises.

I will start by pointing out the potential for positive transformation that is offered by artificial intelligence.

Artificial intelligence provides powerful tools that can be used to stimulate creativity, such as by generating music, images and scenarios, by automated editing, by real-time translation and by trend analysis. These technologies enable artists, producers and studios to explore new forms of expression, increase their productivity and make creation more accessible.

In Canada, AI helps to expand the reach of our content internationally and enables small outfits like ours to innovate and compete with the big global actors.

BEAM is the tangible evidence of this. As a regional driver of innovation, we generate tangible economic benefits in our rural community in Quebec, while at the same time attracting large-scale international projects. In some cases, AI enables us to go even further by creating unprecedented synergies among artists, technicians and local enterprises.

Major challenges arise in incorporating AI, however. Issues surrounding copyright, the originality of the works generated and remuneration of creators are central to the concerns. It is essential that robust legal and ethical frameworks be put in place to protect artists, while at the same time encouraging innovation.

Digital sovereignty is also a key issue. Canadian companies like Orio are developing responsible, locally controlled AI solutions that guarantee data security and the preservation of our cultural heritage. By supporting these technologies, we make sure that the benefits of innovation go first to our creators and communities.

Excessive dependence on American technologies presents a real risk to our cultural and national sovereignty, however. Extraterritorial laws like the Patriot Act and the CLOUD Act allow US authorities to access data hosted on servers in that country, even if it is about citizens of Canada and Canadian works. This situation jeopardizes the confidentiality, security and control of our cultural content and highlights the strategic importance of supporting our digital infrastructure and local solutions.

Artificial intelligence is transforming creative occupations. Some jobs are changing and others are emerging, but some are at risk of disappearing. It is therefore crucial that this transition be supported by continuing education programs so that professionals are able to appropriate these new tools and stay competitive. Canada has to invest in developing digital and creative skills, particularly outside urban centres and for emerging talents.

When used properly, AI can be a formidable vehicle for diversity. It gives voice to creators from under-represented communities, allows content to be adapted for various audiences and expands access to culture. However, we must guard against algorithmic biases and guarantee that the tools that are developed reflect the wealth of Canada's culture.

In conclusion, AI is both an opportunity and a challenge for Canadian creative industries. Our collective responsibility is to guide its development so it serves human creativity, protects our artists and expands Canada's cultural reach.

I urge the committee to support ambitious public policy that reconciles innovation, digital sovereignty, protection for copyright and equitable access to these new technologies.

Thank you for your attention and I am available to answer your questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

Thank you, Mr. Côté.

We'll turn to Rezolution Pictures International's Archita Ghosh.

You have the floor for five minutes.

[Archita Ghosh, President, Rezolution Pictures International Inc.]

Good afternoon. Thank you for inviting me here today.

My name is Archita Ghosh. I am the president of Rezolution Pictures International. I did not use AI to create my opening remarks, so they might not be as good as they should be.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Archita Ghosh]

Rezolution Pictures is an indigenous film and television production company based in Montreal. We produce mostly documentary and drama features and series.

Our co-founders are Ernest Webb, who is Cree, from James Bay, and Catherine Bainbridge. You may know some of our work: Little Bird, Rumble, Mohawk Girls and Spirit of Birth. We're happy to be celebrating our 25-year anniversary this year.

The Rezolution Pictures core team uses AI daily for productivity: We structure reports, find sources of research and administer our file data almost every single day. This increases our efficiency and definitely makes us more competent and competitive as a business. For us, there is not much to challenge or question here. AI in this context is a business tool wielded by us humans.

However, when it comes to content, especially indigenous content, challenges and questions abound. At the centre of these concerns is the principle of indigenous data sovereignty: the right of indigenous peoples to govern, control and protect data that pertains to their cultures, lands, languages and bodies. Ultimately, indigenous data sovereignty envisions indigenous control over the cultural framework of data, the process of data collection, the content produced, the stories told and the priorities the data supports. Data is not neutral.

Rezolution has many concerns, some very specifically coming from an indigenous cultural lens. These include a scarcity of accurate, unbiased cultural datasets that are used by AI platforms, and the lack of transparency for the sources with which AI platforms are fed.

As it is for all content creators in our industry, we are also concerned with the absence of clear intellectual property protection for the many layers of AI-generated elements. Here is a real-world example that Rezolution has had and that reflects the complexities of these challenges.

Most of the stories Rezolution tells are centred around indigenous cultures and communities. While we were in the middle of producing one of our feature documentaries in 2022, Red Fever, we needed an image of a Haudenosaunee leader from the 1700s. We initially scoured stock image libraries and then used AI platforms and existing data to source a representative image—no luck. In the end, we used our own data to train an AI platform to produce images that were acceptable and as accurate as possible. They are in the film.

From this example, we were motivated to begin a modest culture- and community-centred project to work on bringing control, consent, credit, compensation and copyright to indigenous creatives and professionals—in other words, to inch AI platforms towards indigenous data sovereignty. SODEC provided Rezolution with the financial support to start this project last year.

Since there is such a scarcity of accurate cultural data that feeds AI systems, we are creating smaller, vetted and curated datasets like we did for Red Fever. The stereotypes and biases we saw were glaring and disrespectful, clearly reflecting the unsupervised nature of immense online datasets. The Red Fever example reflects the power of human-supervised smaller datasets and how incredibly positive AI can be—if managed well by humans—in improving indigenous representation on the screen.

The decades-long cultural and data research with which Rezolution trained the AI platform for Red Fever has disappeared into the AI abyss. We hope it will be used for good, but whether it is or not, there is no footnote or reference connecting Rezolution and all the communities that contributed to it.

In our project, with our curated dataset, our goal is to credit and compensate the researchers, content creators and cultural workers involved in creating AI-generated content. When AI systems extract, process and monetize indigenous data without consent, colonization through data continues to harm and destroy. Rezolution has always been committed to both technological advances and indigenous peoples telling their own stories on their own terms.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

Thank you.

We will turn online now to the Writers Guild of Canada, with Victoria Shen and Neal McDougall.

Collectively, you have five minutes.

[Victoria Shen, Executive Director, Writers Guild of Canada]

Hello, Madam Chair and members of the committee.

My name is Victoria Shen, and I am the executive director of the Writers Guild of Canada. With me today is Neal McDougall, our assistant executive director. Thank you for inviting us to speak this afternoon.

We believe that generative artificial intelligence has the capacity to do harm: to flood our media ecosystem with homogenized, machine-generated content, to drown out human and Canadian creative voices and to undermine existing business models while redirecting power and profit into the hands of corporations.

Generative AI is trained on the work of artists and creators and now threatens their livelihood.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Excuse me, Madam Chair—

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

I'm sorry, Ms. Shen. I think we have a problem with interpretation. Give us a minute.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

There does seem to be a technical problem.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Jean-François Pagé]

In fact, we are hearing two French interpreters at the same time. We should only be hearing one of them at a time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

Ms. Shen, would you like to take it from the top, please? We'll restart. Our problem has been resolved, I imagine.

[Victoria Shen]

It's not a problem.

Hello, Madam Chair and members of the committee. My name is Victoria Shen, and I am the executive director at the Writers Guild of Canada.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

We are still having the problem.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

I'm sorry, but we're still having a problem.

Let me suspend for a moment. We'll try to resolve some of these issues.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

We're back.

Ms. Shen, I'm sorry to do this to you, but would you please start over again?

[Victoria Shen]

I think we've all learned my name at this point, I hope.

Madam Chair and committee, thank you so much for having us here today.

My name is Victoria Shen. I am the executive director of the Writers Guild of Canada. One more time, my fabulous colleague, Neal McDougall, is our assistant executive director. Thank you so much for having us.

We believe that generative artificial intelligence has the capacity to do harm: to flood our media ecosystem with homogenized, machine-generated content, to drown out human and Canadian creative voices, to undermine existing business models and to redirect power and profit into the hands of corporations.

Generative AI is trained on the work of artists and creators and now can also threaten their livelihood. While some present this technology as a tool for creatives, one that will allow us to make more with less, it can also miss the fundamental point.

Our member screenwriters create original works that speak to the human condition. We tell stories that are unique to Canadians. Cultural production and support for the arts are critical to our identity, our preservation and our sovereignty as a nation. Screenwriters and artists serve a public policy purpose that is much more than merely filling screens. While AI may be able to generate text and content, these things are not and never will be our stories.

As a labour organization, we have already negotiated protections for screenwriters. Our collective agreement is considered a global leader in that regard. They include that if a producer provides writers with materials generated by AI, the producer must disclose that it's AI-generated and contract under our agreement.

Material generated by AI is treated as source material. That is a defined term. It's much like a reference material, like a photograph or a newspaper article. AI-generated material cannot be used to reduce a writer's compensation or their credit. Writers also warrant that their work is not generated in whole or in part by AI.

[Neal McDougall, Assistant Executive Director, Writers Guild of Canada]

Canada needs smart policy around GenAI, particularly around copyright. Copyright itself is not regulation; it is intellectual property. Property rights are a precondition of free and fair markets. For GenAI inputs, use of copyrighted work to train them must respect the three Cs: consent, credit and compensation.

Consent is the foundation upon which credit and compensation are built. It must be expressly given on an opt-in basis and not through an opt-out regime. This needs no compulsory licensing, as that would vitiate consent and deny copyright holders a market-based mechanism through which to negotiate compensation. It naturally follows that there should be no fair-dealing exception created for the purposes of training AI. That would amount to a government-forced value transfer from artists to technology companies.

With respect to GenAI outputs, they are not copyrightable now, and this should remain the case. Copyright protection has long been founded upon two different but complementary rationales: one, to incentivize the creation of works for the ultimate benefit of society, and two, as a natural entitlement of a creator to the fruits of their own labours. Neither of these rationales is engaged by GenAI outputs.

Similarly, the standard for human intervention to transform a GenAI output into a copyrightable work must be high. Otherwise, we risk the phenomenon of copyright laundry, in which financial incentives transform human beings into mere translators of machine outputs for the purposes of rendering AI outputs copyrightable.

Transparency is also key. There currently is an enormous information asymmetry between AI companies and rights holders. Governments should require AI companies to provide a plain-language description of a sufficiently detailed identification of the content used for training the system to facilitate copyright holders in exercising and enforcing their rights under the Copyright Act.

Finally, separate and apart from copyright, there are a number of existing cultural supports—like the Canada Media Fund and Telefilm Canada—and tax credits to support Canadian content. These are cultural funds, not technology funds, so they should remain to support human creators and not fund AI-generated content.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

Thank you.

Our last witness is Tania Kontoyanni from the Union des artistes, who has the floor for five minutes.

[Tania Kontoyanni, Chair of the Board, Union des Artistes]

Members of the committee, thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak on this issue on behalf of the Union des artistes and the 13,000 performing artists we represent, who are bearing the brunt of it.

I would first like to clarify one thing: Artists do not oppose technological change. The entire history of art proves the opposite, and it has often been artists who initiated new technologies.

The current situation is unprecedented, however. Never before have artists been threatened with extinction by the technology they helped to create. For two decades, we have been unwittingly feeding the beast that threatens to devour us today. Let us be clear: As we speak, creators' works are being appropriated. Every minute, images, voices and texts are being used without consent and without compensation. If we do nothing, our artists might disappear, in the shorter or longer term. Are we actually aware of what that means and of what would disappear along with them? The impact to which the arts community attests must not be taken lightly. They are the early warning signs of what can happen in multiple economic sectors of our society.

We have been raising the alarm for two years now. In the cultural community, the impact of generative AI is real, and it is growing and accelerating. There are countless problems: identity appropriation, the rising precariousness of jobs and the disappearance of entire occupations, including the work of vocal artists, whose future is absolutely uncertain. How many actors will be out of work because a modifiable audio file will suffice? There is no shortage of examples. Authors, composers and performers are discovering albums released under their name, with their image and musical style, that are not their creations; they have been artificially generated. Their voice and their identity have been copied and this has even affected their royalties, the way they earn a living. Artists have been victims of fake videos that are increasingly being used for phishing and to defraud the public of their money.

That is where things stand. Today, we are tolerating piracy, pillaging and plagiarism. It is not just that the thieves are not being punished; the red carpet is being rolled out for them, they are being invited to speak in national forums and we are letting their powerful lobbies influence governments.

The big AI developers have, in fact, identified three things that are preventing them from expanding: patents, copyright and personal data protection. Are we seriously considering giving in on these things and allowing them to circumvent our laws, in order to enrich the multinationals that are exploiting AI with no consideration for national cultures and cultural sovereignty?

Artificial intelligence is already influencing our standards of living and our relationship with work, culture and even truth, and yet a majority of us are completely unaware of how it works and what its implications are. The public must be better informed and better equipped to understand what they are using, what they are consuming and what they are contributing to. The dialogue you have begun here must keep going and must involve artists, the public, researchers, digital creators and political decision-makers, in order to demystify AI and shine a light through its shell. Each of us bears this responsibility. Understanding artificial intelligence is the way to give us the means to decide what world we want to build, what values we want to protect and what limits we want to impose. It is urgent that awareness be raised.

Are there solutions? Even the most ardent defenders of generative AI must be seeing that guardrails will have to be installed and a legal framework imposed on it, and this means modernizing the Copyright Act.

Transparency must be absolute. All content generated by AI must be identified as such to the public and consumers, and training databases must be known. Whether they are creators or performers, artists must be able to consent to the use of their works and their image, because that amounts to exploitation, and any exploitation of a work must be accompanied by compensation. This is how artists earn their living.

Alongside this, there must be adequate funding for our cultural industries, particularly those most threatened by this new technology.

In addition, it is a matter of urgency that the Canadian private copying rules be modernized to take the new digital realities into account and make the scheme once again fully capable of supporting our cultural production.

As a final point, we have to consider offering support for Canadian artists when they need a remedy in order to defend their rights against the big tech companies.

In conclusion, inform, debate, educate: This is the first duty of a democratic nation facing this new reality. Canada has everything it needs in order to exercise global leadership in the ethics of artificial intelligence. This is crucial to our cultural sovereignty.

Our creators are the dam that stands between us and cultural homogeneity. Help us resist, because, as we speak, that dam is threatening to give way.

Thank you for listening.

[The Chair, Liberal, Lisa Hepfner]

Thank you, Ms. Kontoyanni.

We will turn now to questions from members.

I note that we have a couple of new members with us today.

Welcome, Mike Dawson.

Welcome, Ms. Dandurand.

We are very happy to have you with us today.

We will begin with Mrs. Thomas for six minutes.

[Rachael Thomas, Conservative, Lethbridge, AB]

Thank you very much.

My first question is for Ms. Ghosh.

First off, I understand you've been in your role for about a year and a half, since April 2024. Based on the bit of reading I've done, it would appear you're doing an excellent job. Congratulations on taking on that role.