My question follows up on that, because I know what the gentlemen speak of with respect to China. I remember the first time a brother-in-law of mine, who's provincially involved in Saskatchewan, with the department there, was over visiting China, and you could smell something like kerosene off the book when you opened those beautiful pages. When I was there, likewise, it was a pretty grey atmosphere.
On the issue of credibility, especially in regard to other countries--those that have signed on to Kyoto, those that have not--I framed this question the other day. I want to ask it again because I think it's important. It came up with respect to this issue of benchmarking. I don't want to be unfair, but the issue is that we don't have a hope of meeting the Kyoto targets. As long as we benchmark, that's the good thing, and then we can compare to how far we fall short of that.
I'd raise the other issue, in terms of our credibility and trust with other countries. My view is that in terms of human relations and country-to-country relations, we could bring the process into disrepute and then we won't have the goodwill at some point later, when we're serious and assertively moving on some targets and so on.
I liken it to relating to my four children, my five grandchildren. If I'm to make outlandish promises to the effect that I'm going to spend two hours individually with each of them every night, doing what they want to do, and there's not a hope of keeping that, you know, it's just not realistic. I'll be a laughingstock almost. I'll blow my credibility with my own children, and then when I need the goodwill and the trust and credibility in other crucial relationships, which of course one does in continuing to be a dad and grandfather over the years ahead....
I think we should be assertive. I think we need to act on both greenhouse gases and the Clean Air Act, the air pollution itself, and I think as a result of seriousness, we'll get the greater reductions in both air pollution and greenhouse gases. But as we set these goals and targets, what's the downside or the negative fallout? Yes, the benchmarking....
I think there's another possibility here of actually losing credibility, not having the trust of countries like China, India, and so on that might come into it later, if in fact we're just playing little games that are clearly unrealistic. That would be my question, in terms of the international community, when we just throw a figure up there, minus 6%, Kyoto commitment, and so on.
The environment commissioner has said there's no evidence of analysis supporting that. I guess I want to get at the philosophical question of the necessity of doing the hard work and making realistic targets to get the job done.