Environment Committee on May 12th, 2008

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

I call the meeting to order.

I'd like to welcome our guests and thank you for returning. Let's hope that we won't have any fire or water problems, or any other problems that would cause the cancellation of our meeting.

I understand, Mr. Haché, that you have 90 minutes. Is that correct?

[Roland Haché, Minister of Environment and Minister responsible for the Northern New Brunswick Initiative, Government of New Brunswick]

I would correct that and say 30 minutes.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Okay. Certainly I'll ask members to be aware of that, and we will get on with this as quickly as we can. Again, thank you so much for returning.

Thank you, Ambassador Iremark, as well, for being here again and understanding the problem we had last time.

Go ahead, Mr. Warawa.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Thank you, Chair. I have a procedural item before we hear from the witnesses.

We have tentatively scheduled to hear from the minister on May 28. There's a lot of work by the department to prepare for the main estimates, so just to make sure that we are meeting on May 28, could we make a quick motion that we actually confirm that date of May 28 for the minister?

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Everyone has heard the motion. I think May 28 was agreed to earlier. Is everybody in favour of that?

Go ahead, Mr. Regan.

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Halifax West, NS]

Was it agreed to earlier?

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Yes, we had agreed to do the estimates. They have to be done by May--

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Halifax West, NS]

We agreed to do the estimates, yes.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Yes, and to the minister appearing with the--

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Halifax West, NS]

We agreed on the day. That should be clear; okay.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Yes, that has been part of our schedule for some time.

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Halifax West, NS]

So May 28 is what we're talking about.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Yes; it's Wednesday, May 28, when we get back.

(Motion agreed to)

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Could we begin?

Mr. Martin, I believe you have a brief statement. I think we have circulated that, have we? Yes, everyone has it, so if you could just briefly summarize, we will then move on to the ambassador from Sweden, then to Mr. Haché, and then right to questions.

Go ahead, Mr. Martin.

[Michael Martin, Assistant Deputy Minister, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of the Environment]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Chairman, members of the committee, I am pleased to be here before you today to assist the committee in its consideration of Bill C-474.

I would like to begin by spending a moment on the Government of Canada's current approach to sustainable development strategies. As you know, government departments have been required to produce sustainable development strategies every three years since 1997, in compliance with the 1995 amendments to the Auditor General Act.

The Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, who is responsible for reviewing these strategies under the act, has been consistently critical of the effectiveness of the strategies as drivers of change.

In December 2006, on tabling the fourth round of sustainable development strategies, the Minister of the Environment specifically noted the commissioner's observation in 2005 that the failure to develop a federal sustainable development strategy “will leave Canadians and parliamentarians...”

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Mr. Martin, excuse me for one minute. Because we thought we had 90 minutes with Mr. Haché and we now have 30 minutes, the clerk and I just discussed that possibly we should go immediately to Mr. Haché's statement and then to any questions that arise out of his statement so that we can accommodate the 30 minutes that we have with him.

Could we do that? I know it's not the normal procedure, but....

Mr. Haché, could you just give us a brief statement? Then we'll get the questions in, and you can be on your way.

[Roland Haché]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

I have prepared something here in writing, which I will convey to you.

I also want to say good afternoon to the committee members.

I want to thank the committee for inviting me to speak about New Brunswick's efforts to ensure sustainable development, in the context of the committee's deliberations on Bill C-474, An Act to require the development and implementation of a National Sustainable Development Strategy.

At this time, Mr. Chair, I would like to introduce you to two of the personnel who work with us in the Department of Environment. The first is Kim Hughes, the director of sustainable planning. Also, we have Liane Macfarlane, who's the director of policy and strategic planning. When it comes to questions later, they will be happy to answer any technical questions the committee may have.

The province of New Brunswick is entering into a period of change that will make itself sufficient and that will promote sustainable development.

Our deliberations regarding this approach for building sustainable communities is an important element of our self-sufficiency program in New Brunswick, as developed in our action plan. A copy of this action plan, along with all other pertinent documents, will be available to the committee members.

I hope that this brief presentation will clarify for you our approach to sustainable development.

Let us now go to slide number 2.

Sustainable development is about the sustainability challenge. Basically, we humans are using up our resources--our natural capital--faster than they are available, and we are exceeding the carrying capacity of the earth's ecosystem. As part of this challenge we need to focus on solving the gap, the ecological overshoot, between the earth's carrying capacity and our consumption habits.

One of the symptoms of exceeding our carrying capacity is a changing climate. As a result of climate change, New Brunswick's coastal communities are and will be affected by sea level rise, erosion, and salt water intrusion. Communities such as Le Goulet, in northern New Brunswick, and Pointe-du-Chêne, in the south of New Brunswick, are directly threatened by the impact of sea level rise. Inland water resources, both their quality and quantity, are also impacted. Flooding events in the Saint John River Valley are now affecting communities and people in a large area of the province. Prime Minister Harper recently visited this area to observe the flood damage in person.

People today are more aware of issues such as climate change, the links between pollution and health, the energy crunch, water shortages, and floods. This awareness is the basis upon which we can build change. In New Brunswick we are using this to advance the concept of sustainable communities, the foundation of which is sustainable development. It means changing the way we do things. There are incredible opportunities for innovation.

In New Brunswick, we believe that sustainable development means the integration of economic, environmental and social factors into decision-making. Environmental, economic and social issues cannot be dealt with as if they were independent and parallel entities. A balance of these three factors, for current and feature needs, will translate into economic growth, social progress and environmental stewardship, and this is often considered as a triple result of our decisions regarding sustainable development.

This balance can also be seen as resulting from a coordination of the decisions regarding financial capital, human capital and business practices.

Let us now go on to slide number 4.

New Brunswick's approach to sustainable development is based on this integration of environmental, economic, and social goals. It is also about a process to engage citizens and empower decision-makers. We understand that to be successful, any activities and actions toward sustainability must be undertaken with partners who plan their future together in a sustainable manner. It is about guiding the right development to the appropriate location. Ultimately, it's about building livable communities and sustainable communities that plan for the future at the local, regional, and provincial levels.

I would like to give you a few examples of our way of implementing sustainable development methods and building sustainable communities.

First, we created a structure and a mandate to support the planning of sustainable development in New Brunswick. The Department of the Environment is in charge of environmental legislation and legislation on community development. We created the Sustainable Planning Branch, which is in charge of coordinating planning, land use, the use of water and air, resources as well as the monitoring of a network of planning district boards which are responsible for providing development services at the local level and for giving support to municipalities.

Secondly, we are changing our relations and partnerships in order to promote sustainable development. The sustainable community initiative and the more recent study of sustainable communities in the greater Saint John region are innovative approaches that we adopted to promote the concept of sustainable development.

Third, we are developing tools to build sustainable communities based on a specific initiative of durable community design, which applies conservation design principles to the development of land lots. Moreover, we are carrying on with the development of our program for contaminated sites.

Now let us go on to slide number 6, please.

In November 2007, the greater Saint John sustainable communities case study was launched. The objective was to gain an understanding of how to build sustainable communities. It included 35 opinion leaders from the five communities of the greater Saint John region and senior-level participation from five provincial government departments. It also explored transforming relationships and how we deal with communities at large and government departments. Copies of the final report on this initiative can be found online at our department website.

So what have we learned? Well, a number of actions were identified as outcomes in the areas of leadership, strategic approaches, meaningful public engagement, and the creation of sustainable community plans.

The case study is strongly linked to our government's self-sufficiency objectives. With this case study, we are creating the building blocks necessary to implement a strategic approach to regional planning. It will assist us in working to develop the mosiac of sustainable communities throughout a self-sufficient New Brunswick.

Slide 7, please.

The design of sustainable communities for urban development is an avant-garde approach in urban development that tries to mitigate the negative human impact on the environment and to enable the community to function by using another planning design. This approach allows the developer to cut down on infrastructure costs and to increase residential density, while still protecting the environment. It gives residents various choices of residence with access to nearby natural spaces as well as to opportunities to reduce their impact on their environment. For example, one of the projects brought together many partners, including a private promoter, the Town of Dieppe, the School of Planning of Dalhousie University, several provincial departments, the University of Moncton, the New Brunswick Community College, as well as a local elementary school.

The project was developed based on sustainability principles so as to build liveable communities. I am glad to state that the sustainable community design initiative in New Brunswick is arousing interest all over Canada. We contacted promoters, not only in our province but also in other regions of Canada, for example, in the cities of Calgary, Alberta, and of Trois-Rivières and Sutton, Quebec.

Let us now continue with slide number 8, please.

New Brunswick employs an innovative and proven approach to contaminated site management. The Atlantic risk-based corrective action approach has been developed by many partners, including business interests and Atlantic government regulators.

I am pleased to inform you today that the Atlantic risk-based corrective action approach has been used in New Brunswick to remediate and improve more than 1,450 contaminated sites since 1999. This technical tool can be used to facilitate the redevelopment of brownfield lands previously abandoned and unsuitable for development in our communities.

Slide 9, please.

This is an example of the redevelopment of contaminated sites in Moncton. It would be interesting to look at the photographs taken before and after decontamination. You will see that there was considerable change.

The Government of New Brunswick and the people in the Moncton region are very glad that the site that used to serve for repairing trains, which is called a brown field, has become a very liveable place.

Slide number 10, please.

In moving to develop a comprehensive provincial brownfield redevelopment plan, we are interested in pursuing a dialogue with the federal government on ways to promote brownfield redevelopment—for example, incentive programs, harmonizing our regulations, and broader adoption of the other CCME brownfield recommendations. These are only three examples of actions we're undertaking to achieve sustainable development.

Slide 11, please.

New Brunswick has created an organization and proposed suggestions to promote sustainable development through the concept of sustainable communities.

However, sustainable development will not be brought about overnight. We are currently modifying our practices in view of our objectives, which means that we are attracting and promoting methods of sustainable development and we are becoming recognized as leaders in this field.

The Department of the Environment and our government both appreciate the values of commitment and innovation displayed by every stakeholder in our effort to standardize decision-making in view of sustainable development. We are on the way to integrating our social, economic and environmental decisions and we are constantly making progress.

We want to make sure that our way of implementing sustainable development is fair, efficient and effective for all the communities in New Brunswick. We also want to build sustainable communities in a self-sufficient province.

Let us go on to slide number 12, please.

I trust that you've found what we're doing in New Brunswick valuable for your deliberations. I would like to thank the committee chair for inviting me to share with you today our vision for sustainable development and our experiences. I welcome the opportunity to answer some of your questions or to consult with my department staff for further information on the initiatives we are pursuing.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Thank you very much, Mr. Haché.

We have two other witnesses. As we have discussed, we will go to a quick round so that we can ask one question per party rather quickly. I won't be timing, but I'll ask you to be very brief, and then Mr. Haché can be on his way. Then, right when we finish, we'll go to our other witnesses and have a full discussion and questions with them.

We will begin with Mr. Regan.

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Halifax West, NS]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

First, Mr. Minister Haché, I would like to thank you for coming, at least in your virtual presence.

I presume that you have read Bill C-474. How does it impact on your current activities?

[Roland Haché]

It is important for New Brunswick that federal legislation match provincial legislation and vice versa. I suppose that the same applies to the other provinces but I do not want to speak on their behalf.

One of the obstacles which we encounter when the time comes to legislate is our obligation to get the federal government's consent. I imagine that the federal government must agree with the provincial legislation.

Today's conference should help us reach this goal or at least to come closer to it. We must absolutely continue our discussions to make sure that we are doing exactly the same things.

The provincial and federal objectives are the same, the way of attaining them often raises problems. The conflicts arise from what was left unsaid, and not from what was said.

New Brunswick is really ready to discuss matters with the federal government to help it to implement the best possible legislation for the environment.

[The Chair, Conservative, Bob Mills]

Briefly, Mr. Regan, please.

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Halifax West, NS]

Could you tell us about the kind of cooperation that currently exists with the other provinces, for instance through the Canada Council of Ministers of the Environment? What kind of leadership would you like to see in the federal government?

[Roland Haché]

I am sorry, I did not understand the first part of your question.

[Geoff Regan, Liberal, Halifax West, NS]

What kind of cooperation is there at this time with the other provinces, for instance through the Canadian Council of Ministers of the Environment?

[Roland Haché]

I have only held the position of Minister of the Environment of New Brunswick since October 2006. Ministers come and go rather quickly, both at the provincial and federal levels. As I have just indicated, the most important thing for us to do is to pursue our dialogue.

I had the opportunity to meet with my provincial counterparts as well as Mr. Baird, the federal Minister of the Environment. We can be confident that things will change because the provincial and federal governments are really intent on meeting common objectives. Setting objectives is rather easy. Everyone agrees on the objectives that we should meet. The hard part is finding how we will achieve them.

Of course, each province has its reasons to want one thing rather than another. For example, it is much easier to produce electricity pollution-free in Quebec than it is in New Brunswick, which is extremely dependent on coal. It is important that we pursue our dialogue through the Canadian Council of Ministers of the Environment. More important still, members have to keep on meeting to ensure a healthy environment and the high quality of our air and water.

We must continue our discussions and keep on setting common objectives, but we also have to talk about the objectives on which there is less consensus.