Environment Committee on Feb. 3rd, 2009

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Yes, exactly--on what? The motion we have, I believe, is the one that was moved by Mr. Warawa and amended, which includes one member of the opposition and one member of the government. That is what we are discussing, so that would be the motion Mr. McGuinty is asking for a vote on. I believe we have had a very full debate.

[David McGuinty, Liberal, Ottawa South, ON]

Could you read it, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

I'll read it:

That the chair be authorized to hold meetings to receive evidence and have that evidence printed when a quorum is not present, provided that at least three members are present, including one member of the opposition and one member of the government.

(Motion negatived)

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

So where do we go from here?

Mr. Woodworth.

[Stephen Woodworth, Conservative, Kitchener Centre, ON]

Mr. Chair, would you accept a motion to put the alternative version forward--that is, the same paragraph but without the requirement of the attendance of an opposition member?

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

So that would end at “three members are present”, period. That's the motion on the table.

Is there any debate?

(Motion negatived)

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

So where are we now?

Mr. Warawa.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Chair, the only other option, again in the spirit of fairness, would be to change.... I'll be moving an amendment.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Now you're moving a motion. There is no amendment.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

We have a motion on the table, and it's been--

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

We have the one, which is on the original reduced quorum, which came from the 39th Parliament, second session.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Correct, and I'm going to be moving an amendment to that.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Okay.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

It would say “including one member of each party”. That's the only other option. There would be a requirement and we'd have to change it to four, which would mean you'd have to have a member of the NDP, a member of the Bloc, a member of the Liberals, and a member of the Conservatives.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

So we're saying that four members would be present, including one member from each party. Is that the motion then?

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

That's excluding the chair, so there would actually be a total of five, including you.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

So any party can shut down a meeting then.

Mr. Warawa.

[Mark Warawa, Conservative, Langley, BC]

Anything less than this, Chair, will not work. I think we will hit a roadblock. If we're saying the only way this will proceed is if you have opposition members and you don't need government, that really greatly concerns me. I believe we're stepping away from fairness. This is the only compromise. With anything less than this, this committee is, I think, at a stalemate.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Ms. Duncan.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

Mr. Chair, I have two points on that.

I know that you may have the best of intentions, Mr. Warawa, but there's a little bit of hypocrisy here. You're fighting for my right to sit in my chair, but not my right to speak. Given the vote on the very first motion of the day, I really don't see it. I'm not given much opportunity to say anything anyway, so the fact I can show up isn't much encouragement.

It's my understanding that these amendments are coming forward to every committee. The finance committee have already passed their motions. They are keeping the matter of quorum exactly as it is now.

Given that, I don't really see any reason for us to be reinventing the rules for this particular committee.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Okay. Are there any other questions or comments?

Mr. Woodworth, and then Mr. McGuinty.

[Stephen Woodworth, Conservative, Kitchener Centre, ON]

The way I see it, Mr. Chair, is that the NDP member is perhaps selling herself a little short, in that what we are now discussing would put all parties, including the NDP, in a position of equality with respect to the issue of boycotting or other matters that might occur. I think the earlier discussion still would allow the NDP member an opportunity to question. In fact if we were operating with a reduced quorum, the NDP member would almost certainly have at least two or three shots at questioning, because of the fact there's a reduced quorum. That might well work to the advantage of the NDP.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

Mr. McGuinty.

[David McGuinty, Liberal, Ottawa South, ON]

It's come to our attention in the official opposition that most of these changes are being proposed in every standing committee, Mr. Chair, by the government. Hats off to the government for being that organized. Congratulations.

I think our position here is that the motion as worded is sufficient. It is clear. If there are any fears to be allayed over time, I don't think we're bound by these. They can be revisited over time, Mr. Chair. If in three months' time, six months' time, or a year's time we find, or the government finds, the parliamentary secretary finds, or the government's whip's office finds that these are not working, these can be revisited at this committee.

I would implore that we move on here so that we can get down to substantive business. We would be supporting the reduced quorum motion as worded from the 39th Parliament. We arrived at that through practice. It seemed to work fine for a good balance of the 39th Parliament, and I've not heard anything yet to convince me as one member that this needs to be revisited.

I would suggest that we go back if we can—if I'm able to do this—and call the vote on the existing motion, so we can move on and get down to substantive business.

[The Chair, Conservative, James Bezan]

I still have speakers on the list for this motion, so I can't take the call.

Mr. Watson and Mr. Woodworth.