Environment Committee on June 13th, 2013

[Kevin McNamee]

It's important to clarify that it is the policy of the board that there's no drilling from the surface. When they put out a call for bids to an oil company...when they submit a bid, they cannot recommend or seek authorization to drill. It is a policy. This legislation changes that policy into a legislative prohibition.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

Okay.

Has there ever been drilling on the island?

[Kevin McNamee]

Yes, there has.

In the late 1960s and early 1970s there were approximately 10 wells drilled on Sable Island, including one in the middle. There were a number, I believe, on the west end of the island, and some of the remnants are still there. That's why one of the activities is still in here. This is to provide industry with access to those wellheads. What they do is cut them off below the surface, but because Sable Island is constantly shifting, it exposes those. The companies are still liable for anything that may happen as a result, so they need access to the island from time to time to check the status of those wellheads to see if any remedial action needs to be taken to ensure there is no impact on people's health, including visitors, as well as on the environment of the island.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

Is environmental remediation one of those activities that is a low-impact activity? That's what this is. This is basically an environmental—

[Kevin McNamee]

That's covered under one of the four items. The first one is to provide access to existing wellheads. That's the one that's covered there.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

In terms of the drilling that occurred in the sixties and seventies, what kind of environmental effects did that have, apart from a hole in the ground? We already know that.

[Kevin McNamee]

I'm not aware of what exact studies were done that looked at the impact of those particular things. I am aware they didn't find anything, hence those wells were abandoned.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

Okay.

In spite of that drilling, the ecological integrity of the area was still maintained. Is that correct? Is that fair?

[Kevin McNamee]

Certainly, when you listen to some of the presentations by a number of academics, including those at Dalhousie University, they have undertaken a fair amount of research. In fact, given the fact that Sable Island was quite settled from time to time, a number of exotic species were introduced. If anything, over the last few decades, Sable Island has seen its ecological integrity, if you will, restored. There's a lot less development and a lot less impact and changes.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

That's a really important point.

The environmental integrity of Sable Island has improved. By the directives under the National Park Reserve designation, even though the “high-level activities” are theoretically possible and probably wouldn't happen, nevertheless the low-impact designation, coupled with the improving ecological integrity of the island, results in a very good news story for Sable Island, doesn't it? The level of protection is actually increasing quite significantly.

[Alan Latourelle]

As I mentioned in my opening remarks, there are several conservation benefits clearly to the legislation and establishing it as a national park reserve.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

In terms of the potential drilling outside the zone—I happen to live next to a national park, so your comments, Mr. McNamee, regarding activities outside the park struck very close to home—I know that you can have human activity outside the park that is sustainable alongside a national park. A system like that can work very well.

In terms of the potential for drilling outside the one nautical mile zone and the potential horizontal drilling under the island, those wells go down many hundreds of metres, in fact thousands of metres, so what conceivable impact could that possibly have on Sable Island?

[Kevin McNamee]

Again, we need to point to the fact that it is the role of the Offshore Petroleum Board to look at these kinds of issues and be responsible for the drilling outside.

I would like to make the point, though, that from time to time, there are some environmental needs for seismic on the island. Part of what seismic does is to identify what they call “pressure steps”. As you go down through the surface and drill, not from Sable but from outside, the pressure within the structure, the formation that you're drilling through, changes. The purpose of seismic, in part, is to identify exactly where and what those pressure steps are. If in drilling you haven't identified the pressure steps, and industry hasn't taken the proper precautions based on informed information to put in place casings that have the right strength, you can have a drilling accident. The seismic information is important to industry to provide that certainty.

[Robert Sopuck, Conservative, Dauphin—Swan River—Marquette, MB]

That’s interesting. Thanks.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

We're a little over time there.

We're going to move now to Ms. Leslie and Madame Quach, who are sharing their time.

[Anne Minh-Thu Quach, NDP, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

I will be very brief because I just want to finish my question.

Mr. Latourelle, within those 60 hectares, are there areas where the ski centre in Jasper National Park would extend its activities? Have zones been identified where no activity is possible because there are wetlands?

Before giving the floor to Ms. Leslie, I have a second question for you.

Would this open the door to making changes to other parks which are under the purview of Parks Canada, and which would allow for other commercial activities or the expansion of existing ones?

[Alan Latourelle]

First, the lease will see the ski centre's area reduced by nearly 50 hectares, because of a significant presence of woodland caribou. Second, we will work with stakeholders on the master plan, which will propose various activities in those areas. We looked at everything from an ecological point of view, and this is a sector which is conducive to having activities. There will be an environmental impact assessment. So it's a little premature to tell you what kinds of activities will be allowed. We generally know what they will be, but the master plan will contain the specific projects.

[Anne Minh-Thu Quach, NDP, Beauharnois—Salaberry, QC]

Will this apply to other parks, as well?

[Alan Latourelle]

No.

[Megan Leslie, NDP, Halifax, NS]

I'm trying to make a decision here....

I said in my speech in the House that I want to support this legislation. I want to be a part of creating this park and seeing that this park is created, but I am taking my role as environment critic and as an opposition member of Parliament very seriously in trying to make that decision. I recognize that there is a majority in the House, but I still think it's important for us to take that opposition role seriously and to think critically about what to do with pieces of legislation. I want this bill to pass, but not at any cost.

What happens if this bill doesn't pass? What I see is that there is no protection for Sable. What I see is that there are existing drilling rights on the island right now. Sure, there's an agreement not to actually drill, but those rights exist.

Can you spell out for us what happens if this legislation doesn't pass? What risks are there?

[Alan Latourelle]

If the legislation doesn't pass—I'll speak practically, and then I'll give you my view as the CEO of Parks Canada—I think the current policy framework and governance structures would continue as we have them now. By policy, again, drilling is not permitted on the island, but it's by policy. So the bill clearly brings in a legislative tool to prohibit drilling. That's one aspect that I think is critical.

In terms of managing Sable Island for ecological integrity, because it is coming under the Canada National Parks Act as a national park reserve, clearly the obligations we have through our legislation to ensure that we maintain or restore the ecological integrity of the park is a benefit. We've seen that across our national parks system—that it would benefit Sable Island.

I think the other part of it is in terms of education and experience. How do we offer the experience? How do we do it responsibly? Again, that I see as a key benefit to Canadians. How do we bring the sum of the Parks Canada organization to really communicate and inspire Canadians about this amazing place? Again, it's not an environmental benefit, but I think it is an important societal benefit for Canadians across this great country of ours.

[Megan Leslie, NDP, Halifax, NS]

I mentioned in the early days there was an outcry, that oh my gosh, they're going to turn it into a theme park with roller coasters in the shapes of seals. When I'm talking to people in communities, that fear does not exist anymore. Again, that goes back to the good job you've done in building that trust. I don't think there is that fear.

But let's take the rest of the time to actually talk about what does happen here with the visitor experience. I know that there are—

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

You've got two seconds.

[Megan Leslie, NDP, Halifax, NS]

Oh, shoot.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

Go ahead. I'll give you 30 seconds.