Environment Committee on May 12th, 2015

[Isabelle Morin, NDP, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

You are saying that there aren't necessarily data indicating that there is too much ethylene glycol at present. Are data taken at the source to assess the environmental impact of that substance? Does Environment Canada have collection sources to verify that?

[Darren Goetze]

In fact, I would have to come back to you. I don't know if we are specifically collecting data around the airport. We have a very close cooperation with the Province of Quebec in terms of water quality sample collection. It may be that it's actually the Province of Quebec that is collecting in that area, and we'd need to consult with it on what its data is indicating. I could undertake to come back to you on that.

[Isabelle Morin, NDP, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

I would appreciate it if you could get back to us on that.

I'm not a regular member of this committee, so I will refer to the questions that have been suggested to us. As my colleague said, we are representatives, not experts.

Mr. Moffet, what steps have been taken to ensure the continuity of funding for monitoring systems, accountability and independence?

[John Moffet]

There are two issues there. One is funding. I believe the minister is going to be appearing in front of this committee within the next couple of weeks to address estimates. Questions on the government's decisions around overall funding are best addressed to the minister, I might say.

In terms of independence, some of the work that we support is, in fact, undertaken through independent bodies, but much of it, of course, we undertake ourselves or jointly with partners. In those cases I think the important features are the actual design of the monitoring—the water quality or water monitoring activities—so they adhere to standards that have been established within the scientific community to ensure that they're robust, that the results are transferable over time, and that they can stand up to external scrutiny. I think both of my colleagues can speak to the standards that the different monitoring activities are designed to adhere to.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

We're out of time, but if you want to respond, Geneviève, please do so very quickly.

[Geneviève Béchard]

We work with the World Meteorological Organization to establish international standards. As for steps related to water levels and things like that, we work with our American colleagues, and we use similar approaches. We also sit on our federal-provincial-territorial committee to use similar approaches across Canada. Essentially, we are ensuring that there is independence in using recognized scientific tools.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Toet, go ahead please.

[Lawrence Toet, Conservative, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

My colleague, Mrs. Ambler, was talking about the Great Lakes. Being from Manitoba, I am obviously concerned generally about all issues of water quality, but I would like to direct some of my questions to the Lake Winnipeg initiative and some of the work being done there.

I'm not sure, Ms. Béchard or Mr. Goetze, whether that falls under your purview. I was hoping you could give us an update on the scope of the initiative in the context both of the nature of the monitoring and also of the geographical area that's being monitored in the Lake Winnipeg initiative.

[Darren Goetze]

The scope, frankly, is enormous. Lake Winnipeg, of course, as I'm sure you are well aware, is a drainage basin that encompasses much of central Canada, from Lake of the Woods to the east, the Red River to the south, and the Saskatchewan rivers to the west. We are actively engaged in monitoring all of those major river systems in that basin to understand what is flowing into Lake Winnipeg. We work quite closely with the Province of Manitoba in monitoring the situation in Lake Winnipeg.

The key thing that we're working on in the lake, as you may be aware, is the issue of nutrients. We're also worried about algal blooms in Lake Winnipeg. We are contributing data on nutrients flowing into the lake from all of the various tributaries across the basin. We're also working to undertake research on the nature of the algal blooms and to understand through modelling efforts how we can mitigate nutrient levels in the lake to restore a healthy ecosystem.

[Lawrence Toet, Conservative, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

My understanding is that in 2012, with the renewal of the initiative, part of that process was going to shift the emphasis from understanding and monitoring the issues to actions to address the nutrient issues and loads in the lake.

I'm wondering if you could give us some idea of any progress in the actions that are going forward at this point in time, or when these actions are going to start to be implemented.

[Darren Goetze]

I will confess that I'm not an expert in the range of initiatives that are being undertaken, so I think we'd need to come back to the committee with a list. I know there's an extensive list of local initiatives that have been invested in to improve water quality and contribute to the aquatic ecosystem health of the lake.

What I can say is that as we think about water quality, particularly from a risk-based approach, one of the key things we're interested in is contributing to public policy solutions. We want to contribute the science necessary to demonstrate that action should be taken. Even if we're not the ones who ultimately take the action, we want to make sure that water managers are informed with good, robust science, so they can take action when the science warrants action being taken.

[Lawrence Toet, Conservative, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

I'm not sure if you're familiar with this, but there was a moratorium for many years in Manitoba on hog barn expansions, and a lot of that was tied to the Lake Winnipeg concerns. Now that moratorium has been partially lifted.

Are you aware if that was based on some of the science from monitoring activities that have been undertaken through the initiative, or was that a completely independent decision provincially? Do you have any sense of whether there's been any correlation of data that has backed that?

[Darren Goetze]

It was a provincial decision, and I'm not aware of the factors that were taken into consideration when the province made that decision.

[Lawrence Toet, Conservative, Elmwood—Transcona, MB]

The other question I have is regarding your transboundary partners.

Again, regarding the extension of the initiative, we talked about the transboundary partners. You mentioned the United States. A lot of the water is coming in from the States through the Red River. You also talked about Ontario, and I know there's work with Ontario, especially through Lake of the Woods and the water coming through there.

The other one that's not mentioned specifically in the initiative, but you did touch on it in your remarks, is Saskatchewan. We've seen a great increase in water flow from Saskatchewan through the Assiniboine basin, which will ultimately end up in Lake Winnipeg.

Is there any work being done in your assessment, your monitoring, to extend further into Saskatchewan as part of that basin and look at the water flow from there and the extent of its impact on Lake Winnipeg?

[Darren Goetze]

Water flow would be my colleague—

[John Moffet]

The department does participate in a number of water boards, which in some cases provide advisory services, but in some cases actually control water flow and participate in monitoring water quality, for example, at the point where water crosses a border.

Slide 15, for example, illustrates the Canada-U.S. boards that we participate in, including the Souris, the Red, and the Rainy-Lake of the Woods boards. Then, of course, there is also the Prairie Provinces Water Board that was formed under an agreement with Alberta, Saskatchewan, and Manitoba, which again controls flows across border, provides information on water quality at the borders, and which provides a forum for joint management of these issues more broadly.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

We'll have to move on to Mr. Choquette, for five minutes, please.

Thank you, Mr. Toet.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

As I mentioned earlier, this discussion is really very interesting and passionate, and I think we could easily devote four meetings to it. In that respect, I will put forward the following motion:

That the committee conduct a study on progress regarding the joint oil sands monitoring program, including hearing from witnesses from federally and provincially responsible agencies, as well as affected communities.

If my colleagues are in agreement, we could consider this motion later.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

Mr. Choquette, I think the position has been, and the rules suggest, that we need 48 hours' notice before motions are considered by the committee. We will consider this a notice of motion, and you're free to present it in writing.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Yes, this motion was tabled on Wednesday, February 5, 2014, but if Mr. Carrie agrees, we can consider it later, five minutes before the end of the meeting.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

Mr. Carrie.

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

I'm fine with that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

Can you discuss it?

[Colin Carrie, Conservative, Oshawa, ON]

We can at the end of it.

[The Chair, Conservative, Harold Albrecht]

Do you mean at the end of our meeting?