Environment Committee on May 1st, 2018

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

You're talking about the strategic plan that UNESCO directed.

Why did none of your federal agencies intervene in the hearings on the Site C dam to identify those before the project was approved?

[Hilary Geller]

That's a question that we'll need to get back to the member in writing.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Can you send it back, so all of us can read it?

[Hilary Geller]

Of course, yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Please send it to the clerk who will then distribute it to the committee.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

I am simply raising that issue, because over and over again the commissioner's reports are saying that, on biodiversity, the government likes to attend international meetings. It forms committees and so forth, but the commissioner is not seeing any action on the ground. One of those actions would have been, in the old days, 30 years ago, the federal government actually holding joint reviews, or appearing and providing testimony and research.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

We look forward to the response.

Mr. Fisher.

[Darren Fisher, Liberal, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thanks, folks, for being here.

Madam Chair, just to let you know, I'm going to split my time with Mr. Aldag because we're running out of time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Okay. I'll let you know at three minutes.

[Darren Fisher, Liberal, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

Sure. Thank you.

I guess my question would be for Rob, Kevin, or maybe even Hilary, but I think I'll lean toward Rob.

We did our report on protected areas, and we realized how difficult it is to hit our targets and our commitments for protected areas. We've heard today, as we hear all the time when we talk to government officials, about partnering with provinces, territories, and indigenous governments.

One of the specific recommendations in that report was to partner with municipalities in addition to provinces, territories, and indigenous governments, to find a way to utilize those generational opportunities to hit those targets. I'm thinking about the Blue Mountain—Birch Cove Wilderness Area in Halifax. That's a municipal park. Again, I call that a generational opportunity to acquire protected areas in the Halifax area that you can access on a city bus.

I know there's been no ask municipally, but I guess my question for you would be whether we are taking that recommendation seriously as a government. Are we looking at moving in that direction? Are we going to be partnering with municipalities in projects like that?

I'm not sure who wants to take that.

[Rob Prosper]

Thank you very much for the question.

With respect to an individual or specific place, I probably can't answer that, but one of the areas that the national advisory panel and the national steering committee looked at was not just large landscapes, but small landscapes. There was a special working group for municipalities that provided advice to the national steering committee on municipalities. That was driven largely by our experience in the Rouge National Urban Park, which is creating a stepping stone for a variety of Canadians, who otherwise wouldn't be able to get to conserved areas or to participate in conservation, to get their feet wet in a place that's accessible by GO train. We recognize the role that urban...and municipalities can play, and we did get some good advice from that municipal working group.

[Darren Fisher, Liberal, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

Thank you.

The Blue Mountain wilderness area is our Rouge, so I thank you for that answer.

I'll pass my time to Mr. Aldag.

[John Aldag, Liberal, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

I'm going to direct my questions to the Fisheries and Oceans representatives.

In the discussion with the commissioner I raised a question. In her response, she indicated that with the role that Fisheries and Oceans has of overseeing the public interest in protecting our wild fish stocks—particularly salmon on the west coast—and also the role of essentially being the champion for aquaculture, there is a risk of criticism.

Because we are being broadcast today, I want to give the department an opportunity to respond. Is this something that Canadians should be concerned about, or are you able to fulfill those those dual mandates within the department?

[Philippe Morel]

First, I would like to maybe explain a little bit more about how we manage aquaculture in Fisheries and Oceans. My sector manages the aquaculture program. What we do is develop, amend, and manage the regulations that manage the aquaculture sector. The science sector also provides some science advice on how we do those regulations and implement them.

It's important to note that our role is not to promote the industry; the industry does that itself. Because it's a shared jurisdiction, the provinces are the ones promoting the industry. I think one of the members in earlier discussion did mention the very aggressive role of some provinces in bringing new investments to their region. Newfoundland is one example. Nova Scotia is another. Our role is to develop and implement regulations that support the industry, so we have to make sure that our regulation is sustainable for industry and that it supports the growth of the industry.

[John Aldag, Liberal, Cloverdale—Langley City, BC]

All right. We're going to run out of time here.

I also want to ask briefly if you can provide a comment on the following. I know that Fisheries and Oceans was really decimated in 2012 with the budget cuts imposed by the Conservatives under their deficit reduction action plan. I was really pleased to see that although the commissioner pointed out there were some deficiencies in research in some key areas, the department does seem to be finally recovering from that.

Are you positioned now to move forward with an aggressive research program on the kind of work that needs to be done to give Canadians the confidence that we will have sustainable fish stocks and healthy populations? I would appreciate any comments on that. I heard Mr. Sopuck make a comment that we've had record Fraser River salmon runs, based on their policies, and yet the science programs were decimated. Do you have any comments on where you are now, to carry forward with the research programs?

[Philippe Morel]

I will share 30 seconds with my colleague, Wayne Moore.

The regulations that we have to manage the pesticides and the drugs in the ocean are very strict on the potential impact. They are done in a way that minimizes the impact on fish and habitat. Additionally, we will be working on the cumulative effect highlighted in the report.

Mr. Moore can tell you more about the science we do to protect wild fish.

[Wayne Moore, Director General, Strategic and Regulatory Science, Department of the Environment]

Thank you, Madam Chair, for the member's question.

I will highlight a couple of points. I think the reinvestments that have happened over the last few years have been really important, specifically with Pacific salmon. We have hired 29 new scientists in the Pacific region to work on this. We have an extensive set of work that has been done to date on aquaculture and the interaction with the wild fish, along six themes. That work is all on our website. People are free to see what work we've done in those areas, including related to the cumulative impact of pesticides.

I will leave it there, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

Thank you very much.

As the chair, I very rarely ask a question, but I really want to ask something in response to discussions that have been going on today.

I want to amplify the comments of Mr. Sopuck and also my colleagues on the Liberal side, who have mentioned that it is about bringing all partners to the table. Municipalities have a very strong role, and I'm glad to hear they are at the table.

What I reflected on as I was listening to your comments is that conservation authorities in Ontario are big holders of conservation land. You mentioned the public having a chance, through Rouge, to get to see conservation first-hand. I have to say, there's a lot of that activity going on, on conservation lands. I haven't heard conservation lands mentioned at all.

Can you tell me where conservation lands, especially in Ontario, are fitting into this work on target 1?

[Rob Prosper]

Sure.

One of the things we were tasked with by the federal, provincial, and territorial ministers was to look at the accounting of what type of conservation works. I think we're coming to the conclusion that we need to expand the role and recognition of those areas that contribute to the target, and start working. As I said, the transformative element of the pathway initiative is really a connected network of conserved areas, which will take many different forms. It includes industry, agriculture, conservation authorities, and so on. It's going to be this collective that will make the difference.

[The Chair, Liberal, Deb Schulte]

I'm very glad to hear that.

Thank you very much to all of you for being here today and answering our questions.

I want to remind the committee that we're back on Bill C-69 on Thursday with the minister and the departments.

The meeting is adjourned.