Could I just add something really quickly? I know you're at the end of your time.
When I came in to run PAC in 2006-07, there were 175 packaging converters. Packaging converters are those who take raw materials and convert them into a box, a glass or a can. They manufacture packaging. Today we have about 75, and that is because of the fact that most of it has moved offshore. We have flexible packaging, which is a potato chip bag and things like that. Most of the companies that produce those in Canada are small, privately held family-owned operators. The major producers of these materials are coming in primarily from the U.S. They all had big operations in Canada, but they no longer have them. They've all backed out.