Evidence of meeting #71 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was places.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte
That was excellent.
We've just finished our rounds. I am seeing a little bit more time. I needed about 10 minutes at the end to give you some information that I want you to consider for the next meeting. If you want, we could do a very short two, two, and two. That's really short, which means your questions have to be concise. It's just a wrap-up. Is that an opportunity that people want? Yes?
Okay. One thing I want to ask the committee before I start is that, we had talked before about using social media. I would like to take a picture of the committee in action, just so that we can then send it through and they could put it up, just saying we're doing this study, letting people know out there on the social media started for committees that we're doing this study. Does anybody have a problem with that? We'll just be in the corner to take a picture, as we're doing this next section. Is there any objection?
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Deb Schulte
Great. Thank you very much. I think we're good with that.
We'll get started. Should we go backwards around? Wayne, you were in the middle of it. Do you want to have two minutes? Then we'll go back around that way and end with the Liberals.
NDP
Wayne Stetski NDP Kootenay—Columbia, BC
I have a quick question for Martin. Were you one of the discoverers of the long-lost Franklin expedition ships?
As an Individual
I was not a discoverer, but yes, I was overseeing the program.
NDP
Wayne Stetski NDP Kootenay—Columbia, BC
That agreement stipulates that the British government agrees to transfer ownership of all recovered artifacts to Canada, other than those significant to the Royal Navy or any gold. At the same time, Nunavut has claimed ownership under a provincial-federal agreement and Canadian taxpayers spent millions of dollars to recover those artifacts. Despite all of that, the current government, apparently, was handing over the artifacts to Britain.
Are you concerned about the future ownership and display of these and other artifacts?
As an Individual
I won't be able to speak to what is currently happening with respect to the discussions between Great Britain and Canada. However, under international military law, all military vessels and their contents belong to the country of origin.
As an Individual
Correct. This is no different from anywhere else in the world. Joëlle could probably speak to where we're at.
Vice-President, Indigenous Affairs and Cultural Heritage Directorate, Parks Canada Agency
Yes. As you know, there is an MOU from 1997, where Britain has agreed that they would be transferring the wrecks and the contents of the wrecks to Canada should they be found. Negotiations are under way in order to honour this MOU.
NDP
Wayne Stetski NDP Kootenay—Columbia, BC
Without that agreement, the general understanding is that the ships go back to the country of origin.
As an Individual
They can remain where they are, but they'd belong to the country of origin.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
Let's talk about funding again. Funding has ranged anywhere from $1 million to $10 million over the last two years.
What's the ideal level of funding?
Chair, Heritage Designations and Programs, Historic Sites and Monuments Board of Canada
Who's to say, but I would say, given reality, since the government has established it at $10 million and did it for two years, I think that level should be maintained. In other words, it would be nice if it were higher. If it's to go lower, I think all the good things that we've talked about, and spinoffs, and the leverage, and doing more in rural areas, and all the rest of it, get contradicted. I think maintaining and extending is very significant, and must be done. I really think that's important because I saw what happened when the previous program went from about $6 million or $7 million, down to $1 million. It was very bad, and very discouraging throughout the heritage community right across the country.
Conservative
Vice-President, Indigenous Affairs and Cultural Heritage Directorate, Parks Canada Agency
I would only say that the program has been consistently oversubscribed. I gave you some numbers in my opening remarks....
Vice-President, Indigenous Affairs and Cultural Heritage Directorate, Parks Canada Agency
Since 2009, and again the program has had different levels of funding throughout those years, so I would say it fluctuates, but it could be up to 2.5 times oversubscribed. On average, that's what we've seen. Right now, at the $10-million level, we receive maybe under $20 million in proposals, so there are great needs out there.
Conservative
Ed Fast Conservative Abbotsford, BC
Have you caught up in terms of maintenance and repair of the historic sites that are under your control?
Vice-President, Indigenous Affairs and Cultural Heritage Directorate, Parks Canada Agency
Again, the investment of $3.6 billion will help us tremendously to do that, and we'll continue. Again, it's an ongoing thing. As I mentioned, we have ongoing assessments of our cultural resources, and then we continue investing over time. This investment is not going to be the end of it. We will have to continue securing long-term sources of finance to maintain just the assets that Parks currently have.
Liberal
Geng Tan Liberal Don Valley North, ON
I'm new to this committee.
Madam Montminy, you mentioned in your conclusion that one of the challenges of heritage preservation is called the environmental process. What percentage of heritage sites is lost due to this single factor? How much funding is necessary to effectively address this kind of challenge?