Evidence of meeting #2 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 43rd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was regulations.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Chief Enforcement Officer, Enforcement Branch, Department of the Environment
I don't have them with me or by memory. I'm sorry.
NDP
Laurel Collins NDP Victoria, BC
Not to worry.
My next question is around fossil fuel subsidies, particularly the lack of transparency in the approach to phasing out fossil fuel subsidies. I think ECCC identified four subsidies and identified them as efficient.
I'm also curious about the definition of efficient and inefficient, and whether or not you have taken into account the Auditor General's recommendations for a more comprehensive analysis of fossil fuel subsidies, including EDC and TMX, and if you're considering using our climate commitments and defining efficient and inefficient in line with those goals for net zero by 2050.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of the Environment
The issue of fossil fuel subsidies and the examination of them—both from a tax side and a non-tax side—comes from a G20 commitment that was made a number of years ago to identify and phase out inefficient fossil fuel subsidies by 2025. A framework was developed by our colleagues in the ministry of finance to do that analysis, and the application of that framework has led to eight tax initiatives being phased out over the last decade or so.
On the non-tax side, Environment Canada has been leading that work, in co-operation with a number of other departments. We applied the same framework and, as the member says, identified four non-tax fossil fuel subsidies that were determined not to be inefficient—if that's not a double negative.
As a result of two reviews by the commissioner of the environment and sustainable development, there is still work under way on this. The previous minister retained Michael Horgan, a former deputy minister of environment and finance, to have a look at the framework, consult with Canadians and provide some recommendations, taking into account the context as it has evolved since the time of the G20 commitment.
The short answer to the question is that we are still considering it, with the advice of Mr. Horgan, in light of the CESD recommendation, and of course the government's commitment to net zero by 2050.
I think it's fair to say that the surrounding context has evolved, and we're still considering how we may need to evolve with it.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Yasmin Ratansi
Thank you.
We now go to the second round of questioning, with five minutes.
Mr. Redekopp.
Conservative
Brad Redekopp Conservative Saskatoon West, SK
I have several questions regarding greenhouse gas pollution. I'm not sure who can answer them.
I'm looking for some insight into the deliberations inside the department when it came to drafting the legislation. I'm not talking about the political advice you may have received or given. Specifically, I'd like to know what discussions you had regarding the disparity between urban and rural areas of the country, and how the carbon tax would impact them differently.
Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment
In the context of putting legislation in place, the department has a broad responsibility to undertake a comprehensive assessment of the potential implications, not just in terms of regional disparity, but also in terms of issues of gender and the like. Analysis is undertaken to support the drafting of the legislation, and considerations are laid out with respect to that.
If you look at the actual development of the legislation itself—
Conservative
Brad Redekopp Conservative Saskatoon West, SK
Sorry to interrupt. I kind of understand that, but specifically on rural and urban.... Was work done in that area?
Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment
As I mentioned, there was specific work done. There are elements within the legislation itself that reflect some of the ways the government decided it wanted to help address that. For instance, with respect to farmers, there are some specific exemptions that relate to their considerations.
In terms of the way in which we manage the revenues and the return of the revenues, there are specific considerations given for residents of small communities in rural areas, particularly in recognition of their special needs.
I'll turn to my colleague, Judy Meltzer, who is the director general of the carbon market bureau, for further elaboration on this.
Judy Meltzer Director General, Carbon Pricing Bureau, Department of the Environment
Thank you very much for the question.
With respect to the Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act specifically, consideration was given under of part 1 of the fuel charge. I should note that it was Finance Canada that led the development and the implementation of part 1, along with the Canada Revenue Agency.
There are exemptions for farmers, in terms of coverage. In jurisdictions where it applies, the federal fuel charge does not apply to biological emissions from livestock, or to gasoline or diesel used on farms in trucks and farm machinery. Similarly, for the related policy, in terms of the return of direct proceeds from the fuel charge, in jurisdictions where it is returned directly—primarily to households—there is an increasing 10% supplement for rural areas. There is a front-end and a back-end consideration of rural communities.
Conservative
Brad Redekopp Conservative Saskatoon West, SK
Were there work products related to this issue inside the department?
Director General, Carbon Pricing Bureau, Department of the Environment
I would point to the consultation period. Draft versions of the legislation were posted for consultation on January 1, 2018. There was significant engagement through the process of developing both the legislation and related regulations with a wide range of stakeholders, including from the agricultural sector. We continue to be very engaged with the agricultural sector. We developed, for example, the federal carbon offset system.
Conservative
Director General, Carbon Pricing Bureau, Department of the Environment
I would point explicitly to the details of how this is implemented for rural areas. I'd point explicitly to the legislation and the regulations. There are also some products that are in the public domain that certainly elaborate on that relief, so we'd be happy to share that with you.
Conservative
Brad Redekopp Conservative Saskatoon West, SK
If you could provide that to the committee, that would be good.
Is three weeks a reasonable time frame?
Director General, Carbon Pricing Bureau, Department of the Environment
Yes, it is.
Conservative
Brad Redekopp Conservative Saskatoon West, SK
Thank you.
Very quickly, in the gazetting process for the regulations, did you receive submissions from the provinces?
Director General, Carbon Pricing Bureau, Department of the Environment
With respect to the regulations for...?
Conservative
Director General, Carbon Pricing Bureau, Department of the Environment
Finance Canada was responsible for part 1 of the Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act, so I can't speak to the fuel charge specifically.
I can say that with respect to the publication of the output-based pricing system regulations, under part 2 of the Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act, which was published in June 2019, we certainly received input from provinces. Equally relevant, we were engaged with provinces through the years while we developed the legislation and regulations.
Liberal
Liberal
Raj Saini Liberal Kitchener Centre, ON
Good morning, everybody. It's great to have you here.
I want to go back to last summer. There was an issue, as you're well aware, with our offloading some garbage to the Philippines. I received a lot of emails and letters from constituents regarding that issue.
There has been some concern with Canada offloading some garbage to developing countries. What is the department currently doing to prevent waste like this from being exported to other countries, and what are we doing to better manage our waste and ensure that it's sustainably disposed of?
Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment
Thank you very much for that question.
In the context of the earlier issue, when the waste was brought to the Philippines, we subsequently made an amendment to our regulations to put in place a requirement that where a jurisdiction defines a waste as hazardous, even if it's not captured under our regulations as being hazardous, we will consider it hazardous and then subject to the same requirements and provisions that hazardous wastes are.
That means they are required to obtain a permit from us. In order for us to issue a permit, we reach out to the country they're exporting to and where the final disposal will occur. We look to obtain prior informed consent, which is also part of the provisions of the Basel Convention. Once we have the prior informed consent, then the permit will be issued and the waste will be tracked.
The other thing I should note is that for countries that are not members of the Basel Convention—for us, our big exporter is the United States—we have a memorandum of understanding so that we put in place the like provisions with them as well.
Liberal
Raj Saini Liberal Kitchener Centre, ON
Have we agreed to the Basel Convention? Are we part of that dialogue? I know we waited a bit to sign that, so are we a signatory to that?