Evidence of meeting #37 for Environment and Sustainable Development in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was chair.
A video is available from Parliament.
Émilie Thivierge
Mr. Chair, if I may interrupt, I believe you said that G-11 was negatived.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
Oh. I meant that it was carried. I'm sorry. It's been a long day.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
Ms. May, you have 60 seconds, please. Then we have to move on.
Green
Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC
I'll use the 60 seconds, Mr. Chair, to ask this committee to read its own motion by which I am compelled to be here. It says that I am to be allowed to speak to every one of my amendments. That is a rule that has been observed by chairs in other committees.
Clearly, the amendment that just carried, G-11, speaks to some of the same areas but not with the same focus relating to ensuring that there be additional measures taken with the probability of achieving goals. It's a different turn of phrase from that used in Ms. Saks' amendment.
I believe my 60 seconds are likely up. Again, if you hadn't passed this motion, I wouldn't be here. If you hadn't passed your motion, I'd have more rights to present at report stage in the House of Commons.
Thank you.
NDP
Taylor Bachrach NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Mr. Chair, I believe I spoke to this amendment prior, but I'll just read it into the record for anyone who's following along online.
Ms. Collins moves to amend clause 14 of Bill C-12 by adding after line 11 on page 6 the following:
(3) Any progress report relating to 2030 must include an update on the progress that has been made towards achieving the interim greenhouse gas emissions objective for 2026.
I believe it's fairly self-explanatory. It definitely strengthens the bill to have the 2026 objective in there. This simply ensures that the progress reports, as we discussed earlier, reference progress towards that interim objective.
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Conservative
Brad Redekopp Conservative Saskatoon West, SK
Mr. Chair, I had to pre-emptively raise my hand so that you didn't miss me while I was trying to figure out a few things.
Is this redundant, given the previous changes we've made to the reporting? I was just looking that up. It seems as though we already covered off the interim reporting with the reports in 2023, 2025 and 2027.
Perhaps Mr. Moffet or Mr. Ngan could explain that a bit better.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment
I don't think it's redundant. The previous amendment added new progress reports before 2030. Without this amendment, those progress reports would report on progress towards the 2030 target. This amendment clarifies that, among other things, those reports also have to include reporting on progress towards the 2026 interim objective.
Conservative
Brad Redekopp Conservative Saskatoon West, SK
Did we not have a big discussion about exactly this point, though, and the question that they would be reporting back on that? We also had the discussion about how many months it took to get the data from 2026, etc.
Perhaps the lateness of the day is causing my brain to miss the point here.
Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment
I thought the discussion was about our ability to report definitively about attainment of the 2026 objective, whereas this amendment is clear that the requirement is to report on progress towards.
Conservative
Brad Redekopp Conservative Saskatoon West, SK
I think in that discussion, though, we did discuss that these interim reports would be addressing the 2026 targets. Yes, we did talk a lot about [Technical difficulty—Editor] the final targets, or interim or whatever.
Perhaps others can shed some light on this.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Francis Scarpaleggia
My system is very strange. It's showing Mr. Bachrach, but then I see Madam Pauzé.
Mr. Bachrach, I believe you were first.
NDP
Taylor Bachrach NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I'll be very brief, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Redekopp is correct that we did just have this discussion, but in having that discussion, we were referencing this amendment, which hadn't yet come to the floor. I think that might be the source of the confusion. We did have quite a discussion, and voted on language that required this amendment, but this amendment had not yet come up for a vote.
NDP
Taylor Bachrach NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I don't know if I've clarified anything, but there you have it.
Bloc
Monique Pauzé Bloc Repentigny, QC
I'm not asking for clarification, but I want to remind you that an objective isn't a target. We are still going to vote in favour of the amendment, but I would like to point out that the amendment still doesn't say anything about a target.
Conservative
Dan Albas Conservative Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Bachrach raised an interesting point, because sometimes we think that everyone who is watching right now has watched the entire presentation from our first hearing up until now.
I'm going to ask Mr. Moffet a couple of questions, and I'm sure Mr. Moffet will be relatively brief.
In regard to the interim greenhouse gas emissions objective, what would be in that? There's no definition in the bill.
Director General, Horizontal Policy, Engagement and Coordination, Department of the Environment
If I may, it would be similar to the milestone target of a specific level of emissions.
Conservative
Dan Albas Conservative Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC
Mr. Moffet, you had said previously that it would include a number, but it would not be because it's prescribed exactly what a target is under the act. It's a very different thing, is it not?
Assistant Deputy Minister, Environmental Protection Branch, Department of the Environment
What I explained previously, or tried to explain, was not so much that it's different in form from a target, but that a target in this bill comes with various obligations with respect to reporting, etc.
Conservative
Dan Albas Conservative Central Okanagan—Similkameen—Nicola, BC
Could you explain what the obligations are under the target regime that was originally proposed in Bill C-12, and what the interim greenhouse gas emissions objectives are in terms of obligations?